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Odd 13 Brewing n00b (noob) clone - NEIPA

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triethylborane

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This is one of my favorites and I regularly stock it in my beer fridge. Availability can be spotty, though Odd 13 did expand their production facility and supply gaps seem to be occurring less frequently; regardless, I think a clone is in order. Odd 13's production brewmaster worked at Allagash Brewing, so there is some solid NEIPA brewing background. A n00b I enjoyed this summer:

1ww8.jpg



Tentative recipe:
5.5 gallons fermentor volume 70% efficiency
OG 1.063 FG 1.016 SRM 6.5
8 lbs Vienna malt (specifically weyermann)
2.5 lbs Rye malt (specifically weyermann)
1.5 lbs Flaked wheat
1.5 lbs Flaked oats
13.5 lbs total

Mash: 154-156f 60 min

Hops:
1oz El Dorado flameout
1oz Mosaic flameout
1oz El Dorado hopstand [email protected]
1oz Mosaic hopstand [email protected]
1.5oz El Dorado dryhop @ days 2-3 (krausen present)
1.5oz Mosaic dryhop @ days 2-3 (krausen present)
1.5oz El Dorado days 7-10
1.5oz Mosaic days 7-10

Yeast:
Wyeast LA III or Inland Island INIS 0008 East Coast IPA
Pitch @ 64f rate 0.5 - 0.7 mil/mL/°P

Target Water Profile NEIPA (mg/l):
Ca+2 100
Mg+2 0
Na+ 0
Cl- 175
SO4-2 90
HCO3- 0
mash pH 5.2

Fermentation:
64f pitch, let rise with fermentation
68f after krausen drops and gravity is around 1.030-1.025



Discussion

Note: A chunk of this information is what I have put to memory from listening to Odd13's podcasts on my daily 2.5hr commute and from Odd 13's social media accounts.

n00b description, from Odd 13's website:

The first batch brewed at our production facility, n00b is an American IPA. Heavy dry hopping with Mosaic and El Dorado combine with restricted bitterness to create a juicy flavor and aroma profile. The hops and yeast work together to provide hints of blueberry and orange candy.

Odd 13 also provides this info:

ABV 6.0%
OG 1.058
Fermentables: Weyermann Vienna Malt, Weyermann Rye Malt
Hops (as above): Mosaic and El Dorado

Some of the following is NOT specific to n00b and is Odd 13s general approach to NEIPAs:

Fermentables:
Flaked wheat and oats are in the bill for increased mouthfeel, with a rough ratio of 70% barley to 30% wheat, but this is highly malleable. Flour . . . lol no.


Yeast:
Probably Wyeast London Ale III, they have used LAIII on a double dry hopped version of n00b, at the taproom production site. LA III gives haze due to flocc attributes and residual sweetness.


Pitch Rate:
0.5mil cells/mL/°P so this is a bit under-pitched.


Mashing:
Between 153-156f, with some variance between batches, though high side of the mentioned range is fine because residual sweetness is desired.


Hops:
No hops added to boil, hops added:
at flameout/knockout
hop stand 170f for 30 minutes
dry hopping at day 3-4
dry hopping at day 7-10 (-3 day to packaging, depends on gravity readings)
Typically the hop level is about 2lb/bl, so 1.03oz hops/gal, which I find low from other NEIPA recipes. They use pellets and cryo.


Fermentation & dry hopping:
Pitch at 64f
Dry hop day 3-4, when krausen present
Krausen drops, temps raised to 68-70f for clean up
Dry hop day 7-10
FG is somewhere around 1.016-1.013


Water:
Sounds like they are using whatever water is supplied in Lafayette, CO and adding primarily CaCl2 and some restrained amounts of CaSO4; calcium sulfate added with restraint to avoid sulfur and burton water characteristics. I have not determined what sort of quantity of CaCl2 and CaSO4 are being added, hope to find out more information.

More on this later.
 

snowtiger1987

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They really use Vienna malt and Rye as the base? Interesting. I might have to try some.
 
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triethylborane

triethylborane

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Ryan from Odd13 here. You're close on the recipe. There's no wheat or oats in n00b. It's just Vienna and rye. Yeast is off as well.
No oats or wheat, that is interesting considering n00b has a viscous mouth feel IMHO, so possibly the water treatments are pushing it towards that. Appreciate the info!
 
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triethylborane

triethylborane

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The rye would contribute a viscous mouthfeel.
Good to know, I have very limited brewing experience with rye malts (checked my logs now) and just thought it gave a smoother feel. But creamy and what you mention certainly fits n00b. From weyermann:

1xe7.jpg



So looks like the obvious starting place is to go with a 1:1 vienna:rye. Ill check to see how this comes out with the software later on.
 
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triethylborane

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(Updated 27 Nov 17)

N00b Clone

Brew Method: All Grain
Style Name: American IPA
Boil Time: 60 min
Batch Size: 5.5 gallons (fermentor volume)
Boil Size: 7.5 gallons
Boil Gravity: 1.045
Efficiency: 70% (brew house)


STATS:
Original Gravity: 1.062
Final Gravity: 1.017
ABV (standard): 5.9%
IBU (tinseth): 76.81
SRM (morey): 6.66

FERMENTABLES:
6.5 lb - German - Vienna (48.1%)
6.5 lb - German - Rye (48.1%)
0.5 lb - Rice Hulls (3.7%)

HOPS:
1 oz - El Dorado, Type: Pellet, AA: 15.7, Use: Whirlpool for 0 min at 208 °F, IBU: 21.38
1 oz - Mosaic, Type: Pellet, AA: 12.5, Use: Whirlpool for 0 min at 208 °F, IBU: 17.02
1 oz - El Dorado, Type: Pellet, AA: 15.7, Use: Whirlpool for 30 min at 170 °F, IBU: 21.38
1 oz - Mosaic, Type: Pellet, AA: 12.5, Use: Whirlpool for 30 min at 170 °F, IBU: 17.02
1.5 oz - El Dorado, Type: Pellet, AA: 15.7, Use: Dry Hop for 2 days
1.5 oz - Mosaic, Type: Pellet, AA: 12.5, Use: Dry Hop for 2 days
1.5 oz - El Dorado, Type: Pellet, AA: 15.7, Use: Dry Hop for 7 days
1.5 oz - Mosaic, Type: Pellet, AA: 12.5, Use: Dry Hop for 7 days

YEAST:
White Labs - East Coast Ale Yeast WLP008
Starter: No
Form: Liquid
Attenuation (avg): 72.5%
Flocculation: Med-Low
Optimum Temp: 68 - 73 F

NOTES:
Pitch @ 64f, keep at 64f until 1.026 then ramp up to 68f->70f
Dry hop day 3-4, when krausen present
Krausen drops, temps raised to 68-70f for clean up
Dry hop day 7-10

--------------------

Plan to brew this over the upcoming weekend.
 
Last edited:
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triethylborane

triethylborane

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Excited to hear how this comes out. I wonder if maybe there is flaked rye? Would that maybe give the mouthfeel you were thinking came from wheat/oats?
Initially that was along my lines of thinking, there had to be some flaked oats and wheat to give it the mouthfeel. Well, I was wrong on that, but it simplifies the grain bill. I really cant tell you much about flaked rye, Ive never used it, let alone rye malt, but I think the mouthfeel comes from the water adjustments, which makes this easier IMHO.
 

snowtiger1987

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That much rye can lead to a stuck mash/sparge if you aren't careful. I doubt that Odd13 uses that much. I would guess 20% or so.

If you do use 50% sparge real slow and have some rice hulls handy in case it gets stuck.
 
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triethylborane

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That much rye can lead to a stuck mash/sparge if you aren't careful. I doubt that Odd13 uses that much. I would guess 20% or so.

If you do use 50% sparge real slow and have some rice hulls handy in case it gets stuck.

Yeah, its going to be 50% rye for the first batch.

Updated recipe with rice rulls, thanks for the info on rye.
 
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snowtiger1987

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Yeah, its going to be 50% rye for the first batch.

Updated recipe with rice rulls, thanks for the info on rye.
That is going to be a VERY viscous beer. I made a Rye Wine with about 50% malted rye and when it was done and carbonated it was a very interesting pour. At first there would not be any head at all then about 20 seconds later the head would start to appear and keep rising for another 20 seconds or so.
 
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triethylborane

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That is going to be a VERY viscous beer. I made a Rye Wine with about 50% malted rye and when it was done and carbonated it was a very interesting pour. At first there would not be any head at all then about 20 seconds later the head would start to appear and keep rising for another 20 seconds or so.

Well, you've convinced me with your posts, some research into rye malt and enjoying a few n00bs . . . dropped rye to 1:3 base malt. N00b has some viscosity to it and Im ok with starting out here instead of 1:1.

Since I cant edit posts after 72 hrs have elapsed (lol @ that nonsense), here is the 3rd and hopefully final iteration of the recipe:

Title: N00b Clone

Brew Method: All Grain
Style Name: American IPA
Boil Time: 60 min
Batch Size: 5.5 gallons (fermentor volume)
Boil Size: 7.5 gallons
Boil Gravity: 1.045
Efficiency: 70% (brew house)


STATS:
Original Gravity: 1.062
Final Gravity: 1.017
ABV (standard): 5.86%
IBU (tinseth): 76.81
SRM (morey): 6.82

FERMENTABLES:
9.75 lb - German - Vienna (72.2%)
3.25 lb - German - Rye (24.1%)
0.5 lb - Rice Hulls (3.7%)

HOPS:
1 oz - El Dorado, Type: Pellet, AA: 15.7, Use: Whirlpool for 0 min at 208 °F, IBU: 21.38
1 oz - Mosaic, Type: Pellet, AA: 12.5, Use: Whirlpool for 0 min at 208 °F, IBU: 17.02
1 oz - El Dorado, Type: Pellet, AA: 15.7, Use: Whirlpool for 30 min at 170 °F, IBU: 21.38
1 oz - Mosaic, Type: Pellet, AA: 12.5, Use: Whirlpool for 30 min at 170 °F, IBU: 17.02
1.5 oz - El Dorado, Type: Pellet, AA: 15.7, Use: Dry Hop for 2 days
1.5 oz - Mosaic, Type: Pellet, AA: 12.5, Use: Dry Hop for 2 days
1.5 oz - El Dorado, Type: Pellet, AA: 15.7, Use: Dry Hop for 7 days
1.5 oz - Mosaic, Type: Pellet, AA: 12.5, Use: Dry Hop for 7 days

YEAST:
White Labs - East Coast Ale Yeast WLP008
Starter: No
Form: Liquid
Attenuation (avg): 72.5%
Flocculation: Med-Low
Optimum Temp: 68 - 73 F

NOTES:
Pitch @ 64f, keep at 64f until 1.026 then ramp up to 68f->70f





Generated by Brewer's Friend - https://www.brewersfriend.com/
Date: 2017-12-01 05:34 UTC
Recipe Last Updated: 2017-11-30 23:53 UTC
 
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applescrap

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That seems better based on my understanding, since I'm in the area, maybe drop me a 12-pack and I'll let you know what I think[emoji3]
 

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I’m going for it next Thursday! Like your recipe, just yeast will be 04.
 
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triethylborane

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OP, any results on your brew yet?
Brewed late monday night and 1st dry hopping completed today. Krausen is high and fermentation is active. Using mosaic cryo hops, the smell is fantastic. I keep sticking my nose in the cryo hops bag. More to follow.
 

ibrubeer

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Any updates on this beer? I was looking at being a NEIPA next week. I do like n00b...
 
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triethylborane

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Any updates on this beer? I was looking at being a NEIPA next week. I do like n00b...

Bottled Friday. Upon opening the fermenting bucket, it had that cartoonish nuclear waste neon green look from the Simpsons. The beer has a nice orange color from what I can observe. I cold crashed it for 2 days. The sample I had was quite good, will see in a week or so how it compares. CO2 target was 2.6vols.
2ckp.png


2ckq.png
 

Schemy

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Well, you've convinced me with your posts, some research into rye malt and enjoying a few n00bs . . . dropped rye to 1:3 base malt. N00b has some viscosity to it and Im ok with starting out here instead of 1:1.

Since I cant edit posts after 72 hrs have elapsed (lol @ that nonsense), here is the 3rd and hopefully final iteration of the recipe:

Title: N00b Clone

Brew Method: All Grain
Style Name: American IPA
Boil Time: 60 min
Batch Size: 5.5 gallons (fermentor volume)
Boil Size: 7.5 gallons
Boil Gravity: 1.045
Efficiency: 70% (brew house)


STATS:
Original Gravity: 1.062
Final Gravity: 1.017
ABV (standard): 5.86%
IBU (tinseth): 76.81
SRM (morey): 6.82

FERMENTABLES:
9.75 lb - German - Vienna (72.2%)
3.25 lb - German - Rye (24.1%)
0.5 lb - Rice Hulls (3.7%)

HOPS:
1 oz - El Dorado, Type: Pellet, AA: 15.7, Use: Whirlpool for 0 min at 208 °F, IBU: 21.38
1 oz - Mosaic, Type: Pellet, AA: 12.5, Use: Whirlpool for 0 min at 208 °F, IBU: 17.02
1 oz - El Dorado, Type: Pellet, AA: 15.7, Use: Whirlpool for 30 min at 170 °F, IBU: 21.38
1 oz - Mosaic, Type: Pellet, AA: 12.5, Use: Whirlpool for 30 min at 170 °F, IBU: 17.02
1.5 oz - El Dorado, Type: Pellet, AA: 15.7, Use: Dry Hop for 2 days
1.5 oz - Mosaic, Type: Pellet, AA: 12.5, Use: Dry Hop for 2 days
1.5 oz - El Dorado, Type: Pellet, AA: 15.7, Use: Dry Hop for 7 days
1.5 oz - Mosaic, Type: Pellet, AA: 12.5, Use: Dry Hop for 7 days

YEAST:
White Labs - East Coast Ale Yeast WLP008
Starter: No
Form: Liquid
Attenuation (avg): 72.5%
Flocculation: Med-Low
Optimum Temp: 68 - 73 F

NOTES:
Pitch @ 64f, keep at 64f until 1.026 then ramp up to 68f->70f





Generated by Brewer's Friend - https://www.brewersfriend.com/
Date: 2017-12-01 05:34 UTC
Recipe Last Updated: 2017-11-30 23:53 UTC
This is similar to what I wrote up when I took a stab at n00b. I had some issues with oxidation, but fresh, I think I was fairly close.
 

Cobby

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Hi guys! Updates on a brew. What can I say it’s the one of the beers I ever made.Thank you so much working hard on a recipe.Shame here in Japan it’s no way to get it.Great nose , tart from El dorado , other hops also come very clear . Big surprise I can’t taste any rye. If in other IPA’s if I put around 200-500 grams of rye malt I can recognize it in n00b- nothing.I don’t know maybe it’s Vienna and rye combo or something wrong with me:). Three weeks in a keg still very tasty and hazy.Very citrusy and refreshing.Great recipe.Thank you so much!
 
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triethylborane

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Hi guys! Updates on a brew. What can I say it’s the one of the beers I ever made.Thank you so much working hard on a recipe.Shame here in Japan it’s no way to get it.Great nose , tart from El dorado , other hops also come very clear . Big surprise I can’t taste any rye. If in other IPA’s if I put around 200-500 grams of rye malt I can recognize it in n00b- nothing.I don’t know maybe it’s Vienna and rye combo or something wrong with me:). Three weeks in a keg still very tasty and hazy.Very citrusy and refreshing.Great recipe.Thank you so much!
Glad it turned out great for you. My father tasted it yesterday and thought it was spot on, fwiw-confirmation bias etc. I appreciate your feedback as well.

Japan . . . I was TDY at Camp Zama for a few weeks in 2012. Wish I could have stayed longer. Pretty cool you are brewing a Colorado beer in Japan.
 

Cobby

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Yeah one more think the yeast was 04 would be great to try it with London 3. :)
 
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triethylborane

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2fh8.png



It seems quite close to n00b. Great mouthfeel, huge juice flavors from the El Dorado and Mosaic, mainly citrus, lemon peel and a lingering guava on the tip of my tongue. But there is a slight bitterness that seems spicy, which I think might be the rye. Aroma is powerful and reminds me of lemon verbena. Tons of haze, very easy to drink. Its not sweet which is something I like about n00b as opposed to other NEIPAs like Haze Country.

Its crazy how good this is. Im quite pleased with the results.
 
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triethylborane

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A quick update, given there is some question as to the shelf life of a NEIPA. Flavor and hop presence is the same, haze is the same, no off flavors, etc though Ive determined the citrus is most like a grapefruit, sort of like a juicy ruby red.
 
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