Using RO/DI water

[Turfgrass]

I’ve considered using RO water from Walmart, but haven’t been able to track down any water quality reports from Great Value. My search for test results leaves me on the phone listening to automated messages until I can’t take it anymore. Please share your results if you actually were able to find a copy.

My next thought was to use my RedSea RO/DI water filter from my reef aquarium days and build my water profile. Wondering if this is a reasonable option and how I might be able to build up my water profile for a hazy NEIPA style beer?

Thank you for any suggestions. Happy holidays.

 

[shetc]

Got a Whole Foods near you? Their Primo RO machines are regularly maintained, which I know by the inspection sticker that includes the measured TDS. That measurement always agrees with my personal TDS meter.

 

[Turfgrass]

Thank you. There is a Whole Foods a couple of towns over from me. Would I need to bring my own containers for fill up or do they provide? What type of info is on the TDS sticker?

 

[Hwk-I-St8]

For a NEIPA, I shoot for 150 ppm chloride and 70 ppm sulfate and a pH of 5.3. I use brunwater to calc the gypsum and calcium chloride additions. I usually need about 2 oz a of acidulated malt to hit pH.

 

[Turfgrass]

For a NEIPA, I shoot for 150 ppm chloride and 70 ppm sulfate and a pH of 5.3. I use brunwater to calc the gypsum and calcium chloride additions. I usually need about 2 oz a of acidulated malt to hit pH.

Are you using RO water for your brews?

 

[MaxStout]

If you're not sure about the RO water from the store, get a handheld TDS (total dissolved solids) meter. Search Amazon, they're about $15. Then buy a gallon of RO water and test. It should be less than about 20-25 ppm. Not all those store dispensers are well-maintained, and an inspection sticker sometimes means only that it was dispensing water.

A TDS meter is essential if you ever buy a home RO system, as that is a quick way to determine if the filters need replacing.

 

[Hwk-I-St8]

Are you using RO water for your brews?

Yep. I found a web site that had water profiles across the country that you could search. They had the RO water from my store listed.

 

[Turfgrass]

If you're not sure about the RO water from the store, get a handheld TDS (total dissolved solids) meter. Search Amazon, they're about $15. Then buy a gallon of RO water and test. It should be less than about 20-25 ppm. Not all those store dispensers are well-maintained, and an inspection sticker sometimes means only that it was dispensing water.

A TDS meter is essential if you ever buy a home RO system, as that is a quick way to determine if the filters need replacing.

Good idea. The ro/di filter I have for my reef aquarium has an in-line TDS meter and basically would read Zero bc the water was so pure, but that was with the DI resin. I never tested it with the filters alone.

So, if the water tests less than 20 on the tds do you just go with it, or do you now know how to build it up for a certain style beer. I’d like to brew a NEIPA. Thx

 

[MaxStout]

Good idea. The ro/di filter I have for my reef aquarium has an in-line TDS meter and basically would read Zero bc the water was so pure, but that was with the DI resin. I never tested it with the filters alone.

So, if the water tests less than 20 on the tds do you just go with it, or do you now know how to build it up for a certain style beer. I’d like to brew a NEIPA. Thx

20-25 ppm is not a bright line threshold, just a value I think should be easily attainable from a well-functioning RO system, and an amount that is negligible when building your water. At that level or below, you should be OK. If the dissolved solids level gets much above that, you have to start questioning what is in the water. Ideally, you want the level in RO to be as low as possible, so you can build your brewing water knowing the overall mineral content. A good home RO system will filter down to a few ppm. I measured my RO water recently, and it was 4 ppm. DI will get it close to zero.

Once you have good, filtered water as a foundation, you can build on that. Many people like programs such as Bru'n Water, a free spreadsheet calculator. It will help get your water design in the ballpark. There are a number of water chem experts in this community who can help if you have questions, people who know far more than I do. There is also a good water chem primer to get you going.

 

[Yooper]

I use those very cheap GH/KH aquarium strips for my RO water. It's been at 17 ppm KH for the entire time, so I know it's working well. You could do that to check the source, or use your own RO/DI water as long as the TDS or KH reading is low.

 

[Turfgrass]

Do these brew/water calculators allow for DIonized water in their calculations to build a profile for a certain style beer?

 

[Yooper]

Yes. I often use 100% RO water, but you can put whatever you want for your source water.

 

[shetc]

Thank you. There is a Whole Foods a couple of towns over from me. Would I need to bring my own containers for fill up or do they provide? What type of info is on the TDS sticker?

I bought 2 5-gallon plastic bottles from Whole Foods, but I think they are quite pricey now cuz they are made with "safer" plastic than before. I'm sure you can use any container as long as you tell the cashier how may gallons you took from the machine. The sticker just says the date of inspection and the measured TDS.

 

[Turfgrass]

I fired up my 4 stage ro/di water filtration system today and the TDS meter is on zeros. The in coming tap water ranged from 210-197 ppm. I'm constructing a Herms system and I'll need about 15 gallons water. Water chemistry calculators will be new to me. Any help with constructing NEIPA water profile will be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

 

[Yooper]

I fired up my 4 stage ro/di water filtration system today and the TDS meter is on zeros. The in coming tap water ranged from 210-197 ppm. I'm constructing a Herms system and I'll need about 15 gallons water. Water chemistry calculators will be new to me. Any help with constructing NEIPA water profile will be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

That's perfect! Now, for additions and mash pH- that's a bit tougher since I don't know your recipe. Generally, you put your water into a water calculator, and your grain bill, and you can see if you need to add some acid to the water to get a proper mash pH. You may not with your RO water, and the additions you'll want to use for the NEIPA but using the spreadsheet will let you know.

For NEIPAs, I like to go with about 100 ppm of chloride, and 75 ppm of sulfate, using gypsum and calcium chloride. Others go with a lot more chloride, but my feeling is "less is more" until you know how much you like.

https://www.brewersfriend.com/mash-chemistry-and-brewing-water-calculator/ is a free water calculator to try out. A mash pH of 5.4 or so is perfect (or in the area of 5.3-5.5 anyway) and you can add additions to the calculator to see what it does.

 

[Dog House Brew]

I have 15 5 gallon containers I got from Culligan years ago. Thought I would go and get it from a store a 1/4 mile down the road. I have been to 10 different stores and have only found one that read below 180. You have to have a TDS meter if you go that route. I looked at buying an RO filter. Decided it was just about as cheap to pay $6 a jug.

 

[Turfgrass]

That's perfect! Now, for additions and mash pH- that's a bit tougher since I don't know your recipe. Generally, you put your water into a water calculator, and your grain bill, and you can see if you need to add some acid to the water to get a proper mash pH. You may not with your RO water, and the additions you'll want to use for the NEIPA but using the spreadsheet will let you know.

For NEIPAs, I like to go with about 100 ppm of chloride, and 75 ppm of sulfate, using gypsum and calcium chloride. Others go with a lot more chloride, but my feeling is "less is more" until you know how much you like.

https://www.brewersfriend.com/mash-chemistry-and-brewing-water-calculator/ is a free water calculator to try out. A mash pH of 5.4 or so is perfect (or in the area of 5.3-5.5 anyway) and you can add additions to the calculator to see what it does.

Yeah, I like that site and now just need to put a recipe together. I’ll keep ya posted.

 

[MaxStout]

I have 15 5 gallon containers I got from Culligan years ago. Thought I would go and get it from a store a 1/4 mile down the road. I have been to 10 different stores and have only found one that read below 180. You have to have a TDS meter if you go that route. I looked at buying an RO filter. Decided it was just about as cheap to pay $6 a jug.

That is exactly why I stopped buying bulk water from stores. Pig in a poke. Bought a system from Buckeye Hydro and very happy with it.

 

[Dog House Brew]

That is exactly why I stopped buying bulk water from stores. Pig in a poke. Bought a system from Buckeye Hydro and very happy with it.

I looked before Christmas and almost pulled the trigger. My water is super hard and heard I needed a softener before the unit. A couple fill ups would pay for the RO system. Haven’t looked into the softening thing. Bought a place that has a well. Once that gets going it will be a no brainer. I was shocked at how poorly the store units were maintained. They even had fresh service stickers.

 

[MaxStout]

I looked before Christmas and almost pulled the trigger. My water is super hard and heard I needed a softener before the unit. A couple fill ups would pay for the RO system. Haven’t looked into the softening thing. Bought a place that has a well. Once that gets going it will be a no brainer. I was shocked at how poorly the store units were maintained. They even had fresh service stickers.

I suspect those water machine "inspections" are merely to check if water is coming out the dispenser and not much else.

 

[Braufessor]

I use RO water from walmart near me ( I am sure it is not necessarily comparable in terms of company/servicing, etc. so, your results may vary) Because I am paranoid about that sort of thing, I have actually sent water from our Walmart's RO machine to Ward Labs on 3 different occasions....... all 3 times it checked out as expected. The TDS meter is a good, simple way to test yours for yourself.

In regard to mineral additions for a NE IPA. I brew a ton of NE IPA's with 100% RO water. A simple starting point you can use as you get your feet wet with water chemistry calculators is this: For a NE IPA, with 100% RO water add 1 level tsp of gypsum and 1 level tsp of Calcium Chloride per 5 gallons of water (mash and sparge water). This will get you in the ball park of where you need to be for a beer like this.

Going forward, it really is in your best interest to get acquainted with a water calculator and adjust water according to beer style.

 

[swampbrewcrew]

I have 15 5 gallon containers I got from Culligan years ago. Thought I would go and get it from a store a 1/4 mile down the road. I have been to 10 different stores and have only found one that read below 180. You have to have a TDS meter if you go that route. I looked at buying an RO filter. Decided it was just about as cheap to pay $6 a jug.

$6/jug. I’m assuming that’s for 5 gallons right? I will eat bandaids, and chase it with mad dog before I spend $6 on a gallon of water.

 

[tjmac5071]

$6/jug. I’m assuming that’s for 5 gallons right? I will eat bandaids, and chase it with mad dog before I spend $6 on a gallon of water.

$1.20 per gallon which is not bad... I use spring water from a fill your own place that has a great base mineral content to build from for .25 per gallon but would not hesitate to spend 1.20 per gallon if it was my only option.

 

[triethylborane]

lol @ $1.20/gal H20. What a racket, people will pay that and more for it. RO H20 from King Stupids is $0.39/gal and TDS analysis confirms its as advertised.

 

[Turfgrass]

That's perfect! Now, for additions and mash pH- that's a bit tougher since I don't know your recipe. Generally, you put your water into a water calculator, and your grain bill, and you can see if you need to add some acid to the water to get a proper mash pH. You may not with your RO water, and the additions you'll want to use for the NEIPA but using the spreadsheet will let you know.

For NEIPAs, I like to go with about 100 ppm of chloride, and 75 ppm of sulfate, using gypsum and calcium chloride. Others go with a lot more chloride, but my feeling is "less is more" until you know how much you like.

https://www.brewersfriend.com/mash-chemistry-and-brewing-water-calculator/ is a free water calculator to try out. A mash pH of 5.4 or so is perfect (or in the area of 5.3-5.5 anyway) and you can add additions to the calculator to see what it does.

I use RO water from walmart near me ( I am sure it is not necessarily comparable in terms of company/servicing, etc. so, your results may vary) Because I am paranoid about that sort of thing, I have actually sent water from our Walmart's RO machine to Ward Labs on 3 different occasions....... all 3 times it checked out as expected. The TDS meter is a good, simple way to test yours for yourself.

In regard to mineral additions for a NE IPA. I brew a ton of NE IPA's with 100% RO water. A simple starting point you can use as you get your feet wet with water chemistry calculators is this: For a NE IPA, with 100% RO water add 1 level tsp of gypsum and 1 level tsp of Calcium Chloride per 5 gallons of water (mash and sparge water). This will get you in the ball park of where you need to be for a beer like this.

Going forward, it really is in your best interest to get acquainted with a water calculator and adjust water according to beer style.

it seems that each site gives

There are a lot of different programs with water quality spreadsheets. I tried out pro brewer.com today and it easy, however I do get different results amongst the different brew programs. Wondering if your program will give similar results. Treating 15 gal of ro/di water with ph of 5.3 requires 7.5grams of gypsum and 28grams of CaCl. For 121ppm Ca, 160 CL and 74 SO4... I’d appreciate a confirmation. Thx

 

[Braufessor]

Yeah..... all the refill stations I see are in the .37 per gallon range. Actually, that is what I am doing right now......

it seems that each site gives

There are a lot of different programs with water quality spreadsheets. I tried out pro brewer.com today and it easy, however I do get different results amongst the different brew programs. Wondering if your program will give similar results. Treating 15 gal of ro/di water with ph of 5.3 requires 7.5grams of gypsum and 28grams of CaCl. For 121ppm Ca, 160 CL and 74 SO4... I’d appreciate a confirmation. Thx

That seems like a ton of CaCl...... when I put in 7.5 gallons of mash and sparge water (15 gallons total) into B'run water, and add 1.75 grams/gallon (26 grams total) I get 300ppm Chloride.....

The sulfate of 7.5 grams checks out about the same.

If I go 1 gram of CaCl per gallon I get around 175 Chloride, 125 calcium, 75 Sulfate. pH of 5.40 - which is fine for this beer.

I would go 1 gram per gallon of CaCl and 1/2 gram/gallon of gypsum if that is the basic profile yo are looking at.

 

[Turfgrass]

Yeah..... all the refill stations I see are in the .37 per gallon range. Actually, that is what I am doing right now......

That seems like a ton of CaCl...... when I put in 7.5 gallons of mash and sparge water (15 gallons total) into B'run water, and add 1.75 grams/gallon (26 grams total) I get 300ppm Chloride.....

The sulfate of 7.5 grams checks out about the same.

If I go 1 gram of CaCl per gallon I get around 175 Chloride, 125 calcium, 75 Sulfate. pH of 5.40 - which is fine for this beer.

I would go 1 gram per gallon of CaCl and 1/2 gram/gallon of gypsum if that is the basic profile yo are looking at.

Thank you. I also tried Brewer’s Friend and that seems closer with the following results. Not sure why the difference in results.

For 15 total gallons
.5 grams/gal gypsum = 1.9 tsp or 7.5g
1 gram/gal CaCl = 3.4 tsp or 15g

Ca 103, Cl 127, SO4 74

I started brewcipher, but I don’t have my results with me.

 

[Master]

Seeing the combination of what people are paying for RO, and the varied TDS in it, makes me glad that my city water isn't horrible, (just very variable) and an RO system will be easy.

When I lived in Casper, WY, our water was super hard, and I went through softner salt like it was going out of style. But then all the sodium levels were insane.

 

[shetc]

Seeing the combination of what people are paying for RO, and the varied TDS in it, makes me glad that my city water isn't horrible, (just very variable) and an RO system will be easy.

When I lived in Casper, WY, our water was super hard, and I went through softner salt like it was going out of style. But then all the sodium levels were insane.

I'm paying 35 cents per gallon at Wholefoods. Seems like a deal to me.

 

[tld6008]

Had to chime in, a new Walmart opened up near me and their RO price is $0.27/gal.
Don't know why but I'm brewing as much as I can, ph is 6.5.