Stalled RIS, need some advice

[Mischief_Brewing]

I brewed a HUGE RIS (1.138) that has stalled out at 1.040 (about 12.5% abv). I've already added some amylase enzyme and dumped a dry packet of champagne yeast in it to no avail. I boiled some baker's yeast and put that in to see if I could reduce the amount of toxins in it so the yeast would take off again but nothing.

So what I'm planning to do now is make a starter with champagne yeast in a 6 gallon fermenter and then rack the stout onto it at high krausen. I'm just wondering what gravity the starter should be and how much.

Any thoughts? And I'm opposed to beano for the time being, but if I don't have any gravity movement by Thanksgiving, I might change my mind...

 

[ayoungrad]

What was the original yeast? Alcohol tolerance?

How long in primary? Have you been rousing the yeast?

What are your fermentation temps? Where is the temp now?

 

[ChillWill]

I'd make a starter of highish tolerance ale yeast. From what I've read champaign yeast is tolerant of hostile conditions but only good for simple sugar which you may have none of.

 

[Shooter]

How low are you trying to get this? I'm a bit surprised that amylase and more yeast didn't do something.

 

[wolverinebrewer]

Why not post your recipe. There is a possibility that you have a high amount of unfermentables and that it is all done and you will not get anymore out of it.
My last RIS started at 96 and ended at 29 using US05 and it tastes very good.

 

[Mischief_Brewing]

I figured I didn't provide enough info for the likes of you guys...

5-gal batch:
14lbs Golden Promise
2lbs Flaked Barley
1lb Crystal 60L
1lb Flaked Oats
1lb Roasted Barley
.75lb Chocolate
1lb Special B
.25lb Black Patent
3lbs Golden DME
5lbs Wildflower Honey

2 packets of US-05

Hops were Columbus and Summit to 43 IBU

Single Infusion Mashed at 149 for 1 hour

Fermented at 70 for 2 months, added amylase and Champagne yeast and upped the temp to 78 for a week with no movement.


So will another dose af amylase and a champagne yeast starter move this thing? Or am I going to be forced into the beano route. If I do use beano, will it stop or do I need to crash chill when I hit the high 1.020s that I desire?

 

[dcp27]

I wouldnt use beano or waste ur time with moer champagne yeast. WLP099 is your best bet at this point. I had a very similar circumstance with a RIS earlier in the year and amylase & WLP099 took it down into the 20s (started around 140).

 

[smokinghole]

One cheap and easy option would be to rehydrate some US05 with your RIS. Over pitch the living hell with 3-4 packets of US05. If that doesn't work you can go with a two or three tubes of 099. I would suggest a starter but a starter will likely dilute your beer big time. If you want to ensure it finishes out though wlp099 in a large high activity starter will get you done.

 

[scottland]

Build up a HUGE starter of WLP099 and pitch it at high-krausen. That's your only real chance at this point.

 

[brewchez]

You are already at ~72% attentuation. The low end of attenuation for most American Ale yeast strains is 73%. You are done. As evidence by the pitch of extra yeast and beano.

FWIW, Champagne yeast won't do any thing in a beer that is already fermented out any way. Champagne yeasts won't efficiently go after the complex sugars left in beer post ferment. They are used to fermenting simple fruit sugars and can't handle the more complex stuff remaining post a beer yeast.

 

[bh10]

Either WLP099 or Wyeast 3711 will drop it some more, Id also add another .5 lbs of honey.

 

[JonM]

Brew a 1.050 stout, bottle that, and rack your RIS onto the 1.050 stout's cake. (Credit to Evan!) Worked for me when I had a stuck Imperial Porter.

 

[Mischief_Brewing]

You are already at ~72% attentuation. The low end of attenuation for most American Ale yeast strains is 73%. You are done. As evidence by the pitch of extra yeast and beano.

FWIW, Champagne yeast won't do any thing in a beer that is already fermented out any way. Champagne yeasts won't efficiently go after the complex sugars left in beer post ferment. They are used to fermenting simple fruit sugars and can't handle the more complex stuff remaining post a beer yeast.

So even after the dose of amylase (not beano), you think the 1118 won't budge it? Ugh.

I guess I need to order some 099 and brew a 1.050 porter/stout and rack onto the cake.

To be continued...

 

[CA-LT1]

keep us updated, I'm in the same boat

 

[pm5k00]

I've used beano a few times with good results, I get it down to the gravity I want then crash cool and keg, and keep the keg in my keezer to prevent any further fermentation. If your planning on bottleing, I would not carb in bottles as the beano would likely cause problems, instead I would crash cool, filter, keg, force carb then bottle, and keep all bottles in fridge or freezer. I have never used beano and then bottled from fear of bottle bombs but if I had to bottle I would go the route I suggested.

 

[brewchez]

So even after the dose of amylase (not beano), you think the 1118 won't budge it? Ugh.

I guess I need to order some 099 and brew a 1.050 porter/stout and rack onto the cake.

To be continued...

It might move some. I've just never been a big fan of using beano as its difficult to control. But the yeast is already pretty stressed out. Getting it to spring back to life might be tough. Pitching on some yeast cake might help as suggested, but as the alcohol contiues to go up yeast performance will go down regardless of how fresh it is or where its coming from (cake, starter or packaged). 1.138 is a tough starting point to expect much more than what you have.
Its all just my opinion and experience.
Definately keep us posted.

 

[Mischief_Brewing]

I keg all of my beer but if this turns out the way I want, I'd end up bottling off the keg for sending to family and possible competitions, so I'm avoiding beano as much as I can.

I'll be placing an order for 099 but looking at my available brew times over the next few weeks, I might have to wait a bit longer to order. Don't want the yeast sitting around too long.