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Getting interesting in the playoff race... Big night tonight.

  • Hop To It was already a playoff lock before this week. There's a halfway decent chance they'll lose this week's matchup, but as it is to LoneTreeFarms, it doesn't impact the playoffs.
  • Big Gulps appears to have locked down playoff spot #2 with a win over Bar Flies. That knocks Bar Flies out of contention even with tiebreakers.
  • Mr IPA and Mrs Blonde (me) is in a very tight race with HBT Football Team. I'm down 9.16 points with two players left to play, so while I'm projected to win, we all know that players can throw up duds at any time. If I win, that locks down playoff spot #3 and pushes HBTFT out of contention for tiebreaker. If HBTFT wins, then playoff spot #3 comes down to 9-6 teams and tiebreakers, and both my team and HBTFT will be in than 9-6 split.
  • The fourth 9-5 team, Big Wheel Brewing, is VERY likely to lose tonight to fill my KUPP. That would mean that playoff spot #4 would come down to the 9-6 tiebreakers as well, and both teams will be in that tiebreaker.
So absent craziness, we have at least one playoff spot, and possibly two, that will come down to the 9-6 tiebreaker.

Interestingly, Dawg Pound and Just Joshin are both 8-6, and both facing derelict teams, and NEITHER is a lock to improve to 9-6.

  • Dawg Pound is projected ~13 points over Bo Knows, but Bo Knows still has Jalen Hurts remaining. QB projections in this league are always low due to the 0.5 point per completion scoring for QB, so if this is a pass-happy game for Hurts, he can make that up. That said, Dawg Pound has two Philly receivers (WR/TE), so one would think a good day from Hurts probably benefits one or both of them enough to keep a lead. Stranger things have happened, though.
  • Just Joshin has the Seahawks D/ST remaining and is going up against Birds of War who still has Russell Wilson to play. Just Joshin is projected ~16 points over Birds of War, but as mentioned, with QB projections always low, the true gap is narrower than that. In what could be a shootout with the Rams offense, and potentially then a bad score for the Seahawks defense, this one could get crazy.
So we could have as few as 2 teams tied at 9-6 for one playoff spot, and as many as 6 teams tied at 9-6 for two playoff spots.
 
Have you found out how tie breakers are determined? I’m not sure. It should be default nfl.com settings. Online I found info if we used divisions. I need to get to a computer to dive deeper. From my phone, it just gives me choices but not explainations. So far I think it’s based on who has the best record within the teams tied, but I need to find out if our league is setup this way.
 
lupulinaddict said:
Have you found out how tie breakers are determined? I’m not sure. It should be default nfl.com settings. Online I found info if we used divisions. I need to get to a computer to dive deeper. From my phone, it just gives me choices but not explainations. So far I think it’s based on who has the best record within the teams tied, but I need to find out if our league is setup this way.
Click to expand...
Tiebreaker is head-to-head record. So if you and i have the same W/L record, but when you and I played each other you won, then you are ahead in the rankings.

BUT! I don't know for sure how it handles things if you and I played each other twice and each won once. It LOOKs like the tiebreaker is whoever won the most recent matchup.

AND! No clue what it does if you, me and Mr. IPA are tied, I beat him, he beat you, and you beat me. Draw straws?
 
It's H2H (or H2H2H or H2H2H2H etc) record amongst tied teams. Here is how I know they do it for college football conference standings...

Let's say 4 teams are tied and, due to double-plays, two of those teams went 1-1 against each other. Let's also say there are two playoff spots remaining.

Team A: 2-1 against the other teams (lost to team B, beat Teams C and D)
Team B: 2-2 against the other teams (1-1 against team C, beat Team A, lost to team D)
Team C: 2-2 against the other teams (1-1 against team C, lost to Team A, beat team D)
Team D: 1-2 against the other teams (beat team B, lost to Teams A and C)

In this case Team A would win the tie and gets the first playoff spot.

You then take Team A out, and re-run the system with only teams B/C/D remaining.

Team B: 1-2 against the other teams (1-1 against team C, lost to team D)
Team C: 2-1 against the other teams (1-1 against team B, beat team D)
Team D: 1-1 against the other teams (beat team B, lost to team C)

Team C would then win the tie and get the second playoff spot.

In college conferences, if you have two teams that are tied and there is no H2H advantage, usually they'll do best record against the #1 team in the league, followed by #2 team in the league (if still tied), etc etc.

In Fantasy, often the tiebreaker is total points scored. So if three teams are all tied and all 1-1 against the other two, the team with the most total points scored advances. But I can't find that in the NFL.com league settings.

----------

BTW all this crazy H2H record amongst tied teams is why I haven't tried to figure out tiebreakers. You have to come up with every permutation, and as mentioned we could have as few as 2 teams tied for one playoff spot, and as many as 6 teams tied for 2 playoff spots. I don't have the time to figure out every scenario lol... I'll wait until after the games are played and see what NFL.com tells us happened!
 
Potential thoughts for 2022:

  1. Move off NFL.com. I've only played ESPN in the past but it's a superior platform, and I've heard a lot of people don't even like ESPN as a platform...
  2. For a 12-team league, make it 6 playoff spots over three weeks, with the 1 and 2 seed have a bye for the first round. While this year we had a VERY tight race going into the playoffs, that is not normal and usually there's more separation. Having 6 playoff teams keeps everyone more engaged later into the year.
  3. Add the IR spot. It helps managers keep players who are out without QUITE as big of an effect on their roster. Especially with the new 3-week IR rather than the 8-week minimum IR that used to exist in the NFL.
  4. Vet the managers pre-season to make sure we don't have derelict teams...
  5. Make some reward for the #2 and #3 teams. I.e. the #4 team has to send beer to #3, the #5 and #6 teams have to send beer to the #2, and teams #7 through #12 have to send beer to #1. Usually in money leagues you have something for the #2 and #3. In this case I've worked my butt off to get to the playoffs, but now it's a two-week all-or-nothing proposition to get any reward, and even if I finish #2, I'm sending beer to #1... IMHO top three should all receive beer, just less for #2 than #1, and less for #3 than #2.
Just my $0.02...
 
betarhoalphadelta said:
Potential thoughts for 2022:

  1. Move off NFL.com. I've only played ESPN in the past but it's a superior platform, and I've heard a lot of people don't even like ESPN as a platform...
  2. For a 12-team league, make it 6 playoff spots over three weeks, with the 1 and 2 seed have a bye for the first round. While this year we had a VERY tight race going into the playoffs, that is not normal and usually there's more separation. Having 6 playoff teams keeps everyone more engaged later into the year.
  3. Add the IR spot. It helps managers keep players who are out without QUITE as big of an effect on their roster. Especially with the new 3-week IR rather than the 8-week minimum IR that used to exist in the NFL.
  4. Vet the managers pre-season to make sure we don't have derelict teams...
  5. Make some reward for the #2 and #3 teams. I.e. the #4 team has to send beer to #3, the #5 and #6 teams have to send beer to the #2, and teams #7 through #12 have to send beer to #1. Usually in money leagues you have something for the #2 and #3. In this case I've worked my butt off to get to the playoffs, but now it's a two-week all-or-nothing proposition to get any reward, and even if I finish #2, I'm sending beer to #1... IMHO top three should all receive beer, just less for #2 than #1, and less for #3 than #2.
Just my $0.02...
Click to expand...
1. I don't have complaints, but it's been a long time since I used anything other than nfl.com, so, I don't know what i'm missing

2. Seems like the extra week in the NFL season helps the argument for this. On the other hand, we really had a 10 person league, and we can assume those two won't be back next year, so unless we get some new interest, 60% of teams make the playoffs. If we lose any others, 6 really seems like too many.

3. Agree. This is definitely magnified by the COVID reserves right now. We can hope that won't be back next year but... (*sigh* I need a drink.)

4. An oversight this year, definitely a mistake to not make again.

5. I've thought about this some before, but I'm not sure how well it will work. My suggestion in the past is that 2nd place doesn't ship beer. (We'll say 2nd place has to buy themselves beer. STRICTLY ENFORCED!) Problem I see with spreading it down farther is that unlike a money league, it doesn't necessarily split so evenly, again consider that we really had 10 people in the league, not 12.
 
Yeah, 10-person league, 4 playoff makes sense. I think when you get to 12, 6 is better. Especially as you get to 12 and the talent pool gets shallow, managers need to work harder week-in and week-out than 10-person leagues.
 
betarhoalphadelta said:
Potential thoughts for 2022:

  1. Move off NFL.com. I've only played ESPN in the past but it's a superior platform, and I've heard a lot of people don't even like ESPN as a platform...
  2. For a 12-team league, make it 6 playoff spots over three weeks, with the 1 and 2 seed have a bye for the first round. While this year we had a VERY tight race going into the playoffs, that is not normal and usually there's more separation. Having 6 playoff teams keeps everyone more engaged later into the year.
  3. Add the IR spot. It helps managers keep players who are out without QUITE as big of an effect on their roster. Especially with the new 3-week IR rather than the 8-week minimum IR that used to exist in the NFL.
  4. Vet the managers pre-season to make sure we don't have derelict teams...
  5. Make some reward for the #2 and #3 teams. I.e. the #4 team has to send beer to #3, the #5 and #6 teams have to send beer to the #2, and teams #7 through #12 have to send beer to #1. Usually in money leagues you have something for the #2 and #3. In this case I've worked my butt off to get to the playoffs, but now it's a two-week all-or-nothing proposition to get any reward, and even if I finish #2, I'm sending beer to #1... IMHO top three should all receive beer, just less for #2 than #1, and less for #3 than #2.
Just my $0.02...
Click to expand...
1. In the league (co-workers), where I'm the commish, I moved from ESPN to Yahoo. Each site has it's pros and cons. I'm good with whatever is selected, though.

2. Half the league making the playoffs might be a bit much. Now if it were a 14 team league, then 6 teams would work out pretty good.
(EDIT: If there were enough teams for two leagues, the three bottom teams move to the "B" team the following year, while the 3 top teams of the B team would move to the "A" team. Just a thought)

3. Regarding the IR spot. Is this something that can be abused? Possibly hoarding players?

4. It seems that there are derelict teams every year. In other leagues, I have seen teams that would play, make moves and so on.... but as soon as there are some back to back losses, they lose interest.

5. This is a tough one. I've got nothing.
 
Last edited:
In the Yahoo leagues that I play you are allowed a certain number of IR spots. (it's 2 in one, and 4 in another) But, if a player becomes available you're not allowed to make any roster add/drops unless you move that player from the IR spot. This eliminates any hording of players.

In those leagues I had a bigger issue with managers taking advantage of unlimited add/drops, since that places players on waivers instead of being a Free Agent after the waiver claims are processed. So we instituted a weekly add/drop maximum.

I also like the thought of rewarding the second place team. I would be willing to send #2 a couple of beers, since it will fit in a USPS Flat rate box for cheap. :)
 
Congrats Just Joshin!

Quite a good season--you led the league in points scored AGAINST you, but still managed to fight through that to the playoffs and the championship. Impressive!

Shoot me a PM with your address and I'll get something out to you. I'm in Southern California if you want anything West Coast... I can semi-regularly find Russian River stuff (more their normal bottled stuff than the sours--those are still hard to find).
 
Thanks guys! Who would have thought, huh?

I'll put together a PM and send it out in a bit. It was as fun as it always has been. Looking forward to next year already!

Thanks @betarhoalphadelta for the fantastic breakdowns. They had me believing I was out of it, but enjoyed them none the less.
 

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