Purging secondary / bottling bucket with Dry Ice

[binkleybloom]

Hey all,

I'm getting ready for a brew day on this end, pondering how I could purge my secondary and bottling bucket with CO2 since I don't have a keg setup yet.

And I got the idea - why not dry ice? CO2 is slightly heavier than air (at least, that's what Google tells me), so it would seem that if I chucked in a chunk of DI into the vessel du jour, loosely covered the top and let 'er set while the ice dissipated I may be able to get this done for a couple bucks instead of $150 on a tank and regulator.

Any one ever do this, or is there another easier way to purge with CO2 on the cheap?

Cheers!
Tim.

 

[RM-MN]

The big question I have is Why? Why secondary is the first part as most beers don't really benefit from a secondary. Most do just fine right in the primary fermenter. The second is why do it to the bottling bucket? When I transfer the beer to the bottling bucket it usually still has a bit of CO2 dissolved which when transferred will outgas and for a slight CO2 layer that should protect my beer during that short time I leave it in the bucket.

Now, if you have a ready source of dry ice and want to use a secondary, this would work great for purging it. My nearest source is 30 minutes away. Not worth it for me.

 

[brewbush]

I agree with RM-MN
Don't worry about the short air contact time when bottling and secondary if really only necessary for certain beers.

 

[binkleybloom]

Well, I'm going from advice given by a local, experienced home brewer.

My primary reason is I loves me some IPAs. My first brew was an IIPA, that was incredible when I transferred it from the primary to the bottling bucket - I mean, the hop aromas were out of this world. However, now that it has spent about 4 or 5 weeks in the bottle it has plenty of bitterness, but absolutely none of that original knock-your-socks-off aroma.

My buddy suggested that oxygen exposure could be to blame, and suggested purging my bucket CO2 or whenever I use a secondary.

I guess I'm also considering the fact that many very serious home brewers use CO2 pressure to transfer between containers to prevent oxygen exposure as well - I figure if residual CO2 in the beer was enough to perfectly block oxygen exposure, people wouldn't go through these steps, so I'm trying to perfect my process as much as possible while keeping the SWMBO happy.

EDIT: I should also mention that I have a very convenient source of cheap/free dry ice.

 

[RM-MN]

Hop aroma dissipates with time so if you want BIG aroma in a few weeks you have to start with HUGE aroma. I made a pale ale with great aroma but by 2 months much of it was gone and by 3 it just wasn't there. You may have to use more hops when you dry hop.

 

[kilted_brews]

I'd be a bit cautious about throwing a hunk of dry ice into anything plastic or glass. Since dry ice is so cold, your fermenter/bucket could flash freeze and crack. Racking 60 degree beer onto frozen glass or plastic would only exacerbate the problem. It is just something to consider.

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[binkleybloom]

Thanks all.

Interesting thought about flash freezing plastic - I do use both plastic carboys as well as buckets. The bucket is easily rectifiable by placing the DI in a second container that offers a bit of insulation to the surface of the bucket (I'm thinking one of those Glad containers), but the carboy... hmmm...

I hear you about the hop aromas dissipating with time, but in this brew they vanished - I mean GONE when I sampled after one week in the bottle.

The other part of this equation I'm adjusting is my sanitizer. I've been using OneStep all the way through, which I understand is essentially Hydrogen Peroxide. I'm switching to Iodophor for anything post-ferment moving forward in the hopes of reducing the oxygen that potentially is introduced by that.

Maybe that switch will make the CO2 purging a moot point? Time will tell.

Unrelated P.S. I think I've come up with a new idiom this morning: "A watched HLT never gets up to temp". Patience Tim, patience....

 

[helibrewer]

You can improve the aroma/flavor profile by adding a lot of very late and/or whirlpool hops. For flooding the carboy using dry ice you can place the DI on a towel in a fermentation pail. Put the lid on and run a "blow off" tube from the pail lid into the carboy. Place the tube all the way to the bottom of the carboy and sanitize the outside of the tube.

I would use StarSan sanitizer instead of iodophor....iodophor stains everything.


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[binkleybloom]

Ooh - blow off tube is a great idea! Riffing off of that, I'd probably put the DI in my Erlenmeyer flask and run the blowoff tube from there. Little less volume to make up, and the borosilicate glass should have no trouble with the temps.

Thanks!