New England IPA "Northeast" style IPA

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At one time, you were preferring the higher sulfate to chloride ratio. Have your tastes changed?
I have not even brewed this beer in 3 months...... Just did it that way this time. Honestly, I just don't think there is much difference overall. I did three of these at one time with 140:70, 70:140 and 120:120....... they were hard to tell apart and I knew what I was looking for.
 
Made it this far. Creeping up on a week. Should I buy a HD filter and put to keg? Let it drop out, 2 weeks maybe? Any thoughts?
20181023_202306.jpeg
 
I cold crash my NEIPAs at day 8, keg at day 9 and force carb to drink on day 10

I have now made about 15 beers of this with very good success, and have noted a very significant taste difference between the yeast strains, with the yeast bay vermont IPA being SUPER mango(ish)/guava flavored (to me) and the wyeast 1318 london ale 3 being a good compromise of still having similar but not as prominante type of flavors just not quite as "juicy".

I use the same exact grain bill and water additions for every single one, i change the hops slightly, but i usually do 2 of each exact recipies using the 2 different strains. I really wanny get my hnds on some oly tropical ipa yeast tho.
 
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I cold crash my NEIPAs at day 8, keg at day 9 and force carb to drink on day 10

I have now made about 15 beers of this with very good success, and have noted a very significant taste difference between the yeast strains, with the yeast bay vermont IPA being SUPER mango(ish)/guava flavored (to me) and the wyeast 1318 london ale 3 being a good compromise of still having similar but not as prominante type of flavors just not quite as "juicy".

I use the same exact grain bill and water additions for every single one, i change the hops slightly, but i usually do 2 of each exact recipies using the 2 different strains. I really wanny get my hnds on some oly tropical ipa yeast tho.
Made it this far. Creeping up on a week. Should I buy a HD filter and put to keg? Let it drop out, 2 weeks maybe? Any thoughts?
View attachment 594257

some will lash out at me in anger, but if you want to rack warm, you can do this. water purge the keg and then get your racking cane ready. right as you are ready to rack, take the poppet out of the out post on the keg and screw the main fitting back on. take the spring and "poppet" out of the ball lock QD and connect it to your racking tubing. let a little beer waste out of the line and then quickly pop it onto the post. when the keg is full, put the poppet back into the keg beer out fitting. there is a little more oxygen exposure doing this probably, but it doesn't seem to cause problems from what i've seen. i tried different filters and such and none of it consistently worked for me.

if you go the cold crash route (which works very well every time) make sure that you aren't sucking air into your fermenter slowly or you can get diacetyl in the beer. I traced my diacetyl problem in hoppy beers back to cold crashing without an absolutely tightly sealed carboy. when i stopped cold crashing, my diacetyl problem went away.
 
Advice on amount of hops and fermentation temps?

I saw this NEIPA recipe (below) in the latest issue of Zymurgy. Other than the yeast, it doesn't look much like a NEIPA to me, but it did get me thinking about the amount of hops I've been using.

I keep creeping up the amount, and I'm about to pass 20 ounces total in my 6 gallon recipe -- in search of a truly juicy NEIPA. But I've seen many posts with people saying that more hops can be less... And it's VERY possible I need to change/improve my brewing technique. So, I am wondering:

1. What is your total hops bill amount? Anyone else pushing 20 ounces or more?

2. What fermentation temps are you using? Do you start at say, 68, and ramp up to 72? I've been fermenting around 65 and wondering if bumping it up would help - and allow me to reduce the amount of hops I've been using?

Honey Squished IPA | American IPA
This New England-style India pale ale has accents of honey from the grain bill...

  • For 5 gallons (18.9 L)
  • MALTS
  • 8 lb. (3.63 kg) 2-row pale ale malt (1.8°L)
  • 1 lb. (454 g) Victory malt
  • 1 lb. (454 g) honey malt
  • 1 lb. (454 g) turbinado sugar
  • HOPS
  • 1 oz. (28 g) Motueka, 6.8% a.a.@ 60 min
  • 1 oz. (28 g) Chinook, 13.8% a.a.@ 10 min
  • 1 oz. (28 g) Warrior, 16.3% a.a.@ 10 min
  • 1 oz. (28 g) Simcoe, 11.9% a.a., dry hop 7 days
  • YEAST
  • 1 L starter, White Labs WLP008 East Coast Ale
  • ADDITIONAL ITEMS
  • 1 tsp. gypsum (calcium sulfate)
SPECIFICATIONS
  • Original Gravity: 1.056 (13.8° P)
  • Final Gravity: 1.006 (1.5° P)
  • ABV: 6.7%
  • IBU: 35
  • SRM: 8
  • Efficiency: 63%
 
Advice on amount of hops and fermentation temps?

I saw this NEIPA recipe (below) in the latest issue of Zymurgy. Other than the yeast, it doesn't look much like a NEIPA to me, but it did get me thinking about the amount of hops I've been using.

I keep creeping up the amount, and I'm about to pass 20 ounces total in my 6 gallon recipe -- in search of a truly juicy NEIPA. But I've seen many posts with people saying that more hops can be less... And it's VERY possible I need to change/improve my brewing technique. So, I am wondering:

1. What is your total hops bill amount? Anyone else pushing 20 ounces or more?

2. What fermentation temps are you using? Do you start at say, 68, and ramp up to 72? I've been fermenting around 65 and wondering if bumping it up would help - and allow me to reduce the amount of hops I've been using?

Honey Squished IPA | American IPA
This New England-style India pale ale has accents of honey from the grain bill...

  • For 5 gallons (18.9 L)
  • MALTS
  • 8 lb. (3.63 kg) 2-row pale ale malt (1.8°L)
  • 1 lb. (454 g) Victory malt
  • 1 lb. (454 g) honey malt
  • 1 lb. (454 g) turbinado sugar
  • HOPS
  • 1 oz. (28 g) Motueka, 6.8% a.a.@ 60 min
  • 1 oz. (28 g) Chinook, 13.8% a.a.@ 10 min
  • 1 oz. (28 g) Warrior, 16.3% a.a.@ 10 min
  • 1 oz. (28 g) Simcoe, 11.9% a.a., dry hop 7 days
  • YEAST
  • 1 L starter, White Labs WLP008 East Coast Ale
  • ADDITIONAL ITEMS
  • 1 tsp. gypsum (calcium sulfate)
SPECIFICATIONS
  • Original Gravity: 1.056 (13.8° P)
  • Final Gravity: 1.006 (1.5° P)
  • ABV: 6.7%
  • IBU: 35
  • SRM: 8
  • Efficiency: 63%


This is an old post but gives you an idea of what these beers are being hopped at:

Treehouse Brewing Julius Clone
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/index.php?posts/7476025/

20oz is fine and about right if you ask me. The hopping rates of these beers can be insane and expensive.

66 works for me and some times I ramp it to 68 then 70 but really don’t need to with a healthy yeast and strong fermentation.
 
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  • 1 lb. (454 g) honey malt

  • 1 oz. (28 g) Motueka, 6.8% a.a.@ 60 min
  • 1 oz. (28 g) Chinook, 13.8% a.a.@ 10 min
  • 1 oz. (28 g) Warrior, 16.3% a.a.@ 10 min
  • 1 oz. (28 g) Simcoe, 11.9% a.a., dry hop 7 days

That seems like an awful lot of honey malt and not nearly enough hops for a NEIPA.

Go Hawks!
 
Wow! 1 oz dry hop in 5 gallons for an NEIPA? That seems insanely low, but I guess you could taste some hops in it maybe.


Advice on amount of hops and fermentation temps?

I saw this NEIPA recipe (below) in the latest issue of Zymurgy. Other than the yeast, it doesn't look much like a NEIPA to me, but it did get me thinking about the amount of hops I've been using.

I keep creeping up the amount, and I'm about to pass 20 ounces total in my 6 gallon recipe -- in search of a truly juicy NEIPA. But I've seen many posts with people saying that more hops can be less... And it's VERY possible I need to change/improve my brewing technique. So, I am wondering:

1. What is your total hops bill amount? Anyone else pushing 20 ounces or more?

2. What fermentation temps are you using? Do you start at say, 68, and ramp up to 72? I've been fermenting around 65 and wondering if bumping it up would help - and allow me to reduce the amount of hops I've been using?

Honey Squished IPA | American IPA
This New England-style India pale ale has accents of honey from the grain bill...

  • For 5 gallons (18.9 L)
  • MALTS
  • 8 lb. (3.63 kg) 2-row pale ale malt (1.8°L)
  • 1 lb. (454 g) Victory malt
  • 1 lb. (454 g) honey malt
  • 1 lb. (454 g) turbinado sugar
  • HOPS
  • 1 oz. (28 g) Motueka, 6.8% a.a.@ 60 min
  • 1 oz. (28 g) Chinook, 13.8% a.a.@ 10 min
  • 1 oz. (28 g) Warrior, 16.3% a.a.@ 10 min
  • 1 oz. (28 g) Simcoe, 11.9% a.a., dry hop 7 days
  • YEAST
  • 1 L starter, White Labs WLP008 East Coast Ale
  • ADDITIONAL ITEMS
  • 1 tsp. gypsum (calcium sulfate)
SPECIFICATIONS
  • Original Gravity: 1.056 (13.8° P)
  • Final Gravity: 1.006 (1.5° P)
  • ABV: 6.7%
  • IBU: 35
  • SRM: 8
  • Efficiency: 63%
 
some will lash out at me in anger, but if you want to rack warm, you can do this. water purge the keg and then get your racking cane ready. right as you are ready to rack, take the poppet out of the out post on the keg and screw the main fitting back on. take the spring and "poppet" out of the ball lock QD and connect it to your racking tubing. let a little beer waste out of the line and then quickly pop it onto the post. when the keg is full, put the poppet back into the keg beer out fitting. there is a little more oxygen exposure doing this probably, but it doesn't seem to cause problems from what i've seen. i tried different filters and such and none of it consistently worked for me.

if you go the cold crash route (which works very well every time) make sure that you aren't sucking air into your fermenter slowly or you can get diacetyl in the beer. I traced my diacetyl problem in hoppy beers back to cold crashing without an absolutely tightly sealed carboy. when i stopped cold crashing, my diacetyl problem went away.
Thanks! Its a Fermentasaurous so it has CO2 pressure on it.

I just bought another chest freezer to cold crash.
 
some will lash out at me in anger, but if you want to rack warm, you can do this. water purge the keg and then get your racking cane ready. right as you are ready to rack, take the poppet out of the out post on the keg and screw the main fitting back on. take the spring and "poppet" out of the ball lock QD and connect it to your racking tubing. let a little beer waste out of the line and then quickly pop it onto the post. when the keg is full, put the poppet back into the keg beer out fitting. there is a little more oxygen exposure doing this probably, but it doesn't seem to cause problems from what i've seen. i tried different filters and such and none of it consistently worked for me.

if you go the cold crash route (which works very well every time) make sure that you aren't sucking air into your fermenter slowly or you can get diacetyl in the beer. I traced my diacetyl problem in hoppy beers back to cold crashing without an absolutely tightly sealed carboy. when i stopped cold crashing, my diacetyl problem went away.

I have a fermonster with spigot so I use a tube with a liquid QD on one end and the other goes over the spigot's barb. During racking I also attach a jumper cable from the gas post on the keg to a gas post I added to my fermonster lid so I have a true closed system.

For really hoppy beers like this I have been doing the following to avoid clogging:

1) Fermentation purge the keg so there is essentially no O2 inside (jumper airlock to keg's liquid post and open PRV slightly or use gas QD with nothing on it). When you're close to racking, seal lid with 10psi from CO2 tank
2) On the racking tubing, remove the liquid QD poppet
3) Right before racking, set co2 line at 1-2 psi and then in quick succession carefully loosen the liquid gas post so that any pressure is released while still somewhat screwed on and immediately clamp down gas QD to create positive pressure out of the liquid post that is now open.
4) Once the majority of pressure is released, unscrew the post completely, remove the liquid poppet, and replace the post (all while co2 is still coming out the liquid post)
5) Attach the racking tubing to the liquid post to purge the tubing
6) Once tubing is purged, attach open end onto spigot and remove gas QD from gas post
7) Attach gas jumper cable from gas QD to fermenter airlock so that any pressure equalizes.
8) Open spigot and walk away knowing this transfer will not clog!

This creates a fully purged system with no poppets to get in the way. It sounds complicated but once you do it a few times it's pretty easy.

Then once I'm done filling the keg, I vent any pressure out of the keg (important or else beer will come out once you disconnect the liquid QD), remove the racking hose from the keg, unscrew the post, add the poppet back in, and screw it back on. I then purge a couple times for good measure.

For those paying attention, yes there will still be some O2 in the top of the diptube (or tubing in my case) from the short time you have it exposed with no positive pressure. That is easily negated by pushing out a bit of beer (and that o2) at the end of all this...that's where I get my hydrometer reading

The goal is making sure anytime the keg is open there is positive pressure to keep the O2 at bay. It's certainly not 100% but it's close and saves me from the headache of a stalled transfer.

EDIT - I just did the process and realized I had a couple things wrong so I updated it above
 
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Hello all,

Brewing this recipe for the second time tomorrow. The first time I used equal parts Citra, Mosaic, and Galaxy and it was amazing. This time, just to change things up, I've purchased 4oz each of Citra, Mosaic, and Simcoe and plan on following the same hopping schedule. (Also going a little heavier on the flaked oats/wheat and adding a touch of 20 for color.)

This is the hop combo listed in the BYO recipe for Julius, but lighter on the Simcoe than the Citra and Moscaic. Do you think equal parts Citra, Mosaic, and Simcoe work ok? What has been your experience with this combo?

Thanks,
John
 
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1.) Hop bill:
I use 25oz into 7.5gal batch into fermenter.
1oz Boil
8oz whirlpool
8oz biotrans dryhop @ 72hrs
8oz aroma dryhop (after cold crash), day 10

For the aroma dryhop, I split the finished beer between two kegs, each contains 4oz of different hops. Accounting for losses, I usually end up with 6-6.5gal of drinkable beer. When pouring the beer, the aroma is detectable across the room. Flavor: my buddies and I used to think Treehouse made the best beer....

2.) Ferm temp - depends on yeast
Conan - 63 thru day 4 then ramp up to a couple of degrees each day to get to 70 before crashing
1272 - 65 thru day 4 then ramp up to a couple of degrees each day to get to 72 before crashing

Advice on amount of hops and fermentation temps?

I keep creeping up the amount, and I'm about to pass 20 ounces total in my 6 gallon recipe -- in search of a truly juicy NEIPA. But I've seen many posts with people saying that more hops can be less... And it's VERY possible I need to change/improve my brewing technique. So, I am wondering:

1. What is your total hops bill amount? Anyone else pushing 20 ounces or more?

2. What fermentation temps are you using? Do you start at say, 68, and ramp up to 72? I've been fermenting around 65 and wondering if bumping it up would help - and allow me to reduce the amount of hops I've been using?
 
I'm going to start with my question: Is 48 hours after pitching too soon to dry hop?

I brewed my NEIPA recipe on Saturday. Previous versions have had great flavor, but started out a bit brownish in color, and eventually turned ugly brown and lost a lot of the tropical citrus flavor. So this is my first batch in my brand new Spike fermenter. It's a Uni-tank, so I'm planning to close off the blow off and let it finish under pressure after I dry hop. When finished, I'll pressure transfer to a purged, pressurized keg, and hopefully eliminate most all opportunities for oxidation.

Ferment has been pretty vigorous since Sunday morning, and off-gassing appears to have already begun to slow a touch. I'm afraid If I wait until tomorrow night, it will slow off a lot more, and there won't be enough fermentation remaining to naturally carbonate the beer in the fermenter. I could also wait just until morning and dry hop before I leave for work.

Thoughts?
 
no. I brew on Saturday mornings, and dry hop on Monday nights with almost every NEIPA I do. sometimes I add a second dry hop 4 days later, sometimes I dont, just depends, but I do all my dry hopping in the primary on these, and only transfer to a secondary if I HAVE to now.
 
I've added the hops to my carboy at the same time as pitching the yeast with excellent results, so any time from yeast pitch to a few days into fermentation is fine.

I'm going to start with my question: Is 48 hours after pitching too soon to dry hop?

I brewed my NEIPA recipe on Saturday. Previous versions have had great flavor, but started out a bit brownish in color, and eventually turned ugly brown and lost a lot of the tropical citrus flavor. So this is my first batch in my brand new Spike fermenter. It's a Uni-tank, so I'm planning to close off the blow off and let it finish under pressure after I dry hop. When finished, I'll pressure transfer to a purged, pressurized keg, and hopefully eliminate most all opportunities for oxidation.

Ferment has been pretty vigorous since Sunday morning, and off-gassing appears to have already begun to slow a touch. I'm afraid If I wait until tomorrow night, it will slow off a lot more, and there won't be enough fermentation remaining to naturally carbonate the beer in the fermenter. I could also wait just until morning and dry hop before I leave for work.

Thoughts?
 
I have a rather odd question for those of you which pay attention to recipes and water profiles:

Have any of you sensed/tasted an elevated chalkiness/astringency/maybe sour-bitter flavours in beers, where Ca and Chloride levels were higher than 100-110 ppm? I seem to experience a bit of it when Ca levels are high... Is there a correlation? Have any of you paid attention to this detail?
 
1.) Hop bill:
I use 25oz into 7.5gal batch into fermenter.
1oz Boil
8oz whirlpool
8oz biotrans dryhop @ 72hrs
8oz aroma dryhop (after cold crash), day 10

For the aroma dryhop, I split the finished beer between two kegs, each contains 4oz of different hops. Accounting for losses, I usually end up with 6-6.5gal of drinkable beer. When pouring the beer, the aroma is detectable across the room. Flavor: my buddies and I used to think Treehouse made the best beer....

2.) Ferm temp - depends on yeast
Conan - 63 thru day 4 then ramp up to a couple of degrees each day to get to 70 before crashing
1272 - 65 thru day 4 then ramp up to a couple of degrees each day to get to 72 before crashing

Thanks ttuato! 25 ounces of hops for a 7.5 gallon batch is certainly in line with 20 ounces for my 6 gallon batch. I'm also going to try ramping up to 72 degrees after four days at 65.

Taste is subjective, of course, but I always wonder if some of the folks who are using comparatively little hops have tasted the huge NEIPA juice bombs. I mean, that recipe I posted from Zymurgy had 4 ounces of hops total! There's just no way that results in a juicy NEIPA.

I've never had Treehouse beers, but in my neck of the woods (Minneapolis), we have some awesome NEIPA's from Toppling Goliath (Iowa), Drekker Brewing (North Dakota) BlackStack Brewing (Minneapolis), Fair State Brewing (Minneapolis), Barrel Theory (St. Paul) and Lupulin Brewing (Big Lake, Minnesota).
 
1st Fermentasaurous/new chest freezer cold crash NEIPA. Calling it a MAJOR success over my numerous other attempts. No diacetyl/oxidized/harsh bitter taste! Kind a proof-of concept brew more then a true finished product but ultra excited to just work on recipes now...
20181031_092930.jpeg
 
I would like to thank everyone who has contributed to this thread. It taught me a lot about this style and how to do a good job brewing it. This is the result is quite delicious. Here is the recipe.
9 lb Briess 2 row
1 lb Honey malt
2 lb White wheat malt
0.5 lb lactose
Imperial Juice yeast
1 oz Nuggett (12.1aa) 60 min
1.5 oz each (when wort is cooled to 170 through chilling) Citra, Azecca, Idaho 7, and Vic Secret
1 oz each of Citra, Azecca, Idaho 7, and Vic Secret at 3 days during full kreusen
1/2 oz each Citra, Azecca, Idaho 7, and Vic Secret at day 14
Kegged and allowed to crash in the keg. There was no water adjustment as my county in KY uses Cincinnati water and it's pretty good.
IMG_0968.jpeg
IMG_0968.jpeg
 
Thanks ttuato! 25 ounces of hops for a 7.5 gallon batch is certainly in line with 20 ounces for my 6 gallon batch. I'm also going to try ramping up to 72 degrees after four days at 65.

Taste is subjective, of course, but I always wonder if some of the folks who are using comparatively little hops have tasted the huge NEIPA juice bombs. I mean, that recipe I posted from Zymurgy had 4 ounces of hops total! There's just no way that results in a juicy NEIPA.

I've never had Treehouse beers, but in my neck of the woods (Minneapolis), we have some awesome NEIPA's from Toppling Goliath (Iowa), Drekker Brewing (North Dakota) BlackStack Brewing (Minneapolis), Fair State Brewing (Minneapolis), Barrel Theory (St. Paul) and Lupulin Brewing (Big Lake, Minnesota).
Add Lake Time Brewing to your list to check out. Just across the border into Iowa in Clear Lake. My sister bought the beer in the photo for me and will be bringing it to me at Christmas. I can't wait. NEIPA brewed with Kveik yeast! The reviews on Untapped are very high!
Resized_20181030_163921_1267.jpeg
 
Happy Halloween, folks!

Last time I tried a NEIPA it oxidized. This time around I happened to win a raffle at my local homebrew club and it was ingredients for a batch of hazy goodness. Interesting ingredients. Rule was to use what I won and see how it turns out.

It’s still in the conical. I just drew a sample ...

8C07E343-9A3B-4F93-879A-CDD73971731B.jpeg


The photo shows a hint of color but in person this turned out almost white! I would give an SRM of 5 or so. Last time I didn’t have any way to ferment under pressure. Since then I acquired a Spike CF10.

If I were to put this recipe together I would’ve added some honey malt and flaked barley but the ingredients I won turned out quite nice.

10 lbs Talisman Pale
3 lbs Vienna
1 lb oat malt
1 lb white wheat
1 lb flaked oats
.5 lb acidulated malt
(Mosaic at 10 mins, Loral and mosaic cryo at 170 deg whirlpool, and 2 dryhop sessions with mosaic cryo)
They also provided me with wyeast 1098 (British ale). I have a feeling it’s going to clear when I put it in the fridge to carbonate and serve.

I’ve got to say this is quite tasty right out of the fermenter. Now to pressure transfer to keg and take to next club meeting. Hopefully they like the combo they put together for me.

Thanks for all the posted tips and suggestions!
Cheers
 
I have a batch of this and a batch of my Hoppy Session Wheat heading into kegs in the next day or two..... been a while since I have brewed them, so, looking forward to having something hoppy back on tap. Currently, I have 6 lagers on tap!
 
are people zeroing in on favorite neipa yeast at this point? i think my favs are 1318, 1272 and the sacch trois strain or anything combined with sacch trois
 
I have a batch of this and a batch of my Hoppy Session Wheat heading into kegs in the next day or two..... been a while since I have brewed them, so, looking forward to having something hoppy back on tap. Currently, I have 6 lagers on tap!
That's where I've been too...nice balance to the juice bombs.

It is amazing though how much more work a NEIPA is than even a lager. Its why this thread will seemingly never end.

High maintenance SOBs. But I still love them
 
Add Lake Time Brewing to your list to check out. Just across the border into Iowa in Clear Lake. My sister bought the beer in the photo for me and will be bringing it to me at Christmas. I can't wait. NEIPA brewed with Kveik yeast! The reviews on Untapped are very high! View attachment 595524

ttuato - Will do! Love the Pavement reference. That's one of my all-time favorite albums!
 
are people zeroing in on favorite neipa yeast at this point? i think my favs are 1318, 1272 and the sacch trois strain or anything combined with sacch trois

My "house" has been Imperial Organic Barbarian (conan) for two years but I end up doing more with 1272 now because it is so clean and lets the hops shine. The esters from 1318 and sacch trois are too much for me. My next experiment will be with Hornindal. I know it has lots of esters too but I have yet to read about anyone not raving about it in NEIPAs. Thinking of doing a Galaxy SMASH with GP....
 
I would like to thank everyone who has contributed to this thread. It taught me a lot about this style and how to do a good job brewing it. This is the result is quite delicious. Here is the recipe.
9 lb Briess 2 row
1 lb Honey malt
2 lb White wheat malt
0.5 lb lactose
Imperial Juice yeast
1 oz Nuggett (12.1aa) 60 min
1.5 oz each (when wort is cooled to 170 through chilling) Citra, Azecca, Idaho 7, and Vic Secret
1 oz each of Citra, Azecca, Idaho 7, and Vic Secret at 3 days during full kreusen
1/2 oz each Citra, Azecca, Idaho 7, and Vic Secret at day 14
Kegged and allowed to crash in the keg. There was no water adjustment as my county in KY uses Cincinnati water and it's pretty good.View attachment 595517 View attachment 595517

@Eric Tepe - looks great and sounds like a tasty hop combo.

One suggestion for you on the next iteration - try dialing the honey malt back to no more that 8oz in 5 gal batch (I use 6oz in 7.5 gal). That is some surprisingly powerful stuff and contributes a lot more flavor than folks realize. It becomes really obvious around 3-4weeks post brew day - a cloying sweetness that coats the tongue and is apparent for remainder of keg.
 
@Eric Tepe - looks great and sounds like a tasty hop combo.

One suggestion for you on the next iteration - try dialing the honey malt back to no more that 8oz in 5 gal batch (I use 6oz in 7.5 gal). That is some surprisingly powerful stuff and contributes a lot more flavor than folks realize. It becomes really obvious around 3-4weeks post brew day - a cloying sweetness that coats the tongue and is apparent for remainder of keg.
Agree 100%, had my last NEIPA finish at 1.013 with 4oz of honey in a 14lb grain bill and it is sweeter than expected. I just kegged one w/o honey and will do a side by side to compare.
 
@Eric Tepe - looks great and sounds like a tasty hop combo.

One suggestion for you on the next iteration - try dialing the honey malt back to no more that 8oz in 5 gal batch (I use 6oz in 7.5 gal). That is some surprisingly powerful stuff and contributes a lot more flavor than folks realize. It becomes really obvious around 3-4weeks post brew day - a cloying sweetness that coats the tongue and is apparent for remainder of keg.

I don't know if it's the honey malt doing this. I did 9 straight NEIPA brew, 4 with honey malt (2-4%), 3 without honey malt and 2 with C10. At first (3-4 weeks in the keg) the beer is really good and fresh. After a month in the keg, the beer with and without honey malt became sweet on the flavor side but still have a good aroma. I thought it was honey malt at first but when I completed deleted any sweet malt in my last 3 NEIPA, it's still the same result. Yeast was 1318, Conan and 644. I'm always doing no oxygen closed transfer.

I'm going back to honey malt in the next one with Voss Kveik in the journey for the orange-citrus flavor.
 
What’s your saisonrecipe? Same beer with 3711?

Similar.... Could definitely use the NEIPA recipe and pitch saison yeast.... I would change the water thought to more sulfate.

This would be what I use for my saisons in general:

20-25% Wheat
15-20% Flaked whatever
55-65% Base malts (Pilsner, 2 Row, Vienna, Munich..... whatever combo you want)

Gravity of 1.045-1.060 range

Hops:
Traditional - Bitter with whatever at 60, Styrian Goldings and/or Hallertau at 30/5 .... 30 IBUS or so.
Americanized.... Bitter with warrior or Centennial in the 30 IBU range. 1-2 ounces each of Citra and Galaxy in whirlpool and again a couple days into fermentation as a dry hop.

Water = 100% RO, Gypsum and CaCl to get to 100-120 Sulfate and 50-60 Chloride.
Lactic acid to get to 5.2-5.3 pH

Yeast 3711 or 3724 or combo of both... or Mad Fermentationist blend from bootleg biology. I generally start around 68 or so at first, and let free rise. I like my saisons relatively clean. Not heavy on phenolics. Definitely not a fan of banana esters.

Personally, I bottle all my saisons in 750ml heavy bottles and prime to 3.0 volumes. I think they mature a lot better this way. I think 3+ months before they really start to come around and round out.
 

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