English Ales - What's your favorite recipe?
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Northern_Brewer
British - apparently some US company stole my name
Glad to hear it worked out for you, I've tried it twice but in both times it was under awkward circumstances (long story) and luck didn't go my way. Should probably give it another go now that I can give it a fair shot.
Just generally, I'd note that while brown malt is the defining ingredient of a London porter, it's a bit of a love/hate ingredient - possibly due to variations between maltsters - so if you're brewing a recipe for the first time it's probably a good idea to go easy on the brown malt to start with and build up to a "full dose".
My missus loves Fuller's porter, possibly her favourite beer, so we usually have some bottles around - but the cask version is awesome. Just a shame that it seems to have been a victim of the Asahi takeover.
I've never seen a cask version of it. That would have been probably my favourite porter...
Northern_Brewer
British - apparently some US company stole my name
It's great. But they wouldn't compromise on it so the cask version was the same 5.4% ABV as the bottles, which meant it was too strong for most pubs and only ended up in small volumes at the hardcore Fuller's pubs like the Harp. And although there's a lot of love for it within the brewery, it was one of the things to fall through the new gap between Asahi and the pub chain. They're obviously still brewing a fair bit of it to put into bottles - I hoped to bring one to the US but they'd sold out at my usual source - so it's just a question of will.
Gravity went to 1.024 after a couple days so I upped the temp to 72 to finish.
Yesterday it was done at 1.017 so I dropped the temp setting to 35 to see what I can drop out.
OG was actually 1.051, not 1.049 (I misread my brew notes), so ABV is at 4.4%.
The gravity sample was cloudy and tasted yeasty. Beneath the yeastiness there was some nice esters and a good malt flavor. In a couple weeks when it is conditioned up I think it'll be delicious. I'll check it tomorrow and see how it's coming along, maybe add some gelatin then.
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I might be one those people that don't mind the taste of brown malt or have not run across an offensive maltster yet. I brewed it using the percentages you have listed.
I don't have good notes on the flavor of the but I do recall enjoying it and will give it another try when the urge for a porter comes around again. I mashed a little low at 150F to start then brought the temp up later to get it to finish. I came in a little high at 1056 with a 1013 finishing gravity. It had a little body but it was not too much to me. It seemed fairly balanced as far the bitterness goes with some bitterness coming in more as an aftertaste. There is not much chocolate malt but still enough to get a hint of chocolate in the flavor and aroma from time to time.
I seen some suggestions here and other places that Crisps Vienna malt is basically the same as Mild Malt, does that apply to Simpsons aswell? Plan on trying to use it as a part of the base malts in Milds, Browns and Porters.
Added gelatin last night. Might keg it next weekend.
Well I went ahead and ordered a 5kg sack of Swedish Vienna from Warbro, I think it is made from an old Swedish heritage barley called Balder wich was very popular in domestic brewing back in the day.
Will try it in a Golden Bitter 50/50 with GP to see what it brings and because it feels like the sort of ale where a portion of mild malt would have been used.
So GP, Vienna/Mild Malt, some wheat and 10% invert 2.
OG 1.042 -/+ 1 and around 37 IBU, so
hopping and bitterness as my regular best bitters.
Will try it in a Golden Bitter 50/50 with GP to see what it brings and because it feels like the sort of ale where a portion of mild malt would have been used.
So GP, Vienna/Mild Malt, some wheat and 10% invert 2.
OG 1.042 -/+ 1 and around 37 IBU, so
hopping and bitterness as my regular best bitters.
Pitched a fresh vial of WLP037 yesterday morning into a gallon of starter. I also boiled that starter with 30 IBUs of Fuggle.
Here we are at 24hrs with a rousing. Smells malty, fruity, spicy, bubblegum-y.
British Strong now on tap after about three weeks conditioning.
Very happy with the colour. Flavour is almost spot on, though I think it could have done with slightly (~5 IBU) more bitterness as it's marginally more malt forward than I wanted.
No idea what's going on with the clarity. It's had Protafloc in the kettle, Brausol in the fermenter, was filtered (178 micron) at packaging time AND had gelatin in the keg.
77% Simpson's pale MO
5% Warminster CaraGold
5% Munton's wheat malt
5% Crisp 100 EBC extra light crystal
2% Simpson's DRC
Balance 6% made up with Lyle's golden syrup.
26 IBU of Jester and 12 of Olicana T45 in the boil at 30m
50g Opus and 25g T45 Olicana in the whirlpool.
Copitch of Lallemand London and S-04 for a 1.017 finish.
Very happy with the colour. Flavour is almost spot on, though I think it could have done with slightly (~5 IBU) more bitterness as it's marginally more malt forward than I wanted.
No idea what's going on with the clarity. It's had Protafloc in the kettle, Brausol in the fermenter, was filtered (178 micron) at packaging time AND had gelatin in the keg.
77% Simpson's pale MO
5% Warminster CaraGold
5% Munton's wheat malt
5% Crisp 100 EBC extra light crystal
2% Simpson's DRC
Balance 6% made up with Lyle's golden syrup.
26 IBU of Jester and 12 of Olicana T45 in the boil at 30m
50g Opus and 25g T45 Olicana in the whirlpool.
Copitch of Lallemand London and S-04 for a 1.017 finish.
I like that everybody seems to start some dry yeast copitching experiments. Less work for me to doBritish Strong now on tap after about three weeks conditioning.
Very happy with the colour. Flavour is almost spot on, though I think it could have done with slightly (~5 IBU) more bitterness as it's marginally more malt forward than I wanted.
No idea what's going on with the clarity. It's had Protafloc in the kettle, Brausol in the fermenter, was filtered (178 micron) at packaging time AND had gelatin in the keg.
77% Simpson's pale MO
5% Warminster CaraGold
5% Munton's wheat malt
5% Crisp 100 EBC extra light crystal
2% Simpson's DRC
Balance 6% made up with Lyle's golden syrup.
26 IBU of Jester and 12 of Olicana T45 in the boil at 30m
50g Opus and 25g T45 Olicana in the whirlpool.
Copitch of Lallemand London and S-04 for a 1.017 finish.
.How would you describe this particular mix of yeasts? I was actually also thinking about it. At the moment, I am bottle conditioning a bitter which had 1 pack of lallemand London ale and half a park of Nottingham. This one tastes promising. Only thing is, it's not as clear as it would be with pure Nottingham at this stage. But I'm confident that this will settle. Taste wise, it seems to go into the right direction, we will see.
How is the yeasts expression of your mix?
Pretty similar to London on it's own, truth be told. Which is what I expected and hoped for. I would describe as a touch of apple or maybe pear, and a slight nuttiness which I also get from the likes of WLP002 (Fuller's). Definitely helps elevate some of the dried fruit and honey character from the malt bill, but without leaving it over sweet or cloying like London can be on its own, especially in a higher gravity beer.
The S-04 seems to boost attenuation (important in a 1.072 OG wort I still wanted to finish fairly dry) without losing the richer and more complex body, and seemed to aid flocculation...and did little else I can identify. Which I'd basically all I wanted it to do!
Nice, that sounds like what I was trying to achieve with copitching Nottingham. Good to know that both seem to work. And as S04 has much more character than Notti, I might try this combination in my next bitter... Ok, after I finally checked Mangrove Jacks Liberty Bell Ale. I bought it, so I am gonna use it!
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McMullan
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Looks good for a direct pitch @24h. Key to rousing is to get yeast off the bottom of the FV as well as stirring them back into the wort from the yeast head. Harvest about 60% of the yeast head when it peaks. I reckon you could start harvesting tomorrow. Just spoon some of the yeast head into a large sanitised jar then store it in the fridge. Maybe 2-3 crops into the same jar. Then repitch as soon as possible while it's fresh, a few to several days. It gets more active after one or two repitches.
Kegged it two days ago. Not clear at all, still tastes a bit yeasty. Based on this so far, I would not use London Fog again for any British ales. I was hoping it could be dual use (British and NEIPA), but 002 is far more enjoyable.
I had 3oz of EKG at 15 for 12.5 gallons post boil, and it tastes too hoppy. This yeast may also accentuate hops more than my usual 002.
I'll update in a couple few weeks once it conditions some more.
Roused again at 36hrs. Super thick and creamy.
Krausen falling at 48. Cropped and roused. Clearly quieting down.
At 72hrs, no rousing. Nothing to crop. Smells great, like rich caramel. Gravity sample, 1048 down to 1009. Very green, sharp. Nothing too offensive. A pinch of Fuggle dry hop.
Have been searching for an answer to this question in Pat's Porter! but to no avail.
Many of the stout and porter recipes have a listed AA in the low to high-ish 60%, I know that even mid strength porters (1.050-55-ish) ones would have been vatted in wood barrels for half a year or so before being bottled or shipped out to publicans.
I myself brewed a porter from the late 1800's era that finished at 66%AA, but how are the chances it would have in reality been more attenuated due to brett exposure in the barrels? Most of the beers have quite hefty doses of brown, amber and black malt, often with some crystal aswell so I doubt even brett would chew it down more than maybe ~10 points.
But 66 vs 76% AA is still quite the difference in the final product...
Many of the stout and porter recipes have a listed AA in the low to high-ish 60%, I know that even mid strength porters (1.050-55-ish) ones would have been vatted in wood barrels for half a year or so before being bottled or shipped out to publicans.
I myself brewed a porter from the late 1800's era that finished at 66%AA, but how are the chances it would have in reality been more attenuated due to brett exposure in the barrels? Most of the beers have quite hefty doses of brown, amber and black malt, often with some crystal aswell so I doubt even brett would chew it down more than maybe ~10 points.
But 66 vs 76% AA is still quite the difference in the final product...
Putting together a bit of a recipe for a strong-ish English IPA, designed to be a bit of old-meets-new in terms of ingredients and processes. Something to brew a bit later in the autumn, as for some reason I always get a bit of a hankering for British IPAs when the trees start to shed their leaves.
ABV: 6.8%
OG: 1.065
FG: 1.013
EBC: 16
IBU: 55
BU/GU: 0.84
Malt-wise, want to keep it fairly middle of the road in terms of EBC, with some honey and light caramel character. Quite keen to try Chevalier as it's not that much more expensive than decent MO for me, and supposedly has a great, almost fruity character to it.
Hops, I'm going a mixture of more traditional British styles alongside some of the newer and more exciting stuff to come out of Charles Faram (I've got about a kilo of assorted British hops coming from the Malt Miller, my usual go-to supplier. I wanted to keep some of the classics and favourites in there (notably UK Target and First Gold), but spice (or fruit) things up with some experimental CF185 (floral, peach and citrus) and Harlequin (passion fruit and mango). By my standards not an especially large amount of hops (75g as bittering additions, 100g in the whirlpool and 125 in the dry hop) but should remain roughly to style.
I'll also drop another 50g of CF185 straight into the keg at packaging time.
Plan is to mash fairly low, do a longer than normal boil (I generally only ever do 30m boils these days, and then ferment on the cooler end with WLP007 Dry English Ale before ramping.
ABV: 6.8%
OG: 1.065
FG: 1.013
EBC: 16
IBU: 55
BU/GU: 0.84
Malt-wise, want to keep it fairly middle of the road in terms of EBC, with some honey and light caramel character. Quite keen to try Chevalier as it's not that much more expensive than decent MO for me, and supposedly has a great, almost fruity character to it.
| Malt | Maltster | Quantity | Percentage |
| Chevalier Heritage | Crisp | 5,334 g | 85% |
| Cara Gold | Crisp | 521 g | 8% |
| Wheat Malt | Crisp | 260 g | 4% |
| Extra Light Crystal 100 | Crisp | 195 g | 3% |
Hops, I'm going a mixture of more traditional British styles alongside some of the newer and more exciting stuff to come out of Charles Faram (I've got about a kilo of assorted British hops coming from the Malt Miller, my usual go-to supplier. I wanted to keep some of the classics and favourites in there (notably UK Target and First Gold), but spice (or fruit) things up with some experimental CF185 (floral, peach and citrus) and Harlequin (passion fruit and mango). By my standards not an especially large amount of hops (75g as bittering additions, 100g in the whirlpool and 125 in the dry hop) but should remain roughly to style.
| Hop | Form | IBUs/Quantity | Stage |
| Target | T90 Pellet | 30.6 | 60 Minute Boil |
| First Gold | T90 Pellet | 15.7 | 15 Minute Boil |
| First Gold | T90 Pellet | 3.7 | 20 Minute Whirlpool @75°C |
| Harlequin | T90 Pellet | 4.7 | 20 Minute Whirlpool @75°C |
| Harlequin | T90 Pellet | 60 g | Dry Hop Day 7 |
| CF185 | T90 Pellet | 50 g | Dry Hop Day 7 |
| Target | T90 Pellet | 20 g | Dry Hop Day 7 |
I'll also drop another 50g of CF185 straight into the keg at packaging time.
Plan is to mash fairly low, do a longer than normal boil (I generally only ever do 30m boils these days, and then ferment on the cooler end with WLP007 Dry English Ale before ramping.
Big NO NO NO from me regarding the malt bill if you use chevallier.
Chevallier wants to be used ALONE. It is the perfect malt for what you are describing what you're after. Everything else you might add would turn the end result less incredible. Chevallier does not need any help in terms of flavour. It is superior on its own. In terms of foam, you might leave the wheat, but I actually would not. I'd go 100% chevallier.
Actually.... Now I want to brew a chevallier UK IPA
.Regarding the hops keep it simple and don't overdo late and dry additions. I think you actually overdo it, but that's probably a matter of taste. If I would do UK IPA, I wouldn't go beyond 50g late and 50g dry additions.
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I plan to dry hop for the first time ever my next brew, a pale/light bitter.
20L in the fermenter and ~21L post boil GP as base 1/3 of grains as Vienna, 10% invert 2 OG 1.042 and high 30's IBU.
Late additions will be 0.7g/L First Gold 20 min and 1g/L Fuggle/First Gold 50/50 for a 20 min/80c hopstand.
The dry hop will be a modest 8g of the same hop mix as the hopstand, will likely just chuck em in with the yeast and ferment with the hops in, keg after ~10 days.
20L in the fermenter and ~21L post boil GP as base 1/3 of grains as Vienna, 10% invert 2 OG 1.042 and high 30's IBU.
Late additions will be 0.7g/L First Gold 20 min and 1g/L Fuggle/First Gold 50/50 for a 20 min/80c hopstand.
The dry hop will be a modest 8g of the same hop mix as the hopstand, will likely just chuck em in with the yeast and ferment with the hops in, keg after ~10 days.
I ordered First Gold from Northwest Hop Farms earlier this year. It shows as a 2019 crop but I chatted with them and they promised it was packaged correctly and kept frozen and still good. I have used it and it seems OK but I don't have much to compare to (i.e. past experience with it). Northern / Midwest stopped carrying it. It's almost as if the farms have shut down or switched to something more popular.
If you cannot find any, you can substitute with any nice central european hop like Saaz or Mittelfrüh. Even the Brits do that from time to time... since centuries.
Indeed they have, and I would add that while many British breweries do use Target for bittering, they should be used with great caution, else they can and will spoil the late additions, no matter how beautiful those may be.
For anyone having difficulty obtaining British style hops, I'd suggest 20 to 30 EBU with an obtainable non-aggressive bittering hop, then liberal late additions of Liberty. Most British beers are simple to make.
Spoiling or improving lies in the eye of the beholder.
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*beerholder
Any of the Swedes here who are going to Sthlm beer and whisky festival? I and some other guys hopped on the plane down south yesterday and are going today.
