Lallemand Verdant IPA Ale

[sykesey]

You’ve gone downhill over the years

Yes, yes i have

 

[Shenanigans]

Might order a pack of this with my next online order.
Scanning through the comments on here it should be good yeast for top cropping so it should be easy to reuse and I'll only order one pack.
Is the general consesus that it's the 1318 strain or it is signifficantly different?
I will try it for NEIPAs and English ales.
Maybe a Timothy Taylor's Landlord clone as someone said it is like 1469.

 

[sykesey]

Might order a pack of this with my next online order.
Scanning through the comments on here it should be good yeast for top cropping so it should be easy to reuse and I'll only order one pack.
Is the general consesus that it's the 1318 strain or it is signifficantly different?
I will try it for NEIPAs and English ales.
Maybe a Timothy Taylor's Landlord clone as someone said it is like 1469.

I've done a neipa a while back with BSI London ale iii I 'borrowed' via top crop out of the blowoff from a local commercial brewery and verdant was very similar in behaviour and flavour.

I got tons of apricot and vanilla, but I think that may have been the fact I underpitched so much (half an 11g pack in 20l of 1060 wort) and pushed the temp to 22c.

Haven't used the 1469 but fair to say that those yeast strains wouldn't be too far apart given the original source of la3/the verdant isolate was boddingtons (IIRC, Northern Brewer feel free to correct me, mate!). Should still work pretty well as an general estery english ale yeast, far better flavour profile IMO than s-04.

If you don't want the big apricot notes and more of a clean profile, probably stick with a standard pitch rate or even 2 packs and keep the temp lower.

 

[Shenanigans]

I've done a neipa a while back with BSI London ale iii I 'borrowed' via top crop out of the blowoff from a local commercial brewery and verdant was very similar in behaviour and flavour.

I got tons of apricot and vanilla, but I think that may have been the fact I underpitched so much (half an 11g pack in 20l of 1060 wort) and pushed the temp to 22c.

Haven't used the 1469 but fair to say that those yeast strains wouldn't be too far apart given the original source of la3/the verdant isolate was boddingtons (IIRC, Northern Brewer feel free to correct me, mate!). Should still work pretty well as an general eatery english ale yeast, far better flavour profile IMO than s-04.

If you don't want the big apricot notes and more of a clean profile, probably stick with a standard pitch rate or even 2 packs and keep the temp lower.

Thanks for the feedback.
A few esters would be welcome as long as it doesn't give off some weird flavours.
My 1318 is on it 5th generation so almost time to buy a new pack of something for NEIPAs.
This cost about 1/3 of the price so why not

For the first use I will use one pack on a NEIPA and harvest it before dry hopping.
Then for the English Ale make a decent sized starter and let her rip uncontrolled in my basement at 18oC ambient which will probably be a few degrees higher in the FV.
Maybe I'll do a split batch with US-05 then I will have some kind of control point to see what it brings to the party at those temperatures.

 

[BolgBeorach]

Brewed up an IPA with this last Sunday. People aren't exaggerating about the Krausen. First time I've ever needed a blowoff tube. Fun evening cleaning yeast gunk off the side of the FV! But I'll save the yeast from the blowoff for the next batch. In any case, there was a lovely smell coming from the airlock - distinctly tropical. Looking forward to seeing how the beer turns out.

 

[ebbelwoi]

I'm on a mission tonight to polish off my first keg of my first attempt with Verdant. It was an APA a 90/7/3 MO/carahell/melanoidin grain bill, 60m mash at 64C, and 20m additions of Centennial and Mosaic, then a 45m hopstand of Amarillo, Centennial and Mosaic. OG 1.052, FG 1.013, ferm temp 22C/72F-ish. No dry hop... it's not really my style, and for this beer, I really wanted to harvest the yeast, as this particular yeast is a bit tough to come by in my neck of the woods.

My verdict: it makes a good beer.

It was actually a Valentine's Day present for my wife, who loves pale ales. I'm pretty happy with the beer, especially the aroma. The beer came out a little drier than expected, though, so I'm greeted with this wonderful aroma, but it doesn't come through in the flavor. I guess I'll mash higher next time, maybe ditch the 3% melanoidin for 15% Munich, and maybe dry hop as well.

As for my wife, she's looking forward to the warmer weather, so I can use Voss again. She really digs that orange.

 

[ebbelwoi]

Also: I didn't notice any vanilla. I fermented maybe 9L in a 12L fermenter, and it came close to hitting the top. After a krausen developed, I went with open fermentation (covered with saran wrap) until the krausen started to dissipate.

 

[moreb33rplz]

Brewing beer for a valentine day present? I gotta try that

 

[ebbelwoi]

 

[tyrub42]

Any issue with building a starter from a single packet? I'd rather not buy 3-4 packets for a 15-20 gallon batch.

Nope no issues at all with this or any other dey yeast in a starter. I'd recommend it given the low cell count they claim and the higher price per packet compared to other dry yeasts

 

[tyrub42]

Also if anyone is interested I've made a British Brown Ale with coffee/cinnamon/lactose with this yeast, and friends made an NEIPA with it. In both beers, the yeast performed pretty much identically to London iii, so I imagine that the rumors are true

 

[Shenanigans]

Also if anyone is interested I've made a British Brown Ale with coffee/cinnamon/lactose with this yeast, and friends made an NEIPA with it. In both beers, the yeast performed pretty much identically to London iii, so I imagine that the rumors are true

Thanks for the feedback.
I'd also be interested in using it for an English IPA.
I found a recipe that calls for London Ale 1028 so if using Verdant I might have to keep the temperature in check for that style though as fruity is not really desired.
I could of course sub with the WLP007 I have but it seems like I'm using that yeast for every English style beer at the moment

 

[tyrub42]

Thanks for the feedback.
I'd also be interested in using it for an English IPA.
I found a recipe that calls for London Ale 1028 so if using Verdant I might have to keep the temperature in check for that style though as fruity is not really desired.
I could of course sub with the WLP007 I have but it seems like I'm using that yeast for every English style beer at the moment

I think either would do well in that style but honestly I'd go with the 007 also

 

[Miraculix]

Just got some info from the DHL branch that my parcel with malt from the UK is still sitting at their storage, together with boxes, sent as far back as January. So as this one won't make it to me till the weekend (I wonder if the Imperial yeast pub will still be valid after that one month DHL storage time....), I will test the verdant not in a bitter, but in an AK instead.

I think this will be good!

I'll let you know how it goes.

 

[beervoid]

Just got some info from the DHL branch that my parcel with malt from the UK is still sitting at their storage, together with boxes, sent as far back as January. So as this one won't make it to me till the weekend (I wonder if the Imperial yeast pub will still be valid after that one month DHL storage time....), I will test the verdant not in a bitter, but in an AK instead.

I think this will be good!

I'll let you know how it goes.

Just make a starter and you should be fine

 

[Miraculix]

Just make a starter and you should be fine

I know.... But I won't!

Call me danger!

 

[tbaldwin000]

First time I used this yeast, great result. 9 Days in fermenter no diacetyl notes. 13L. batch NEIPA (galaxy/motueka/wakatu), awesome peach/citrus notes.
I thought standard New England yeast was discontinued here, in Europe. Anyone sees the difference?

Verdant IPA is 1000% just an isolate of London Ale III. This is confirmed by the brewery themselves in a video with Lallemand.

New England is 1000% an isolate of Conan, I have had that on good authority from numerous breweries in the UK who have trialled it in place of Conan on the advice of Lallemand, though I don't think it has been publicly confirmed.

 

[tyrub42]

Verdant IPA is 1000% just an isolate of London Ale III. This is confirmed by the brewery themselves in a video with Lallemand.

New England is 1000% an isolate of Conan, I have had that on good authority from numerous breweries in the UK who have trialled it in place of Conan on the advice of Lallemand, though I don't think it has been publicly confirmed.

Any idea if those breweries have reported the NE to perform just like Conan? Keep wanting to try it but feedback is way more mixed compared to Verdant. I love Conan for, if nothing else, the improved attenuation and reasonable Krausen compared to London iii

 

[CascadesBrewer]

Verdant IPA is 1000% just an isolate of London Ale III. This is confirmed by the brewery themselves in a video with Lallemand.

Well...I am pretty sure they said they started with a London Ale III strain and this is based off their house strain that, after many generations, has some unique characters. I am not sure that means "1000% just an isolate".

I just ordered a pack myself from MoreBeer. The NEIPA I made with 1318 has been my favorite. I have a few strains of yeast I harvest and repitch, but a NEIPA is not the best beer to harvest yeast from. I am hoping to just keep some packs of Verdant dry yeast on hand.

I have a pack of the New England Dry as well. I am hoping to split a batch and try them both.

 

[Shenanigans]

I have a few strains of yeast I harvest and repitch, but a NEIPA is not the best beer to harvest yeast from. I am hoping to just keep some packs of Verdant dry yeast on hand.

I agree it's not the best style of beer to harvest from. What I normally do for liquid yeast is from the first pitch onwards I make a bigger than needed starter and keep some of that. For the next batch then make another big starter from this and keep doing that. So the yeast is very clean has never touched any hopped wort. Also it's a mix of all the different characters of the yeast. If you keep harvesting by top cropping then you are just selecting the yeast that tend to be at the top or the other way around if you take some from the bottom. For the Verdant I will top crop for the first generation as I wont be making a starter but after that then I will do what I do for the liquid yeast, if that makes sense

 

[tbaldwin000]

Any idea if those breweries have reported the NE to perform just like Conan? Keep wanting to try it but feedback is way more mixed compared to Verdant. I love Conan for, if nothing else, the improved attenuation and reasonable Krausen compared to London iii

I have spoken to a fair few brewers who have used the dried Conan, and had plenty of beer made from it. I have also used it myself. It's definitely possible to get the Conan character from it, but if wet Conan isolates can be a bit unpredictable, then the dry format is predictable but not in a desirable way. It has a really, really low packaged cell count. They had a great deal of trouble getting a good cell count when drying it. That being the case it is really sluggish in generation 1, but behaves more like wet Conan in generation 2 onwards...but then you're back to handling wet yeast and some of the benefit disappears. I don't use it any more, I let WLP095 scratch my occasional Burlington itch.

Well...I am pretty sure they said they started with a London Ale III strain and this is based off their house strain that, after many generations, has some unique characters. I am not sure that means "1000% just an isolate".

Well, I can't be bothered to debate the meaning of isolate, but it is just London Ale III that went for a few generations and as a result took on some slight mutations. It's about as different from LAIII as London Fog is (another isolate of the same strain), it certainly does have a slightly more sweet yoghurt/apricot character than LAIII.

 

[tyrub42]

I have spoken to a fair few brewers who have used the dried Conan, and had plenty of beer made from it. I have also used it myself. It's definitely possible to get the Conan character from it, but if wet Conan isolates can be a bit unpredictable, then the dry format is predictable but not in a desirable way. It has a really, really low packaged cell count. They had a great deal of trouble getting a good cell count when drying it. That being the case it is really sluggish in generation 1, but behaves more like wet Conan in generation 2 onwards...but then you're back to handling wet yeast and some of the benefit disappears. I don't use it any more, I let WLP095 scratch my occasional Burlington itch.

Well, I can't be bothered to debate the meaning of isolate, but it is just London Ale III that went for a few generations and as a result took on some slight mutations. It's about as different from LAIII as London Fog is (another isolate of the same strain), it certainly does have a slightly more sweet yoghurt/apricot character than LAIII.

That is great info, thanks so much! I tend to build starters even with dry yeast, so the cell count isn't much of an issue (also since I know about it in advance). Bummer about generation one but that definitely explains the mixed reviews. I could see using gen 1 in a more traditional English ale and then using that slurry to make some hoppy stuff once it starts acting like itself again. Over here in Taiwan it's so much easier to grab a packet of this than to order the liquid and wait the weeks or months for it. Thanks again

 

[TBA]

In the Lallemand video they speak of top cropping. I never did that before using Verdant. Now I do it all the time. This is so much better than collecting the slurry with all the dry hops in it. I’ve gone 6 generations this way with no issues. Love this yeast!

 

[stickyfinger]

Another great way to get yeast with IPAs is to ferment out the IPA and then rack it to a keg with a floating dip tube and dry hop in there, then transfer it to a serving keg. I like being able to mix the hops around in the keg several times per day for 2 days. Then, you can just save all of the clean yeast slurry from the bottom of your fermentation vessel.

 

[TBA]

Do you cold crash before transfer to dry hop keg? If so what temperature?

 

[stickyfinger]

yeah, i went down to 35F for 7 days this time. the US-05 was getting pretty clear. The Verdant was a little more hazy. I like IPA without much yeast in it. I've used 50F when I dry hop at 50F and it works ok too.

 

[crusader1612]

For those unaware.
Mangrove Jacks have released a similar yeast to either this or the New England strain.

I used it on the weekend in a variation of Hop Hands, to see the result.
Will report back

FYI the yeast is M66 Hophead Ale

 

[duncan_disorderly]

Just dropping by via my keyboard in England to say i am liking this Verdant yeast, the best dry yeast I have come across for my purposes so far, in terms of usefulness across the range of beers I brew and drink the most, which means English ales of all colours and American influenced versions of them (I brew Belgian stuff too).

It is a very vigorous yeast, it gets going very quickly and works quickly, drops clear for me and the top cropped yeast is super vital. Has the feel of a liquid yeast. I get close to 75% attenuation every time, and the beers all possess a very nice texture, and good healthy foam, and a depth of flavour. I've done English and American versions of pales, brown ales, red ales and porter with Verdant and all turned out really well. I'm drinking a splendid American Brown ale at the minute.

The only slight caveat I have is that in one of the two very pale English ales i've made the apricot from the yeast was a bit fulsome, and influence the beer a tad too much, it was a bit of an apricot smoothie. Temp control might sort that out. The other is great, very true to style, a simple ordinary bitter with just pale malt and English hops.

I'd be interested to hear the thoughts of people who have brewed English pales/bitters/ESBs with Verdant.

 

[beervoid]

Just dropping by via my keyboard in England to say i am liking this Verdant yeast, the best dry yeast I have come across for my purposes so far, in terms of usefulness across the range of beers I brew and drink the most, which means English ales of all colours and American influenced versions of them (I brew Belgian stuff too).

It is a very vigorous yeast, it gets going very quickly and works quickly, drops clear for me and the top cropped yeast is super vital. Has the feel of a liquid yeast. I get close to 75% attenuation every time, and the beers all possess a very nice texture, and good healthy foam, and a depth of flavour. I've done English and American versions of pales, brown ales, red ales and porter with Verdant and all turned out really well. I'm drinking a splendid American Brown ale at the minute.

The only slight caveat I have is that in one of the two very pale English ales i've made the apricot from the yeast was a bit fulsome, and influence the beer a tad too much, it was a bit of an apricot smoothie. Temp control might sort that out. The other is great, very true to style, a simple ordinary bitter with just pale malt and English hops.

I'd be interested to hear the thoughts of people who have brewed English pales/bitters/ESBs with Verdant.

You think the apricot came out cause it was fermented too hot?

 

[duncan_disorderly]

You think the apricot came out cause it was fermented too hot?

I don't think so, I don't have a fermenting fridge but my FV was in a cool place in a cool house in a cool town in winter. Ambient 14 to 18C. Fermentation will have lifted the beer above that obviously. Maybe 21C tops I would imagine.