Dry yeast vs liquid

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Lsrc11

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I brewed about 5 - 10 extract batch and a few all grain now and I was thinking of using some dry yeast next time it's a lot cheaper no cold storage need is there any draw backs benefits and what are some good strains
 

beergolf

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I like US-05 for APA/IPA's. or any brew that does not depend on the yeast for flavor.

I just aerate my wort and pitch it. Always ferments out nicely. Good neutral flavor.
 

scotched

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Nottingham is common/popular dry beer yeast.
Just don't let it go above 70F, it starts to taste like crap.
 
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Lsrc11

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Do the specialty liquid yeast have better tolerance to temp cuz my carboy is always in the 65-74 range and I don't get any funky flavors. The thing is I'm alway brewing a specialty beers like NB golden dragon and different ales like mike chocolate stouts. So if I'm going to brew a simple American ale I think dry yeast is the way to go.
 

jaycount

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Simple american ale? Yeah I'd probably just use US-05. As beergolf said, I tend to only use liquid yeasts for beers that really require a certain yeast for flavors.

The liquid yeasts don't necessarily have a better tolerance for temps, they all have their own ranges depending on the strain. If anything I'd say the dry yeasts (usually) tend to have a wider range of suggested fermentation temps than the liquid ones.

And I agree about not letting Notty get above 70*F, made my cream ale suck!
 
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Lsrc11

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Thanks for the info guys I did some research and also found that besides being more expensive liquid yeast has better cell counts less mutated cells and can be recycled for another so for me liquid is the way to go but I have added some dry yeast at bottling for high gravity beers and it's works great.
 

rollinred

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Take this for what it is worth.

Ever since switching to dry yeast my beers have tasted a lot better.

The only thing I can come up with as far as why this happens is that dry yeast requires no aeration of the wort. I think when I was using liquid yeast, the yeast was stressed and causing off flavors.

This seems to be a common thing for a lot of people.

I do agree with the other though, some beers need special strains of yeast for their flavor. But I will use dry yeast in every case I can until I get an O2 kit from Williams brewing.
 

jsweet

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There's a pro/con list on here somewhere...

Anyway, yeah, I use US-05 for most stuff. There was recently an experiment where somebody compared two identical batches, one with US-05 and the other with WLP-001, and sent samples to folks for blind taste tests. There was no consensus as to which was better, though there was a consensus that the liquid was a little "cleaner" tasting. But that doesn't mean much.
 

Revvy

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Thanks for the info guys I did some research and also found that besides being more expensive liquid yeast has better cell counts less mutated cells and can be recycled for another so for me liquid is the way to go but I have added some dry yeast at bottling for high gravity beers and it's works great.
Sounds like you have a bunch of half truths and anti dry yeast propganda that you are using to make your decision. Your going by bad information.

1) The "mutation" idea is a myth, and has largely been disproven. Yeast today is grown under the most vigorous and cleanest of lab conditions, and a modern yeast lab is going to separate good yeast from "mutated yeast," if they have to.

2) Dry yeast once fermented can and is just as recylable as pure liguid cultures. Lots of folks, myself included, have washed and stored and re-used their us-05, notty, etc. You treat it exactly as you would liquid yeast.

3) Liquid yeast has LESS cell count than it's dry counterpart, that's why we need to make starters for beers with a gravity of 1.030 and higher.

If you're brewing a standard ale it's a waste of time and money to use liquid yeast. Dry yeast is fine for 99% of the brewing we do.

I have found that a lot of new brewers especially, THINK they HAVE to use liquid yeast, but in reality most ales can be made with Notty, Windsor, Us-05, Us-04 and many lagers with basic Saflager.....7-8 bucks a pop for liquid as opposed to $1.50-2.50 for dry, with more cell count, is imho just a waste of money for the majority of a brewer's recipe bank...most commercial ales us a limited range of strains, and those liquid strains are really the same strains that the afore mentioned dry strains cover, for example Us-05 is the famed "Chico strain", so if you are paying 7-8 bucks for Wyeast 1056 American/Chico Ale Yeast, and you STILL have to make a starter to have enough viable cells, then you are ripping yourself off, in terms of time and money....

I use dry yeast for 99% of my beers, for basic ales I use safale 05, for more british styles I us safale 04 and for basic lagers I use saflager..

The only time I use liquid yeast is if I am making a beer where the yeast drives the style, where certain flavor characteristics are derived from the yeast, such as phenols. Like Belgian beers, where you get spicy/peppery flavors from the yeast and higher temp fermentation. Or let's say a wheat beer (needing a lowly flocculant yest) or a Kholsch, where the style of the beer uses a specific yeast strain that is un available in dry form.

But if you are looking for a "clean" yeast profile, meaning about 90% of american ales, the 05, or nottingham is the way to go. Need "Bready" or yeasty for English ales, then 04 or windsor. Want a clean, low profile lager yeast- saflager usually does the trick.

If the kit is fresh, then the yeast that comes with it will be fine.

The idea of dry yeast is "bad" is really a holdover from the bad old days of homebrew prohibition (prior to 1978 in america) when yeast came over in hot ship cargo holds, was of indeterminant pedigree and may have sat on the shelves under those cans of blue ribbon malt extract in the grocery store for god knows how long. That is simply not the case in the 21st century- all yeasts, liquid or dry ave excellent and can be used, EVEN the stuff that comes with kits.

Even John Palmer, who's book How to brew, I really think you need to read BEFORE you try to tackle kai (consider it the Grey's anatomy of brewing books) doesn't bash dry yeast.

Palmer doesn't bash dry yeasts...

Yeast come in two main product forms, dry and liquid. (There is also another form, available as pure cultures on petri dishes or slants, but it is generally used as one would use liquid yeast.) Dry yeast are select, hardy strains that have been dehydrated for storability. There are a lot of yeast cells in a typical 7 gram packet. For best results, it needs to be re-hydrated before it is pitched. For the first-time brewer, a dry ale yeast is highly recommended.

Dry yeast is convenient for the beginning brewer because the packets provide a lot of viable yeast cells, they can be stored for extended periods of time and they can be prepared quickly on brewing day. It is common to use one or two packets (7 - 14 grams) of dried yeast for a typical five gallon batch. This amount of yeast, when properly re-hydrated, provides enough active yeast cells to ensure a strong fermentation. Dry yeast can be stored for extended periods (preferably in the refrigerator) but the packets do degrade with time. This is one of the pitfalls with brewing from the no-name yeast packets taped to the top of a can of malt extract. They are probably more than a year old and may not be very viable. It is better to buy another packet or three of a reputable brewer's yeast that has been kept in the refrigerator at the brewshop. Some leading and reliable brands of dry yeast are DCL Yeast, Yeast Labs (marketed by G.W. Kent, produced by Lallemand of Canada), Cooper's, DanStar (produced by Lallemand), Munton & Fison and Edme.

Dry yeasts are good but the rigor of the dehydration process limits the number of different ale strains that are available and in the case of dry lager yeast, eliminates them almost entirely. A few dry lager yeasts do exist, but popular opinion is that they behave more like ale yeasts than lager. DCL Yeast markets two strains of dry lager yeast, Saflager S-189 and S-23, though only S-23 is currently available in a homebrewing size. The recommended fermentation temperature is 48-59°F. I would advise you to use two packets per 5 gallon batch to be assured of a good pitching rate.

The only thing missing with dry yeast is real individuality, which is where liquid yeasts come in. Many more different strains of yeast are available in liquid form than in dry.

Liquid yeast used to come in 50 ml foil pouches, and did not contain as many yeast cells as in the dry packets. The yeast in these packages needed to be grown in a starter wort to bring the cell counts up to a more useful level. In the past few years, larger 175 ml pouches (Wyeast Labs) and ready-to-pitch tubes (White Labs) have become the most popular forms of liquid yeast packaging and contain enough viable cells to ferment a five gallon batch.
The Yeast like Notty, Us-05, u-04, and many others, made my Danstar, and fermentis are some of the best yeast around, they are just as good as the liquid strains, in fact, many are the exact same strains as those by whitelabs, and wyyeast, just in dry forms.

Good quality dry yeast has been used by commercial breweries for decades if not longer, and it was only since Homebrewing was legalized was the stuff we know available to homebrewers.

That's why every dry yeast house has industrial divisions.

Danstars website even alludes to this...

The use of active dried professional yeasts for amateur brewing is a relatively new phenomenon introduced by Lallemand. Now, choose your active dried yeast for brewing with confidence. Ask for Danstar superior quality yeasts at your local retailer.
And this from Fermentis....Beer Industrial Brewing Why use Fermentis Yeast

Bottom line, use what you want, but realize that is only a preference. Both liquid and dry are excellent these days. They both have the potential to make great or crappy beer.

There is so little "Better" in brewing. Ideas like Liquid vs dry, or glass vs plastic arguments are idiotic. They ALL make beer. That's why we have so many choices available to us. Not that one is any better or worse than others, just that there's more than one way to do most things in this hobby.

There's a saying ask 10 homebrewers the same question and you'll get 12 different answers, and they'll all be the right ones.

It's not about what's best, just what's best for you. Just make sure the reasons you choose to do something are not based on myths and half truths, but your own experience.
 

melchermatt

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Knock yourself out with the dry yeast - as Revvy says, it's a great product and absolutely appropriate for the vast majority of your brewing. That being said, I get kind of tired of US-05. It dries everything out and can take a while to floc. I say find yourself a couple of strains you like, and stick with them, whether they are dry or liquid.
 
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Lsrc11

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Revvy said:
Sounds like you have a bunch of half truths and anti dry yeast propganda that you are using to make your decision. Your going by bad information.

1) The "mutation" idea is a myth, and has largely been disproven. Yeast today is grown under the most vigorous and cleanest of lab conditions, and a modern yeast lab is going to separate good yeast from "mutated yeast," if they have to.

2) Dry yeast once fermented can and is just as recylable as pure liguid cultures. Lots of folks, myself included, have washed and stored and re-used their us-05, notty, etc. You treat it exactly as you would liquid yeast.

3) Liquid yeast has LESS cell count than it's dry counterpart, that's why we need to make starters for beers with a gravity of 1.030 and higher.

If you're brewing a standard ale it's a waste of time and money to use liquid yeast. Dry yeast is fine for 99% of the brewing we do.

I have found that a lot of new brewers especially, THINK they HAVE to use liquid yeast, but in reality most ales can be made with Notty, Windsor, Us-05, Us-04 and many lagers with basic Saflager.....7-8 bucks a pop for liquid as opposed to $1.50-2.50 for dry, with more cell count, is imho just a waste of money for the majority of a brewer's recipe bank...most commercial ales us a limited range of strains, and those liquid strains are really the same strains that the afore mentioned dry strains cover, for example Us-05 is the famed "Chico strain", so if you are paying 7-8 bucks for Wyeast 1056 American/Chico Ale Yeast, and you STILL have to make a starter to have enough viable cells, then you are ripping yourself off, in terms of time and money....

I use dry yeast for 99% of my beers, for basic ales I use safale 05, for more british styles I us safale 04 and for basic lagers I use saflager..

The only time I use liquid yeast is if I am making a beer where the yeast drives the style, where certain flavor characteristics are derived from the yeast, such as phenols. Like Belgian beers, where you get spicy/peppery flavors from the yeast and higher temp fermentation. Or let's say a wheat beer (needing a lowly flocculant yest) or a Kholsch, where the style of the beer uses a specific yeast strain that is un available in dry form.

But if you are looking for a "clean" yeast profile, meaning about 90% of american ales, the 05, or nottingham is the way to go. Need "Bready" or yeasty for English ales, then 04 or windsor. Want a clean, low profile lager yeast- saflager usually does the trick.

If the kit is fresh, then the yeast that comes with it will be fine.

The idea of dry yeast is "bad" is really a holdover from the bad old days of homebrew prohibition (prior to 1978 in america) when yeast came over in hot ship cargo holds, was of indeterminant pedigree and may have sat on the shelves under those cans of blue ribbon malt extract in the grocery store for god knows how long. That is simply not the case in the 21st century- all yeasts, liquid or dry ave excellent and can be used, EVEN the stuff that comes with kits.

Even John Palmer, who's book How to brew, I really think you need to read BEFORE you try to tackle kai (consider it the Grey's anatomy of brewing books) doesn't bash dry yeast.

Palmer doesn't bash dry yeasts...

The Yeast like Notty, Us-05, u-04, and many others, made my Danstar, and fermentis are some of the best yeast around, they are just as good as the liquid strains, in fact, many are the exact same strains as those by whitelabs, and wyyeast, just in dry forms.

Good quality dry yeast has been used by commercial breweries for decades if not longer, and it was only since Homebrewing was legalized was the stuff we know available to homebrewers.

That's why every dry yeast house has industrial divisions.

Danstars website even alludes to this...

And this from Fermentis....Beer Industrial Brewing Why use Fermentis Yeast

Bottom line, use what you want, but realize that is only a preference. Both liquid and dry are excellent these days. They both have the potential to make great or crappy beer.

There is so little "Better" in brewing. Ideas like Liquid vs dry, or glass vs plastic arguments are idiotic. They ALL make beer. That's why we have so many choices available to us. Not that one is any better or worse than others, just that there's more than one way to do most things in this hobby.

There's a saying ask 10 homebrewers the same question and you'll get 12 different answers, and they'll all be the right ones.

It's not about what's best, just what's best for you. Just make sure the reasons you choose to do something are not based on myths and half truths, but your own experience.
Sounds like it's up to the individual to choose liquid or dry based on the style of beer and montery factor and many of the other factors you mentioned. Good post thanks for the info
 

Patirck

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I have only used dry yeast a few times (US-05, US-04, Nottingham and Windsor) and found that it did dry it out a bit more than I liked. Is there a dry yeast that is more like wyeast 1338 euro ale? I would like to use dry yeast but I like more malty styles and I have not had good luck so far with those.
 

pauswa

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If you want the beer to be less dried out, you can mash a slightly bit higher for all-grain. If you do extract, you can add a little carapils or a little more crystal malt, or even an ounce or two of maltodextrin. I find Coopers yeast has a nice flavor and doesn't dry out beer. I always get my estimated final gravity according to Beersmith when I use Coopers. It comes in 7 gm or 15 gm packages. It's very vigorous yeast!

I live in a very hot climate in southern California, and I'm not near a brew store, so I rely on my brewing supplies via mail (mainly Austin Homebrew Supply since I'm pleased with their great customer service). Shipping liquid yeast is absolutely not an option in the summer here. But I can stock up on dry yeast for the whole year and store it in my refrigerator in a very small space. I can't think of anything negative about dry yeast for basic brewing. If I want to use liquid, I will wait until December when the average daily temperatures are in the 60s here, then I might brew a California Common Beer. Otherwise, the beers I like most are English ales, blonde beers, and witbiers, and I can use Safale or Coopers for those.
 

drocu

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I think Revvy's post should be a sticky. This is a forum about yeast, after all. I was just contemplating why I even bother with liquid strains when the US-05 I just pitched had signs of active fermentation after less than 6 hrs and is cheaper.
 
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