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Make IPA Clear Again

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Brooothru

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I remember at the time that there was a website that tracked the liquor stores that were scheduled for deliveries from Alchemist each day. The line started forming before 8 am at the brewery for on site sales, which BTW were limited to two cases: max one of Heady and one case of something else. My "something else" was gonna' be Focal Banger. We'd hoped (last year) to make it back to NE for the Fall, but Covid had other plans. Maybe next year. I really want to be proved wrong re: NEIPA.

Brooo Brother
 
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day_trippr

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Having enjoyed most of The Alchemist's lineup over the years I would contest the notion that Heady or Banger are "intensely bitter".
Yes, they sport impressive IBU numbers - but those are paper numbers. My NEIPAs are similarly characterized by the likes of BeerSmith, but I'd characterize them all as smoothly bitter to a middling IBU. Such is the behavior of whirlpooling at temperatures below the brunt of isomerization...

Cheers!
 

Jeff Kroosz

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If I had grown a man bun, my dad would have smacked me and cut it off. I don’t have hair now, Just say’n
I try really hard to like the NEIPA craze. I’ve found that the OtherHalf stuff style is me. I’ve found that the majority leaves me with an amazement of wtf? Muddled flavors, and an acrid type of something, not bitterness. Too many trying to produce the style without cohesive balance. There is way more to it than haze. The haze is the biproduct if something good happening, not the only intent. Reminds me of the early days of DIPA. More to it than wrecking a tongue.
I have to agree with, "There is way more to it than haze". An honestly good NEIPA is NOT easy to make. Few examples are cohesive beers.
 
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Nagorg

Nagorg

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good NEIPA is NOT easy to make
And thats evidenced by the plethora of bad examples out there... But, it's what sells and gives folks that giddy feeling when they proclaim how they dont like those bitter "IPA's". They are now in the IPA club!
 

Bobby_M

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You want to have a lineup - not 7 taps with the same beer.
The brewpub near us has a blonde ale, a red ale, a honey brown ale, a west coast ipa, a stout, a porter, and even sources a cider. They do have one neipa and also a saison. That’s a pretty good lineup that offers something for everybody.
And what would you do when you found that the NEIPA tap outsells the other six taps combined. What if you also found that patrons would sit at the bar and have two NEIPAs and then leave? You would dedicate two taps to two different NEIPA variations. You might even try 3 taps perhaps with the third being a hazy pale ale. Either you're running a successful business or you're running some kind of elitist principals thing like the soup nazi from Seinfeld.
 

Bobby_M

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The challenge is that classification follows real world usage. Enough breweries have already gone down the NEIPA rabbit hole. A rename would have to be an industry-wide concerted effort or the pioneers would be shooting themselves in the foot. "What's a New England Ale?"... "It's a hazy ale with intense tropical fruit hop aroma and flavor" "Oh you mean a NEIPA?" "No. Stop saying IPA".

The BJCP for example is very clear that it tracks with what people are brewing and is therefore descriptive, not prescriptive. I think enough people understand the intent of the NEIPA at this point and the IPA purists are just going to need to let it go or just demand clear descriptive delineation out in the wild. Product will have to be labeled better with "New England" or "West Coast" and perhaps consistently list IBUs.
 
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The challenge is that classification follows real world usage. Enough breweries have already gone down the NEIPA rabbit hole. A rename would have to be an industry-wide concerted effort or the pioneers would be shooting themselves in the foot. "What's a New England Ale?"... "It's a hazy ale with intense tropical fruit hop aroma and flavor" "Oh you mean a NEIPA?" "No. Stop saying IPA".

The BJCP for example is very clear that it tracks with what people are brewing and is therefore descriptive, not prescriptive. I think enough people understand the intent of the NEIPA at this point and the IPA purists are just going to need to let it go or just demand clear descriptive delineation out in the wild. Product will have to be labeled better with "New England" or "West Coast" and perhaps consistently list IBUs.
So you think that those of us who don't care for NEIPA's don't have any consumer power? While there is always going to be a most popular style/flavor due to changing trends, why be so single minded that you alienate your other customers?

I for one tend to avoid ordering any IPA when I am at a bar, and am very tentative in a store, unless I already have had the beer and know I like it. You just cannot tell from the labeling if an IPA is an NEIPA or a WCIPA. Which is a shame, case WCIPA is my favorite stye.
 

Bobby_M

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So you think that those of us who don't care for NEIPA's don't have any consumer power? While there is always going to be a most popular style/flavor due to changing trends, why be so single minded that you alienate your other customers?

I for one tend to avoid ordering any IPA when I am at a bar, and am very tentative in a store, unless I already have had the beer and know I like it. You just cannot tell from the labeling if an IPA is an NEIPA or a WCIPA. Which is a shame, case WCIPA is my favorite stye.
That's a weird stretch of what I wrote. I'm suggesting that the naming cat is already out of the bag and the logistics of walking it back are challenging to near impossible. I said that the push should be for better naming and descriptions to allow for people who want clear West Coast IPAs to find their product of choice.
 

bwible

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Never tried this, but what about flavouring at the time of serving? Like we used to do with the SodaSteam syrups? Is there anything in the process of flavoured seltzer that precludes having an unflavoured keg and adding the flavour on demand?
Thought about that too. If you don’t put flavoring in the keg then its just vodka and water diluted to around 5% and carbonated. Certainly no reason you can’t do that.

The trick to adding flavor at serving time, I think, is going to be measuring the minute amount of flavoring for a 12 oz serving. Most of the flavorings I listed from Apex are saying add .3 to .6 percent. The smallest size they sell is 2 oz. Let’s say we want to use .5%. In my case I have a 3 gallon keg. So 3 x 128 = 384 oz x .5% = 1.92 oz for the batch. So the 2 oz size is about perfect. If I’ve done the math right. Now 12 oz x .5% = .06 oz? How do you measure 6/100 of an ounce?
 
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NewJersey

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Naw, we were about 50 miles from Burlington when we got a call of a death in the family. Of course, the road trip immediately set a new destination in the GPS.

Since we left Vermont empty handed, a few weeks later I tried to scarf up a few examples of out-of-region brews imported from the Down East area. Since the haze craze had really taken off, any NEIPA was gonna' be expensive and probably of wannabe copy cat quality. $20-$25 for a 4 pack was pretty much the going freight for anything that could pass for NEIPA.

Brooo Brother
Why do all of your posts say "bro brother" at the bottom?
And then again underneath that?
Am I missing something?
 

Brooothru

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Why do all of your posts say "bro brother" at the bottom?
And then again underneath that?
Am I missing something?
Force of habit, I guess.

On your profile tab for this forum you can establish a signature line that automatically generates a line when you hit the "Submit" button. The app on my Android phone (like right now) doesn't, or at least I haven't bothered to figure out how to do it.

If you see a tag line at the end of one of my posts, it was from my computer. If not, it was from my phone.

Brooo Brother
(a meme, based on an avatar)
 
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Nagorg

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And.... Just the other night I was at a local taphouse I go to sometimes. One of the staff members asked me what I like to drink. Of course I answered "IPA. But I prefer those with some clarity. I don't really care for those hazy, NEIPA things.".
She looked a little confused, turned to the other staff member and said "He wants a clear IPA?"... They both stood there in wonderment for a bit until I told them what to pour for me.
SMH...
 

Bobby_M

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And.... Just the other night I was at a local taphouse I go to sometimes. One of the staff members asked me what I like to drink. Of course I answered "IPA. But I prefer those with some clarity. I don't really care for those hazy, NEIPA things.".
She looked a little confused, turned to the other staff member and said "He wants a clear IPA?"... They both stood there in wonderment for a bit until I told them what to pour for me.
SMH...
It's just typical terrible bar tender education. You'd get the same looks of bewilderment if you asked if they had a Vienna Lager or German Pilsner. Entry level people think there are three beer styles. IPA, Budweiser, and Blue Moon.
 

NewJersey

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It's just typical terrible bar tender education. You'd get the same looks of bewilderment if you asked if they had a Vienna Lager or German Pilsner. Entry level people think there are three beer styles. IPA, Budweiser, and Blue Moon.
THIS
I can tell immediately upon talking to a bartender if they know anything about beer.
 

Bobby_M

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I think the other side of it is that if more customers made management aware of how important beertending was, they might put more focus on it. I remember going to the soft open for "World of Beer" in New Brunswick. They had some 100 taps and another 100 bottles. The entire staff was clueless about any of the beers. Way to go beer focused business!
 

MrFancyPlants

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I have a thing against wheat beers. I think I over did it on purple haze once upon a time. Oberon is about my limit to how much wheat I can stand in a beer, and I’d love to try an Oberon without wheat.
I was tasting my NE Kveik ESB last night, which is still pretty green at this point, but sweet, fruity and just enough bitterness. It looks gross in a clear glass, like coffee when you just ran out of milk. I prefer drinking it out of a solo cup.
I primaried with Kveik, but added some imperial juice yeast and some pressure cooked pale DME when I dryhopped a pound into the 50L batch.
 

bwible

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She looked a little confused, turned to the other staff member and said "He wants a clear IPA?"... They both stood there in wonderment for a bit until I told them what to pour for me.
SMH...
They will be told at some point “It was something old people drank a long time ago, but they don’t really make it anymore.”
 
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