Mixed-Fermentation Sour Beer Really Easy Fruit Sour

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You'll need about 15-17L of total mash water depending on what you expect to lose in the boil (BrewFather says I'd need 14.96L but I only boil for 30 minutes).

This is a 15 min boil, so 13 to 15 litres should do it for 11-12 litres into the fermenter.
 
Thanks lads,
Yes I love sours so it's a no brainer me starting on one like this, couple of things.... I ordered my grain precrushed in 500g bags (4xpils 2xwheat 1xoats ) hoping to get two brews going by the values in gnomebrewer's recipe, so if I were to use the original grain volumes of 2.2lb pils, 1.1lb wheat etc, how much would I reduce the water volume by( ⅓ to 8-10 litres instead of 13-15?) to get 1.045 @ approx 75% efficiency?, The most important aspect is the quality and not the final amount in the fv, it'll leave me with identical grain to do another brew for comparison and adjustments.
Just one other thing if you be so kind, the mash temp and length.... Ive read so much but just need a starting point, is 66°c mash (73°c strike water, maybe less as not much grain) for 1hour suitable for these types of grains?... also sparge water temp is very important so I've read to extract the remaining sugars and not tannins, general consensus is not to exceed 77°c with that.... If indeed I do sparge, but probably do full volume anyway. I will add if necessary 1/200g sugar to hit gravity if needed as I've read the Philly sour yeast( which I'm using ) greatly benefits from simple sugars for souring, not aware of this goodbelly stuff here in England, or an equivalent.
Appreciate your time and thoughts
 
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I don't sparge; I just squeeze the bag. For this recipe with a 15-min, BrewFather says start with ~13L & strike at ~70C.

I just pitched my fourth batch with PhillySour, and say go with the sugar idea. That grain bill plus 200g of table sugar should get you to about 1.038 OG.
 
Thanks lads,
Yes I love sours so it's a no brainer me starting on one like this, couple of things.... I ordered my grain precrushed in 500g bags (4xpils 2xwheat 1xoats ) hoping to get two brews going by the values in gnomebrewer's recipe, so if I were to use the original grain volumes of 2.2lb pils, 1.1lb wheat etc, how much would I reduce the water volume by( ⅓ to 8-10 litres instead of 13-15?) to get 1.045 @ approx 75% efficiency?, The most important aspect is the quality and not the final amount in the fv, it'll leave me with identical grain to do another brew for comparison and adjustments.
Just one other thing if you be so kind, the mash temp and length.... Ive read so much but just need a starting point, is 66°c mash (73°c strike water, maybe less as not much grain) for 1hour suitable for these types of grains?... also sparge water temp is very important so I've read to extract the remaining sugars and not tannins, general consensus is not to exceed 77°c with that.... If indeed I do sparge, but probably do full volume anyway. I will add if necessary 1/200g sugar to hit gravity if needed as I've read the Philly sour yeast( which I'm using ) greatly benefits from simple sugars for souring, not aware of this goodbelly stuff here in England, or an equivalent.
Appreciate your time and thoughts

You can also sparge with room temp water. It takes longer to bring to a boil afterwards, but doesn't involve heating more water beforehand.

Also, this thread is about mixed fermentation sour beer (with bacteria), not lactic acid producing yeast.

There's a big thread on Philly Sour here:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/thread...-sour-feedback-or-experience-to-share.682096/
You might get better feedback there (specifically on fermentation) because it will be more on topic.

:mug:
 
Thanks Drewch,
Grains & yeast arrived today so I'm gonna go on the lower volume side of things, probably 11 litres no sparge and see where I end up.... Rather overshoot the gravity and be able to liquor back than thin it with more sugar.
Thanks for your comments marc1, I've read that thread entirely by the way.... my questions to the OP have nothing to do with fermentation, I am concerned with recipe, volumes, temps & time.

Thanks lads
 
The rest of the process is the same (including using a half dose of sour-pitch).

Half dose? Is that half of the package is half of the original recipe meaning only a half gram? Or did you mean 1gram as listed in post #1? Sorry if this has been addressed already I am only on page 4 of this thread. Little more reading to go.

This looks interesting and I intend to try it pretty soon. Gotta source some fruit!

Thanks in advance
 
Half dose? Is that half of the package is half of the original recipe meaning only a half gram? Or did you mean 1gram as listed in post #1? Sorry if this has been addressed already I am only on page 4 of this thread. Little more reading to go.

This looks interesting and I intend to try it pretty soon. Gotta source some fruit!

Thanks in advance

1g per 5 gallon of beer. It's half the dose of the packet instructions. I now use half that again (0.5g per 5 gallon batch). I think the instructions/recommended pitch rate is more targeted at kettle souring, where the souring needs to happen quickly (eg overnight). Co-pitching with yeast means it has more time to do it's thing, so a smaller pitch is needed.
 
Do you believe that a sour starter is necessary? I am a total n00b with sour stuff and reading as much as I can to get the feel of knowing a little something.

I have always made yeast staters, always. And I will do so for this recipe as well. However I am wondering if making a sour starter might give it too much of an advantage and beat out the s-05 (not certain if I will stick with the s-05 or go with a different liquid yeast option yet) competition rendering this way too sour?

Or should I make a starter using the s-05 and sour pitch together so that they grow side by side to reduce the 'competition'?

I have never had a dry pitch yeast actually work as advertised before. I was originally taught to brew using a large healthy starter so that is how I have always done it.

Brainstorming before brew day. Any thoughts are appreciated. Thanks
 
A sour starter isn't necessary if you use the lallemand powder. If you used probiotic pills, it's worth making a very small starter to check that the Lactobacillus is alive.
 
INGREDIENTS:
2/3 Pilsner malt. 1/3 Wheat malt. Aim for an OG around 1.045.
No hops.


Looking at several sour beer recipes, I see people using several different types of wheat malt. I see a lot of white wheat. Anyone use red wheat? Any opinions on that?

Also, someone remind me what amount of rice hulls to keep me from spending the whole day tending my spare.

Thanks,

The White Wheat has a larger kernel size. Some people prefer it over Red Wheat because they don't need to change their mill gap.
 
Brewed this back in December as my first sour. Kept it simple and opted for DME and frozen mango and wow you guys were not wrong...

My 3-Gallon Recipe:
2 lb Light DME
1 lb What DME
0.5 lb each White Wheat and Carapils steeped (I wanted to ensure good head retention)

Pitched US-05 and 4 o.z. Goodbelly Mango

4 days later I added 2 lb of frozen mango

View attachment 720527

Next time I might opt for less goodbelly to drive the sourness down slightly but that's more for others than it is for me.

Thanks Gnomebrewer!
Dumb question. But how much water did you use? I assume that 1 lb of what DME is Wheat DME?
 
This has become a staple beer at my house. It's loved by non-beer drinkers, lager drinkers and craft beer drinkers. Kegs go faster than anything else I make. This is really simple, using the co-pitching method (sacch and lacto go into the ferment at the same time) which is easier than kettle souring. It gives a bit more complexity from the lacto and always seems to end up at about the right acidity level. The OG and mash temp give the right body and sweetness to work with the acidity, and allow the flavours from the fruit to shine through. There are some really good threads about co-pitching simple sours including Fast Souring - Modern Methods
Importantly, don't be worried about contaminating equipment. It WON'T happen. L. plantarum is so hop intolerant that it won't infect your other hopped beers.

INGREDIENTS:
2/3 Pilsner malt. 1/3 Wheat malt. Aim for an OG around 1.045.
No hops.

PROCESS:
Mash at 155F for an hour.
Collect wort and boil for 10 minutes.
Chill to pitching temps and pitch a packet of US05 per 5gal and 1g of Lallemand/Wildbrew Sour Pitch (Lactobacillus plantarum). That's half of what the instructions say to use for Sour Pitch, but is more than enough. I suspect pitching half a gram per 5 gal would get the job done.
Ferment at around 66 to 70F until primary is nearly finished then rack onto fruit. Try to rack just BEFORE reaching FG so the yeast are still active to scrub oxygen picked up during transfer. It normally takes about 4 to 5 days to this point.
Rack onto fruit (explained below) and leave for a further 2 weeks. Try to minimise oxygen/splashing during transfer as it seems to reduce the fresh fruit flavour.

FRUITING:
I mostly use packaged frozen fruits which work really well. There's no need to pasteurise or sanitise. Fruit should go into a grain bag (or paint strainer bag) into the secondary fermenter, then rack beer on top.
Raspberries: Use about 1.5 to 2lbs in 5 gal. Tip them straight into the grain bag.
Mango: Mush up thawed, chopped frozen mango. I bash it with my grain paddle. Use about 3lbs in 5gal.
Blueberries: As per mango.
Passionfruit pulp: Use about 3lbs per 5gal. Tip it straight into the grain bag. Others have reported good results with passionfruit puree.
These are the only fruits I've tried so far, and all have been great. Raspberries have definitely been the favourite.
There's lots of other good fruiting info on the Milk the Funk Wiki Soured Fruit Beer
but I find I use a lot less that what is suggested in this beer.
Cheers and enjoy!
If I wanted to add peanut butter for a pb&j taste... at what point would I do that and how would you go about that? Any ideas?
 
👍
I only rack to secondary because I split a big batch into two or three smaller batches over different fruits.
I'm a beginner and I have done this recipe successfully with raspberrys and DME. Thanks for sharing your find!

Now I'm trying to make the process even easier (and to understand the steps).

  • So adding the fruit to the primary is as good as to rack to a secondary and add the fruit there? Or is there any benifit with racking to a secondary (except from splitting the batch to smaller fractions)?
  • Is it possible to add the fruit to the primary at the beginning, together with the yeast and lacto? If not: why is that not advisable?
Thanks in advance!
/Paola
 

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