Combining Ale and Lager yeasts in a single brew

[snarf7]

Anyone ever tried something like this? Once you dropped below a certain temp the ale yeast would go mostly dormant and the lager yeast would take over. Not sure if pitching them at the same time or pitch the ale yeast first at 65 then drop to 50 and pitch lager yeast?

 

[couchsending]

What would your goal be? Or what kind of beer are you wanting to make?

 

[snarf7]

What would your goal be? Or what kind of beer are you wanting to make?

Experimentation I guess. Plus combining the qualities of each that I like...the depth and estery qualities of an ale but with a crisp, dry, clean finish.

 

[STMF]

I don't understand. Do you want it estery or clean? Do you want crisp and dry or with depth?

 

[S-Met]

I don't understand. Do you want it estery or clean? Do you want crisp and dry or with depth?

I think this is exactly what he's looking to attain:
Estery clean with a crisp and dry depth finish.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Experimentation I guess. Plus combining the qualities of each that I like...the depth and estery qualities of an ale but with a crisp, dry, clean finish.

There's no great advantage in doing this with ale + lager - the dry finish can be achieved by any high-attenuating yeast. High attenuating yeast tend to be a bit boring flavour-wise, which is why most traditional British breweries use a mix of low-attenuating-but-flavourful strains and high-attenuating-but-boring strains. Windsor and Nottingham are a classic example of such a pairing. So what you're suggesting is not really any different to how British breweries have worked for centuries.

The big advantage of lager yeast is that they are clean - but cofermenting with ale yeast means that cleanness is "ruined" by the ale flavours.

 

[Silver_Is_Money]

Within the realm of dry yeasts the simple solution here is to use Nottingham dry yeast. It ferments well from 52 degrees F. to 64 degrees F., and its attenuation is high, and it is clean at lower temperatures. It is as close to a lager yeast as an ale yeast can get.

Fermentis K-97 ale yeast would stand next in line here. It attenuates as well or better than just about any true lager yeast. And it is clean.

But I think some of the confusion here is the belief that some portion of lagering is due to the yeast. To lager means specifically and quite literally to store. You can cold store any beer to improve certain of its characteristics. The yeast used is irrelevant to this end.

 

[Conehead]

You can try WLP080 Cream Ale yeast blend. A blend of lager and ale yeast. I used it a few years ago and was quite please with the result. It was a simple Blonde Ale with 5% Crystal 10.

 

[Pappers_]

You can try WLP080 Cream Ale yeast blend. A blend of lager and ale yeast. I used it a few years ago and was quite please with the result. It was a simple Blonde Ale with 5% Crystal 10.

Or the California Common yeasts, same theory.

 

[snarf7]

Interesting replies, thanks for the insight gang. I'm just getting started with lagers so that's what got me thinking. I might do an experiment where I separate out a 1 gallon batch and use the yeast combo so I compare with the regular treatment

 

[Silver_Is_Money]

Interesting replies, thanks for the insight gang. I'm just getting started with lagers so that's what got me thinking. I might do an experiment where I separate out a 1 gallon batch and use the yeast combo so I compare with the regular treatment

I always wanted to do that with W-34/70 and Nottingham, and with both fermenting at 52-53 degrees F., to see if I can tell any difference. My guess is that any differences would be subtle, if detectable at all.

Brulosophy, are you watching?

 

[GHBWNY]

Interesting replies, thanks for the insight gang. I'm just getting started with lagers so that's what got me thinking. I might do an experiment where I separate out a 1 gallon batch and use the yeast combo so I compare with the regular treatment

Go for it and let us know how it works out. Either way, you'll still have beer.

 

[snarf7]

I always wanted to do that with W-34/70 and Nottingham, and with both fermenting at 52-53 degrees F., to see if I can tell any difference. My guess is that any differences would be subtle, if detectable at all.

Brulosophy, are you watching?

Hmm yeah, that's actually a better idea than what I was thinking initially, just put it at one temp and let them duke it out. I'm a big fan of Nottingham and I've noted that it does just fine at lower temps (my basement ranges from 48-58 depending on time of year and how cold the temp is outside, I can usually dial in the range I want just by where I place it - warmer on the steps leading up, colder against an exterior wall etc).