Why doesn’t everyone BIAB?

[fendersrule]

Ooh, digital thermometer that's remote? Can you post a link? I'm really interested in this. That way, I can fully close my kettle during mashing to help keep the temps up.

 

[LittleRiver]

Ooh, digital thermometer that's remote? Can you post a link? I'm really interested in this. That way, I can fully close my kettle during mashing to help keep the temps up.

Thermoworks ChefAlarm. I like the hi/lo temp alarms and the built-in timer. In this post there's more info.

 

[RM-MN]

Wildy guestimating here...if I use 12lbs of grain for a double batch for a partial mash, I would probably be using aroudn 24lbs of grains for BIAB. 24 x 2 = 48qt of water needed for mashing. That right there is already 12 gallons, which pretty much pre-boil for a double batch. If I used 1.5 quarts per pound that would be 9 gallons.

Before you do too much calculating on the amount of water and grains to use to fit a 10 gallon batch in your 15 gallon pot, do a smaller batch to see where your brewhouse efficiency falls. If you own a mill and set it tight to maximize the efficiency, you may find that you don't need as much grain as you think. With my small batches and double sparging to get the pre-boil volume (due to too small of a pot) I tend to use about 5 pounds of grain for a 3 gallon batch. That would make your grain bill about 18 pounds, quite a bit less than the 24 you are estimating.

 

[z-bob]

With my small batches and double sparging to get the pre-boil volume (due to too small of a pot) I tend to use about 5 pounds of grain for a 3 gallon batch. That would make your grain bill about 18 pounds, quite a bit less than the 24 you are estimating.

I use about 7.5 to 8 pounds of malt for 4 gallons, and I never brew anything under 5.5% ABV. (I've tried brewing lower alcohol beers and I'm not good enough yet; they turn out too "thin" and watery)

 

[wilserbrewer]

Ooh, digital thermometer that's remote? Can you post a link? I'm really interested in this. That way, I can fully close my kettle during mashing to help keep the temps up.

Eventually w/ experience I think you will realize that you don’t need the remote thermometer, once you attain a good mash temp, insulate the kettle and don’t think or look at it.

Your mash temp losses will be minor and predictable to the point you don’t need to watch via remote

Rdwhahb

 

[LittleRiver]

Eventually w/ experience I think you will realize that you don’t need the remote thermometer...

I would agree with you if the assumption is that the thermometer is used to constantly check the mash temp, but that's a bad assumption.

What I do is set the hi alarm a couple of degrees below my strike temp and go do other things while the mash water is heating with the lid on. It beeps me when the water is ready.

During the mash I don't really monitor the temp, but I do set the timer to beep me when the mash is over, because I'm off doing other things. If it's really cold I have the option of setting a low alarm to beep me to add some heat, but my insulation works well enough that I don't bother with a low alarm.

When ramping up to a boil, I set the hi alarm for a few degrees below boiling and go do other things.

Remote probe thermometers are great, especially if they have temp alarms and timers built in. It's all the automation I need.

 

[Waunabeer]

Well, I just completed my first brew with using electric and biab (eBIAB). All I can say is that is was the smoothest and most accurate batch I've ever brewed in my 9 years. I love the accuracy and ease of use of electric vs. NG and the brew bag vs. cooler was simple and fast to use and clean.

I ground my grains to 0.025, which seemed to be the sweet spot. My brew house efficiency was 79.2%. The grain absorption and/or evaporation rate was a litte off vs the predicted amount in beersmith. I had more liquid than expected, which probably hurt my pre-boil gravity reading a tad. (est. 1.040 vs. actual of 1.036). So I boiled about 10 minutes longer and ended up hitting my OG exactly at 1.050.

So overall I am extremely happy with my first attempt at not only electric brewing, but also BIAB (using Ss Brewtech 1v and a Brew Bag). I wish I would have converted earlier.

 

[Blazinlow86]

View attachment 608880 Well, I just completed my first brew with using electric and biab (eBIAB). All I can say is that is was the smoothest and most accurate batch I've ever brewed in my 9 years. I love the accuracy and ease of use of electric vs. NG and the brew bag vs. cooler was simple and fast to use and clean.

I ground my grains to 0.025, which seemed to be the sweet spot. My brew house efficiency was 79.2%. The grain absorption and/or evaporation rate was a litte off vs the predicted amount in beersmith. I had more liquid than expected, which probably hurt my pre-boil gravity reading a tad. (est. 1.040 vs. actual of 1.036). So I boiled about 10 minutes longer and ended up hitting my OG exactly at 1.050.

So overall I am extremely happy with my first attempt at not only electric brewing, but also BIAB (using Ss Brewtech 1v and a Brew Bag). I wish I would have converted earlier.

Once you go electric you won't ever go back. Cheers

 

[BarleyStanding]

My last brew was outside, so I'm slowly getting to BIAB method. brewing outside is way more fun .

I agree, regardless of method, brewing outside is just more fun. I usually brew in the garage, but sometimes join a group brew on a friend's deck. It's a little more distracting, but a lot more fun. BIAB lends itself to portability.

 

[BarleyStanding]

Once you go electric you won't ever go back. Cheers

I've been eyeing that, 240v. I hear they're going to offer something with a lot more bells and whistles later this year.

 

[swimIan]

View attachment 608880 Well, I just completed my first brew with using electric and biab (eBIAB). All I can say is that is was the smoothest and most accurate batch I've ever brewed in my 9 years. I love the accuracy and ease of use of electric vs. NG and the brew bag vs. cooler was simple and fast to use and clean.

I ground my grains to 0.025, which seemed to be the sweet spot. My brew house efficiency was 79.2%. The grain absorption and/or evaporation rate was a litte off vs the predicted amount in beersmith. I had more liquid than expected, which probably hurt my pre-boil gravity reading a tad. (est. 1.040 vs. actual of 1.036). So I boiled about 10 minutes longer and ended up hitting my OG exactly at 1.050.

So overall I am extremely happy with my first attempt at not only electric brewing, but also BIAB (using Ss Brewtech 1v and a Brew Bag). I wish I would have converted earlier.

Did you recirculate too?

 

[eric19312]

So this thread convinced me to order a brewing bag in hopes it will make cleaning my mash tun easier. Sticking with 3 vessel but really curious to see if hoisting the bag of spent grain is easier way to muck out my mash tun.

So I did my first batch incorporating a brewbag into my 3 vessel system. Worked great and did make mash tun clean up a lot easier. This was a 16 gallon batch with a modest grain bill. Target OG 1.050 about 28 pounds of grain. Solved my grain under the false bottom issue and disposal was easy. Let the bag drip more or less dry and cool, the lowered into a hefty bag, reached in and grabbed bag by the bottom seam and pulled it out. Rinsed when I rinsed the mash tun (using my chiller water) and hung it up to dry.

Here is a pic of the fabric filter fitting in my mash tun with the autosparge. Thanks @wilserbrewer !

 

[dwhite60]

I guess historically malt was a pretty pricey proposition especially making a non-essential (some will argue this) food item like beer.

Therefore sparging to increase overall efficiency made a lot of sense. With poorly modified malts especially the old English "brown malt" you had to work to get your efficiency up. These days, if you have low efficiency, you simply add more malt. It's cheap and highly available. You're getting much better extract per pound now more than ever so BIAB is more efficient overall.

No reason you could not have done brew in a bag 300 years ago with say, sail cloth. Wouldn't last as long as modern fibers, nylon, but no reason it wouldn't work. My bet is somebody DID try it at some point but didn't get the efficiency they could sparging.

All the Best,
D. White

 

[Velnerj]

OK guys, I had a horribly stuck sparge this weekend perhaps due to a grain bill of nearly 35% rye plus some flaked grains. DYI Bazooka strainer couldn't handle it and I'm thinking about using a MIAB set up for my 5g igloo round cooler. What bag would you suggest I get? Thx

 

[RM-MN]

OK guys, I had a horribly stuck sparge this weekend perhaps due to a grain bill of nearly 35% rye plus some flaked grains. DYI Bazooka strainer couldn't handle it and I'm thinking about using a MIAB set up for my 5g igloo round cooler. What bag would you suggest I get? Thx

I'd suggest you check with one of the menbers here, Wilserbrewer and have a bag made that fits your cooler properly. His bags have a reputation of being of high quality and good fit.

 

[NewJersey]

I'd suggest you check with one of the menbers here, Wilserbrewer and have a bag made that fits your cooler properly. His bags have a reputation of being of high quality and good fit.

seconded. just need to tell him dimensions and you'll have it in a hurry. great bag even BETTER vendor.

 

[Hwk-I-St8]

I'm floored by the heated debate on this. BIAB is a viable option, but it's not for everyone and, to be honest, asking why everyone doesn't do it is a troll-type post. I started mashing in a cooler with a bazooka tube filter and batch sparging. Now I do a hybrid....I use a bag in my cooler MLT and still do a batch sparge. Why? Some of the beers I brew are very high gravity (like 1.128+) and doing those in a no-sparge environment is a losing battle. There's an easy calculation to determine what gravity you should get given a known grain bill and water amount. Getting to 1.128 requires a super thick mash. That reduces your efficiency requiring even more grains and, ultimately, it's just not really a recipe for success. I also like that I have less MLT dead space by getting rid of the bazooka and drawing from the little well by the cooler drain.

I like to use the same system for every brew as it makes it more simple to have a consistent process. So my process works for me, which is the general answer to the OP. Everyone does what works for them whether the driving forces are beer style, budget, desire to tinker, desire to emulate commercial systems, shorter brew day...whatever the reason. That's why everyone doesn't BIAB and, quite frankly, I find your implication with the question to be insulting.

 

[Bobby_M]

I'm floored by the heated debate on this. BIAB is a viable option, but it's not for everyone and, to be honest, asking why everyone doesn't do it is a troll-type post. I started mashing in a cooler with a bazooka tube filter and batch sparging. Now I do a hybrid....I use a bag in my cooler MLT and still do a batch sparge. Why? Some of the beers I brew are very high gravity (like 1.128+) and doing those in a no-sparge environment is a losing battle. There's an easy calculation to determine what gravity you should get given a known grain bill and water amount. Getting to 1.128 requires a super thick mash. That reduces your efficiency requiring even more grains and, ultimately, it's just not really a recipe for success. I also like that I have less MLT dead space by getting rid of the bazooka and drawing from the little well by the cooler drain.

I like to use the same system for every brew as it makes it more simple to have a consistent process. So my process works for me, which is the general answer to the OP. Everyone does what works for them whether the driving forces are beer style, budget, desire to tinker, desire to emulate commercial systems, shorter brew day...whatever the reason. That's why everyone doesn't BIAB and, quite frankly, I find your implication with the question to be insulting.

You just answered his question in a very rational way. There is no reason to be insulted.

 

[Gravelscratcher]

This thread has pretty much run its course...at least as far as debate is concerned.
At this point, it's just regurgitation of the same opinions.

 

[bwible]

I mash in a 5 gallon Gott cooler with a stainless false bottom and a ball valve. I did recently add a brew bag to that. I would not say I brew in a bag though. I still do a traditional mash and sparge. And I mash and sparge in a seperate vessel than the one I boil and/or ferment in, obviously.

The only things I like the bag for are 1) There is something to be said in that it acts as an additional screen to keep grain out from under the false bottom. I had been fighting with that on occasion. And 2) it makes the spent grain easier to remove and the mash tun easier to clean as others have said. I plan to add a small pump to my setup for recirculation and grain getting into the pump was an additional concern for me.

The scale works for me because I typically brew 3 gallon batches to fill my 3 gallon kegs. I know I am not speaking for everyone.

I do have a thermometer through the cooler wall which is a concern 1) that the bag could hang up and get a hole and 2) in that I wonder whether my temp reading is accurate now due to the bag.

 

[bwible]

I say "separate sparge" because there is always an integrated sparge in the basic BIAB process. When the bag is removed, the grain is being rinsed.

But its not. Its only being drained. Rinsed would imply the addition of more water that the grain was not already soaking in. The purpose of a sparge step is to rinse out additional sugar left behind in the grain after the first wort is collected. That is why traditional brewers add fresh additional hot water from a seperate hot water vessel. You don’t rinse out additional sugars using liquid that is already saturated with sugar. With BIAB you are only collecting your first wort when you pull the bag out. Unless you are adding additional fresh water in some way you are not sparging.

So your grain is not being rinsed. With BIAB, your wort is also not being polished by any recirculation filtration. Recirculation is a process that takes place in your dedicated mash vessel. Its also called vorlauf in German and it aids your beer’s clarity by removing fine particulate matter. If you ever recirculate, look at the clarity of your wort at the start and look at it again after 15 minutes or 20 minutes of recirculation. Night and day. All that stuff you don’t remove when you don’t vorlauf will settle out on the bottom of your fermenter (if you’re lucky) making it more difficult to syphon and costing you beer in the process. And most of the time you will also not end up with a clear beer. Fine if you’re making NEIPA I guess.

But this is fallacy to say there is a built in sparge. There is no such thing. Sparging means rinsing your grain with fresh water, even if you pour some over the bag. Which is still not built in.

 

[LittleRiver]

...this is fallacy to say there is a built in sparge....

Fair enough. Words have a meaning, and I was stretching the use of the word.

It wasn't an original thought from me. I got it from listening to a podcast by the Australian guys who invented BIAB. They were talking about how having all the water in the vessel in a full volume BIAB provides an inherent "sparge" when all that water is drained from the bag. Were they using the term loosely? Sure, but they got their point across.

 

[Gravelscratcher]

No sparge efficiency is comparable...if not better in some cases, and any differences are negligible either way.
It just goes back to what works for the individual brewer.
I prefer BIAB, but that's me.

 

[bleme]

But its not. Its only being drained. Rinsed would imply the addition of more water that the grain was not already soaking in. The purpose of a sparge step is to rinse out additional sugar left behind in the grain after the first wort is collected. That is why traditional brewers add fresh additional hot water from a seperate hot water vessel. You don’t rinse out additional sugars using liquid that is already saturated with sugar. With BIAB you are only collecting your first wort when you pull the bag out. Unless you are adding additional fresh water in some way you are not sparging.

So your grain is not being rinsed. With BIAB, your wort is also not being polished by any recirculation filtration. Recirculation is a process that takes place in your dedicated mash vessel. Its also called vorlauf in German and it aids your beer’s clarity by removing fine particulate matter. If you ever recirculate, look at the clarity of your wort at the start and look at it again after 15 minutes or 20 minutes of recirculation. Night and day. All that stuff you don’t remove when you don’t vorlauf will settle out on the bottom of your fermenter (if you’re lucky) making it more difficult to syphon and costing you beer in the process. And most of the time you will also not end up with a clear beer. Fine if you’re making NEIPA I guess.

But this is fallacy to say there is a built in sparge. There is no such thing. Sparging means rinsing your grain with fresh water, even if you pour some over the bag. Which is still not built in.

This implies that there is only 1 way to BIAB, which is just wrong. There are plenty of us who BIAB and/or recirculate and/or sparge.

I also call BS on not ending up with a clear beer. Total and complete BS.

 

[Gravelscratcher]

This implies that there is only 1 way to BIAB, which is just wrong. There are plenty of us who BIAB and/or recirculate and/or sparge.

I also call BS on not ending up with a clear beer. Total and complete BS.

Yes, I recently did a BIAB Kolsch, and it was nice and clear.
Wort was clear/clean...no different than my 3v days. Beer was see through @ finished product.

Edit: & I BIAB no sparge (recent convert).

 

[NewJersey]

Yes, I recently did a BIAB Kolsch, and it was nice and clear.
Wort was clear/clean...no different than my 3v days. Beer was see through @ finished product.

Edit: & I BIAB no sparge (recent convert).

I wanna get a tattoo incorporating "1V" "full volume mash" "no sparge" "eBIAB" and "3V is for suckers" lolll

 

[LittleRiver]

...All that stuff you don’t remove when you don’t vorlauf will settle out on the bottom of your fermenter (if you’re lucky) making it more difficult to syphon and costing you beer in the process. And most of the time you will also not end up with a clear beer.....

Well then me and lots of other folks get lucky all the time, because we get clear great tasting beer from our full volume single vessel BIAB process.

Here's a recent brew in which I dumped everything that was in the kettle into the fermenter. No finings of any type were used. All I did was cold crash a few days before packaging.

Brewhouse efficiency was 83%. Brew day took 3:40, from starting to fill kettle to everything cleaned and put away (no prior prep).

I appreciate you letting me know I've been doing it all wrong.

 

[Blazinlow86]

To me its clear as day if you have brewed using both methods that the wort into the kettle is cloudy using the biab method compared to a traditional mash setup. If it makes a difference in the final product could definitely be debated however. I personally think the traditional mash clears slightly faster but that's probably a compromise that's irrelevant to most. Cheers

 

[Gravelscratcher]

Irish moss or whirfloc clears the wort the same...3v or BIAB.

 

[Blazinlow86]

Irish moss or whirfloc clears the wort the same...3v or BIAB.

I've never heard of anyone adding Irish moss to there mash to get clear wort INTO there KETTLE. Cheers