Yeast starter for pressure lager (~68 F ferm)

[Zippy123]

I just finished my first keezer and in the process I couldn't pass up a few extra corny kegs at a good price. So now I am researching how to pressure ferment a lager at ale temps. Everything I've read and watched on YouTube says something to the effect, "Make a yeast starter, then pitch the yeast." But I cannot find any details at all on creating a starter for a lager yeast that will be pitched at ale temp for pressure fermenting. I assume one would want to do more than a simple re-hydration as I formerly did with ale yeast. I've also read (somewhere on this forum) that overpitching of lager yeast is necessary when doing pressure fermenting, but again no details, just "you need to overpitch".

I would like to do the starter the most simple and reliable way possible, without any extra equipment like a stir plate. My likely first attempt will use Safelager W34/70 and batch size will be about 4 gallons. My instinct is, I need to make a few cups of simple wort with boiled DME cooled to ferm temp, then pitch the (ferm temp) lager yeast and let it get started, then pitch into the waiting batch of wort. If I am correct, I only need to know how much water and DME, number of yeast packs to use, whether or not to decant the liquid before pitching, and roughly how long it will take for the starter to be viable/reliable. Besides that I think I know everything! Help!

 

[rtstrider]

I'd say make a 2L 1.040 starter and let it ferment out. I just ran successive pressure fermented batches of WLP830 which is supposedly the same strain. My pressure was 15 psi and the ambient temp was 66F. Good luck!

 

[Franktalk]

I think that the need for more yeast in lagers has much to do with fermentation temp. If you are fermenting at ale temps you don't need a lager sized pitch. I pressure ferment all of my lagers at 68 with one packet of dry yeast, and they are done in ten days and come out squeaky clean. I hold the fermentation at 15 psi.

 

[Zippy123]

I think that the need for more yeast in lagers has much to do with fermentation temp. If you are fermenting at ale temps you don't need a lager sized pitch. I pressure ferment all of my lagers at 68 with one packet of dry yeast, and they are done in ten days and come out squeaky clean. I hold the fermentation at 15 psi.

Good info. To clarify, you're not making a starter at all? Just pitching the dry lager yeast right on top of the wort in the ferm when it's near 68 deg?

 

[rtstrider]

Good info. To clarify, you're not making a starter at all? Just pitching the dry lager yeast right on top of the wort in the ferm when it's near 68 deg?

I've had less than optimal results when not using a starter with W34/70 in general

 

[HighVoltageMan!]

A single packet of 34/70 @ 68F will work fine. I like to hydrate the yeast prior to pitch, but you don't have to. If your going to pitch it at 48-50 you're going to need a lot of yeast. Then I would suggest a 3 liter starter with one pack of 34/70 or 2-3 packets of dry yeast with no starter. I haven't had any trouble with 34/70 without a starter and I do both.

I would highly recommend starting your lager brewing with 34/70 without a starter (and hydrating yeast for a faster start) because if you build a starter with dry yeast you will need to treat it as a liquid yeast and proper aeration is required. Dry yeast straight from the packet can withstand a low oxygen environment and still produce a really good beer.

 

[Franktalk]

Good info. To clarify, you're not making a starter at all? Just pitching the dry lager yeast right on top of the wort in the ferm when it's near 68 deg?

Yes, that is correct.

 

[Zippy123]

For my first try I'll pitch directly from the pouch. If the results are not acceptable then I'll try a simple rehydration before pitch. If that doesn't produce acceptable results then I'll ask for help again.

Thanks all for sharing your experience.

 

[Ramjet]

I have done 3 lagers pressure fermenting at 64 degrees 12 psi. I just pitch one pack of yeast no starter, no rehydration and it worked fine. All beers came out good

 

[rtstrider]

For my first try I'll pitch directly from the pouch. If the results are not acceptable then I'll try a simple rehydration before pitch. If that doesn't produce acceptable results then I'll ask for help again.

Thanks all for sharing your experience.

If doing a direct pitch I'd recommend 2 packs of Cellarscience German yeast from morebeer. That'll get you a much higher cell count for almost the price of a single pack of 34/70. It's the same strain

 

[rallenhall]

I've directly pitched dry Diamond into a pressure fermentation of 15 psi. No problems. Repitching on the yeast cake will require O2.