Treehouse Brewing Julius Clone

[Gustatorian]

Just a ratio of quantities of the various hops listed. Three parts citra two parts mosaic one part Amarillo is a good place to start.

But this is the dry-hop ratio, I assume? What did you bitter with?

 

[Little_Lebowski]

But this is the dry-hop ratio, I assume? What did you bitter with?

Personally everything is five minutes or less. If you want a quick suggestion:

1.5 oz citra
1 oz mosaic --------- Flame Out
.5 oz Amarillo

1.5 oz citra
1 oz mosaic ---------- 20 minute whirlpool @ 150-170*F
.5 oz Amarillo

1 oz citra
1 oz mosaic --------- DH addition at tail end of ferm

3 oz citra
2 oz mosaic -------- DH addition for 3-4 days when ferm is complete
1 oz Amarillo

 

[Jmash]

Do you guys think TH may use pilsen malt? Im in the garage whirlpooling a batch and Im drinking a Green as I type this. Ill put the tulip glass down, bring it to my face every few minutes and I get a lager aroma. Could be that the beer is a month old but I definitely am getting that smell.

 

[day_trippr]

First go at the "original" Julius recipe from way early in the thread.

Needs another week on gas but it is already wonderful!
Definitely a keeper.

Cheers!

 

[melville]

What we know about Tree House beers/Julius:

No flaked anything.
No wheat.
100+ (theoretical) IBUs according to Nate.
FG 1.013
There's Citra in there
More sulfate than chloride
Use of hop extracts for "smooth bitterness" (we know they use warrior extract in Haze, what about Julius?)

And all we don't know:

Exact blend of yeasts
Malt bill
Hops/schedule

This is a tough nut to crack.
Considerations: Nate says no flaked anything, and most do not contain oats. Leaves the door open to Malted Oats. I swear there's some munich/vienna in there, and I definitely get some columbus. (Given the brewers stated influences, I have a theory that this began as an inspired by Sip of Sunshine beer.)

 

[Gustatorian]

What we know about Tree House beers/Julius:

No flaked anything.
No wheat.
100+ (theoretical) IBUs according to Nate.
FG 1.013
There's Citra in there
More sulfate than chloride
Use of hop extracts for "smooth bitterness" (we know they use warrior extract in Haze, what about Julius?)

And all we don't know:

Exact blend of yeasts
Malt bill
Hops/schedule

This is a tough nut to crack.
Considerations: Nate says no flaked anything, and most do not contain oats. Leaves the door open to Malted Oats. I swear there's some munich/vienna in there, and I definitely get some columbus. (Given the brewers stated influences, I have a theory that this began as an inspired by Sip of Sunshine beer.)

You make a 100+ IBU, sulfate-heavy beer without flaked grains or wheat and tell me how that Julius clone is.

 

[melville]

You make a 100+ IBU, sulfate-heavy beer without flaked grains or wheat and tell me how that Julius clone is.

Like Julius?

 

[melville]

You make a 100+ IBU, sulfate-heavy beer without flaked grains or wheat and tell me how that Julius clone is.

https://twitter.com/treehousenate/status/724960590695927808
"theoretical IBUs on Julius/ Green etc well north of 100. Never actually measured. Softness a function of process/water etc"

https://twitter.com/treehousenate/status/730392938912452609
"@mmstaron @MarshallBArtist no flaked anything..."

https://twitter.com/treehousenate/status/730382240782290944

"@treehousenate huge fan! and homebrewer. I can't get Treehouse in Texas so I've been guessing...Do your IPAs have oats?!? Huge debate"

Replying to @MarshallBArtist
"@MarshallBArtist most do not..."

https://twitter.com/treehousenate/status/697190895150592001

Devon Reed‏ @reeddevon 6 Apr 2016
More
Replying to @treehousenate
@treehousenate some speculate TH and other "New England IPAs" go high on CaCL and lower on CaSO4 to get silky mouthfeel. Wrong speculation?


Nathan Lanier‏ @treehousenate
Replying to @Michiganimal
"@Ruckusz28 highish CaSO4..Lowish CACL..."

https://twitter.com/treehousenate/status/730392884906598400
"@mmstaron @MarshallBArtist the only pale beer I have brewed with wheat was Curiosity Six.."

 

[Gustatorian]

https://twitter.com/treehousenate/status/724960590695927808
"theoretical IBUs on Julius/ Green etc well north of 100. Never actually measured. Softness a function of process/water etc"

https://twitter.com/treehousenate/status/730392938912452609
"@mmstaron @MarshallBArtist no flaked anything..."

https://twitter.com/treehousenate/status/730382240782290944

"@treehousenate huge fan! and homebrewer. I can't get Treehouse in Texas so I've been guessing...Do your IPAs have oats?!? Huge debate"

Replying to @MarshallBArtist
"@MarshallBArtist most do not..."

https://twitter.com/treehousenate/status/697190895150592001

Devon Reed‏ @reeddevon 6 Apr 2016
More
Replying to @treehousenate
@treehousenate some speculate TH and other "New England IPAs" go high on CaCL and lower on CaSO4 to get silky mouthfeel. Wrong speculation?


Nathan Lanier‏ @treehousenate
Replying to @Michiganimal
"@Ruckusz28 highish CaSO4..Lowish CACL..."

https://twitter.com/treehousenate/status/730392884906598400
"@mmstaron @MarshallBArtist the only pale beer I have brewed with wheat was Curiosity Six.."

I know what Nate has said in the past-been following this thread for a bit. But I'm not sure I believe a lot of that.

 

[TheHairyHop]

I've honestly become fairly skeptical of the impact of the water minerals when considering the other processes such as yeast, hop amounts/application, carbonation level, pH and the grain bill. I really haven't noticed much of an impact since switching to a 2:1 Cl:SO4 ratio. I regularly have TH beers, and believe me, I'd know it if I got the mouth feel that beers like Green have. It's possible that the minerals become greater than the sum of their parts when other aspects are involved, but that is more than difficult to figure out

 

[lilbova3]

I had New England's Fuzzy Baby Ducks the other day and it tasted exactly like Julius the first time I ever had Julius. It's been a couple of years so yes it is hard to compare a beer I just drank to a beer that I had two years ago. And yes the recipe has possible changed over the last couple of years for Julius. But Fuzzy was sooo good.

Fuzzy was straight up orange flavor with a nice sweet finish to help play up a juicy flavor. I know Fuzzy is all Citra. It might not be the right thread to post in but if someone had a clone or idea of a clone it might be a good place to start.

Had Julius a couple of weeks ago. It was good but didn't blow me away. I don't think I'm a fan of Conan though and suspect that's what they are using.

 

[TheHairyHop]

they definitely aren't using Conan

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=623221

 

[lilbova3]

they definitely aren't using Conan

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=623221

Ok sorry thanks for quickly correcting. It's reminiscent to Conan then because of the esters and bubblegum. The flavor I get from the yeast, I suspect, in Julius is similar to other commercial brews that I know use Conan.

 

[melville]

I know what Nate has said in the past-been following this thread for a bit. But I'm not sure I believe a lot of that.

Okay, but for those trying to clone Julius or gain insights on Tree House's process, Nate's statements sort of take precedence over [insert NEIPA conventional wisdom here].

I mean that's sort of what's interesting about Tree House — the definition of NEIPA — but not doing what everybody assumes NEIPA is.

(I mean just look at the Tree House yeast thread — not using 1318 or Conan — super interesting.)

 

[TheHairyHop]

Ok sorry thanks for quickly correcting. It's reminiscent to Conan then because of the esters and bubblegum. The flavor I get from the yeast, I suspect, in Julius is similar to other commercial brews that I know use Conan.

yea, np. I hope it didn't come across as anything other than providing some info. I'll be sure to report my results from anything gleaned off of that thread. I'm going to try a 50/50 S-04/T-58 brew next

 

[Gustatorian]

Okay, but for those trying to clone Julius or gain insights on Tree House's process, Nate's statements sort of take precedence over [insert NEIPA conventional wisdom here].

I mean that's sort of what's interesting about Tree House — the definition of NEIPA — but not doing what everybody assumes NEIPA is.

(I mean just look at the Tree House yeast thread — not using 1318 or Conan — super interesting.)

They definitely should take precedence, yet I still have a healthy skepticism about them. Julius is a 100 IBU+ beer...no way.

 

[bozizle]

I replicated the recipe by LL except for hops. I used Citra and Mosaic lupulin powder along with galaxy pellets. The smell coming out of the fermentor is insane. Can't wait to try this out

 

[melville]

They definitely should take precedence, yet I still have a healthy skepticism about them. Julius is a 100 IBU+ beer...no way.

Seems well within the realm of possibility to me. I'm not sure it can be done with pellets on the homebrew level, which is why I'm so keen to try the extract:

"Early on, Tree House Brewing began experimenting with Resinate® CO2 Hop Extract in some of their hoppy beers. Co-founder Nate Lanier explains, “We have been using extract since 2013 when we found it could produce a smoother and more palatable bitterness. We like bitterness in our beers, and have found that extract produces a more consistent, predictable bitterness versus pellets which can degrade in unknown ways with age. We also aren’t afraid to use them later in the boil to give a bit of flavor in addition to that soft bitterness we crave.”

https://ychhops.com/connect/news/blog/brewery-perspectives


Paste: When trying your hoppy offerings, most people mention the mouthfeel is like biting into a piece of fruit. What drew you to focusing on creating such a “fruit” forward mouth-feel in your beers?

NL: The main driver there is ease and enjoyment of consumption. When I brew a beer, drink it, and make notes on how to improve it, often the body and mouthfeel are the key focus points. I think where I get it wrong, sometimes, is with bitterness. If it’s too low it becomes difficult to drink too much of it. I don’t like a beer without bitterness, so when that component is lacking I am pretty hard on myself.

https://www.pastemagazine.com/artic...-brewing-talks-malt-the-black-market-and.html

This doesn't sound like the mentality of low IBU brewer to me. Getting 100+ IBUs (and by extension all that hop flavor) in there and keeping it "soft" is definitely something I want in my beers.

FWIW, brought home a bunch of Trillium this weekend and most of them feel at least 100 IBUs. Noticed on their Twitter them telling a homebrewer to bitter with columbus at 45 IBUS, add the rest late/flameout. 45 IBUs for bittering hints at a pretty big number in Beersmith (i.e. theoretical).

 

[Ruckusz28]

They definitely should take precedence, yet I still have a healthy skepticism about them. Julius is a 100 IBU+ beer...no way.

Yeah, I get what you mean. That's the guy's bread and butter. Once somebody cracks the code, he's just another face in the game. This starts getting into the blurry lines of the IBU vs. Perceived IBU debate.

As long as its good beer that is up to my standards and my drinkers are satisfied, I'm content.

 

[braindead]

Anyone got the perfect beersmith bsmx file of this for a 5 gallon brew.
I know I`ll need to edit it, just be easier if someone has
Thx

 

[Little_Lebowski]

I replicated the recipe by LL except for hops. I used Citra and Mosaic lupulin powder along with galaxy pellets. The smell coming out of the fermentor is insane. Can't wait to try this out

How's it chugging along?

 

[Little_Lebowski]

Reduced the wheat from 3 to 2# and backed down some of the specialties by about 1/4 or so. Lightened up the body and color just a bit. Came in around 6.25% at 1.013 FG

 

[Cavpilot2000]

Reduced the wheat from 3 to 2# and backed down some of the specialties by about 1/4 or so. Lightened up the body and color just a bit. Came in around 6.25% at 1.013 FG

That's gorgeous.
I did similar after my first batch or two (reduced flaked, eliminated all cara malts). Now it's just 2-row, Vienna, a pound each of flaked oats and wheat, plus a pound of honey and 4 oz honey malt, and Boom! Great beer.

 

[Gustatorian]

Personally everything is five minutes or less. If you want a quick suggestion:

1.5 oz citra
1 oz mosaic --------- Flame Out
.5 oz Amarillo

1.5 oz citra
1 oz mosaic ---------- 20 minute whirlpool @ 150-170*F
.5 oz Amarillo

1 oz citra
1 oz mosaic --------- DH addition at tail end of ferm

3 oz citra
2 oz mosaic -------- DH addition for 3-4 days when ferm is complete
1 oz Amarillo

Just to confirm, you're adding no bittering additions but everything at flame-out or later? I'm plugging this into BeerSmith and getting about 5 IBUs. I know Beersmith isn't the best for flameout/wp hops but that still seems very low. If I cut the flame and let the hops whirlpool at that temp without chilling, I assume I'll get more IBU's. Then I can cold crash to 150-170ºF to start the first whirlpool addition.

 

[bleme]

Just to confirm, you're adding no bittering additions but everything at flame-out or later? I'm plugging this into BeerSmith and getting about 5 IBUs. I know Beersmith isn't the best for flameout/wp hops but that still seems very low. If I cut the flame and let the hops whirlpool at that temp without chilling, I assume I'll get more IBU's. Then I can cold crash to 150-170ºF to start the first whirlpool addition.

Either you have an old version of BeerSmith or you are entering something wrong. The last BeerSmith recipe I made had 2oz of hops at Flameout, then whirlpool for 10 minutes, and that gave 17 IBU so you should be well over 5 IBU with that hop schedule.

 

[Gustatorian]

Either you have an old version of BeerSmith or you are entering something wrong. The last BeerSmith recipe I made had 2oz of hops at Flameout, then whirlpool for 10 minutes, and that gave 17 IBU so you should be well over 5 IBU with that hop schedule.

Yea it corrected it to about 37 IBU. Seems more appropriate possibly a bit low for a beer with an OG in the mid 1.060s

 

[skibb]

If anyone wants to send me a couple cans of any TH beer, I send them off to a lab to get specifics such as OG/FG, ADF, RDF, SRM, IBU and the Chloride/sulfate/calcium amounts.

PM me if interested

 

[Little_Lebowski]

If anyone wants to send me a couple cans of any TH beer, I send them off to a lab to get specifics such as OG/FG, ADF, RDF, SRM, IBU and the Chloride/sulfate/calcium amounts.

PM me if interested

Lab = stomach? Just sayin...

 

[skibb]

I would probably taste a little bit but my stomach doesn't charge $250 a sample...

 

[Jmash]

Cant wait until TH's new facility gets up and running. Just not worth the hour and a half drive on days like last Wednesday when they have a two can limit