Poll: Do you have, or plan to get, an electric car?

[Airborneguy]

Shameless plug (my p100dl for sale) FUN cars : )

Oh man I wish. Too bad I’d take a bath on performance 3 now.

 

[TwistedGray]

Oh man I wish. Too bad I’d take a bath on performance 3 now.

Yeah, I think this is where we all say, "Join the club!" lol...these price adjustments *facepalm*

 

[Nagorg]

My wife has a Tesla and loves it. The geek in me is admittedly a little jealous, its basically a motorized computer on wheels.

But the range remains a deterrent for me. Dont get me wrong, she can and has taken longer road trips that exceed it's single charge range. So its not that you cant overcome this constraint. But, it does take more time and planning so that you can be sure to find a charger along the way. And sometimes that even means taking a route that you might not have otherwise taken.

I'm also a "truck person". And while I dont always tow things, I do on occasion. From what I've seen so far, EV trucks do tow well but the range is dramatically reduced. So not a good option IMO if thats what you want to do with your vehicle.

So in summary, I am interested but dont think things are where they need to be for me to bite. I'm sure things will continue to improve and I'll be watching. And I also think that better solutions will come too. Hopefully all of this will create more reasonable pricing in the process. I think this is what has to happen if we expect to be free from fossil fuel based transportation.

Meanwhile I'll stick with my V8.

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

Shameless plug (my p100dl for sale) FUN cars : )

LOL. I can't even imagine thinking that I should buy a $56K car that's 7 years old with 41K miles on it...

I'll stick with my paid-off Ford Flex as daily driver / family hauler and my paid-off Jeep Wrangler as my toy

 

[Airborneguy]

I would love to buy a beat up wrangler to convert for Pine Barrens off roading.

 

[TwistedGray]

LOL. I can't even imagine thinking that I should buy a $56K car that's 7 years old with 41K miles on it...

I'll stick with my paid-off Ford Flex as daily driver / family hauler and my paid-off Jeep Wrangler as my toy

Still under warranty though. The battery and the drive unit are warrantied through summer of 2025

 

[TwistedGray]

My wife has a Tesla and loves it. The geek in me is admittedly a little jealous, its basically a motorized computer on wheels.

But the range remains a deterrent for me. Dont get me wrong, she can and has taken longer road trips that exceed it's single charge range. So its not that you cant overcome this constraint. But, it does take more time and planning so that you can be sure to find a charger along the way. And sometimes that even means taking a route that you might not have otherwise taken.

What range do you personally need to be okay? Do you have the capacity to charge at home, ideally on 220?

 

[Nagorg]

What range do you personally need to be okay? Do you have the capacity to charge at home, ideally on 220?

For typical EV scenarios, the single charge range is comparable to a gas vehicle and a single tank. But in my gas vehicle, I can have my tank topped of in ~15 minutes and be back on the road and ready for another ~350 miles. And I can do this at any station I come across.

But for my wife, she has to plan her route based on the availability of Tesla Superchargers along the way. The car is good about doing this for her but it does add time to her trip both for the time it takes to charge and the additional miles due to a non-typical path she has to take for this. And if there's no Supercharger, the other options just take way too long.

So this is absolutely "doable" and okay if you don't care so much when you arrive at your final destination and have the time to spare. But not ideal for me personally... I prefer the flexibility I have with my gas'er for now.
And yes, at home we have a Tesla Wall charger hooked in to 220. Before we got that installed, we had to leave her car at a local non-supercharger for hours and then go get it when done. Total PITA without a high performing charger...

And back to range as it relates to the EV trucks... Reading reports about the impact from towing, range is cut to roughly 1/4 -1/3 of non-towing scenarios. This makes it pretty usless in my opnion. I'd be scared to try taking my boat to a local lake much less taking it anywhere that I'd have to drive a couple of hours to get to.

So again, sitting here watching for improvements. I believe it will become more practical in time but that time is not now for me.

 

[TwistedGray]

So again, sitting here watching for improvements. I believe it will become more practical in time but that time is not now for me.

You didn't answer the question though, lol. What range would the EV have to have to make it acceptable by you (towing not considered, due to reasons you noted)? I mean, how often do you drive over 300mi in a day?

You're right though, 15min gas fill up is way faster than 30-45min parked at the supercharger. But I mean...we are talking about a road trip at this point, right? You're not actually driving 500-600mi each day, are you?

I don't think dino fueled vehicles will be going anywhere because people with this "range" anxiety. If it were 15min to have a full charge again, whether that's an automated battery hot swap station or superdupercharger, I think some people will still NOT want an EV for whatever other reason (not wanting to be limited by the charging network, for example).

 

[Airborneguy]

I don't think dino fueled vehicles will be going anywhere because people with this "range" anxiety. If it were 15min to have a full charge again, whether that's an automated battery hot swap station or superdupercharger, I think some people will still NOT want an EV for whatever other reason (not wanting to be limited by the charging network, for example).

Disclaimer: this is not directed at Nagorg.

Re: the above quote.

I agree. In EV conversations, the goalposts ALWAYS move. Those who are inclined more towards critical thinking yet still against EVs rarely just openly say, “I don’t want one.” To their slight credit, the idiots at least proudly yell it.

What I see is a bunch of requirements which inevitably change when they’re confronted with the fact that these requirements are either already met or clearly coming soon.

Range of 300 miles becomes 500. Filling in 10 minutes becomes 5 or even “instantaneous”. “I rarely see chargers,” especially when you try to explain that home charging is 90%+ of “fueling” becomes “the same number as gas pumps.”

I know it is tough to think in EV terms before actually having the first hand experience. I went through it. I did nearly 4 years of research and went through another new car before finally making the jump and I still had reservations. And sure enough, everything my Tesla-owner friend kept telling me would quickly become non-issues did.

I almost never glance at my percentage. In fact backing up further, I initially displayed in miles remaining, quickly changing that. I never check my “charge stats”. I never stop at superchargers except on road trips. I don’t take my J1772 adapter with me. I tow my jetski 45 miles each way to the bay without charging even when it says 2-3% as I’m getting close to home.

 

[Airborneguy]

And just to be clear, I drive way more miles than the average American both annually and on a typical work day. I work from home 3-4 days a week but still pick my kids up and run them around. So my average daily miles works out to be about 70 even though I’m putting less than 10 on it 3-4 days a week. My daily average is really over 100 if you remove the 150+ days a year I barely leave the house.

 

[Kent88]

I'm also a "truck person". And while I dont always tow things, I do on occasion. From what I've seen so far, EV trucks do tow well but the range is dramatically reduced.

I'm a truck enthusiast, growing up on a farm I thought I'd be able to convince my dad that he should help me get a pickup so I could help him out. Since moving away I still appreciate them, but it's pretty unlikely that I'm going to encounter enough situations that call for a truck to justify me having a truck.

That said, my wife seems more interested in a Silverado EV than an Equinox EV, and Blazer EVs appear to be significantly more expensive, so when we trade the car I guess an EV truck is a real possibility.

Anyways, I remember towing a livestock trailer being a real drain on gas mileage. Reduced efficiency while towing isn't just an EV problem.

For typical EV scenarios, the single charge range is comparable to a gas vehicle and a single tank. But in my gas vehicle, I can have my tank topped of in ~15 minutes and be back on the road and ready for another ~350 miles. And I can do this at any station I come across.

I believe DC fast chargers / level three charging stations can charge a vehicle battery to 80% in half an hour. I think Teslas use that kind of charging at their supercharger stations. That's enough time to get out, stretch, use the washroom, and grab a snack. I think most Teslas have a range above 400miles, so that's half an hour to add another 320(ish) miles, which at 70mph will take one over 4hours to deplete.

But for my wife, she has to plan her route based on the availability of Tesla Superchargers along the way. The car is good about doing this for her but it does add time to her trip both for the time it takes to charge and the additional miles due to a non-typical path she has to take for this. And if there's no Supercharger, the other options just take way too long.

This is why I have been keeping an eye on my frequently traveled routes, which go to/from my parents house and my wife's parents house. I just found a couple new level 3 charging stations along the way, one of them almost exactly between my house and my in-laws place. I've also discovered chargers in the towns they live, and by some miracle convinced my anti-EV dad to put a 220 outlet in their garage.

We have an occasional outlier trip, but when we switch to a true BEV we plan on keeping a gas vehicle until we really get comfortable with the charging networks. EV charging networks are probably going to expand a lot over the next few years. I know my state has plans for a certain number to be installed along major roads in that time, which I assume will help road trippers a lot.

And yes, at home we have a Tesla Wall charger hooked in to 220. Before we got that installed, we had to leave her car at a local non-supercharger for hours and then go get it when done. Total PITA without a high performing charger...

I still haven't installed a level 2 charger in my garage. My Volt charges enough overnight on 110/120 to cover most of the trips we ask it to do. But when we go with a BEV, I'll put in a level 2 charger in my garage.

And there's a key phrase, what we ask our vehicles to do. For years my wife and I were good with one vehicle she can drive in snow, with all wheel drive, that has a bit more cargo space, and one vehicle that gets better mileage that she never drives in snow (I get to drive it in snow). I had my eye on the Volt for years, and when we decided to replace our "more efficient" car I took another look at what we asked of that car. It rarely left the tri-county area, and didn't get used much in winter. It was a really good candidate for replacing with a PHEV with a battery rated around 53miles per full charge.

 

[Nagorg]

You didn't answer the question though, lol. What range would the EV have to have to make it acceptable by you (towing not considered, due to reasons you noted)? I mean, how often do you drive over 300mi in a day?

I thought I did answer it though admittedly it wasn't direct. My comment that answered the question was "For typical EV scenarios, the single charge range is comparable to a gas vehicle and a single tank.". That was me saying, indirectly, that the actual range for non-towing scenarios is acceptable for me now. But its the other associated impacts that deter me currently.
How often do I drive over 300 miles in a day? It's not the norm but it does happen enough that I have to consider it. My truck is "my" only vehicle. I have to consider the higher demand scenarios when choosing the one vehicle that I'll drive for all scenarios.

Can you guess which vehicle we take for family road trips? Hint, no Superchargers required..

Anyways, I remember towing a livestock trailer being a real drain on gas mileage. Reduced efficiency while towing isn't just an EV problem.

No, reduced efficiency when towing isn't just an EV problem. I never said it was. But the statistics do suggest that its a bigger problem for EV's. There's also a bit of a difference in towing a ~300-500 pound Jet Ski -vs- a ~3500+ pound boat.

I think y'all are also missing some context in my words. I am interested in EV's and not really against them. I'm happy that my wife has hers and it suits her driving needs just fine. And I'd consider one for my more typical scenarios but that would mean having both a truck and an EV. But the EV's cost way more than my truck so that's not happening, at least not until prices can come down.

I'm just not ready to get one for myself just yet for all of the reasons I have mentioned.

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

I'm a truck enthusiast, growing up on a farm I thought I'd be able to convince my dad that he should help me get a pickup so I could help him out. Since moving away I still appreciate them, but it's pretty unlikely that I'm going to encounter enough situations that call for a truck to justify me having a truck.

Yeah, right now I don't have a vehicle usage pattern that would allow for a truck, as right now a third row vehicle is important to me. However, my son is about to turn 16, and since I'll most likely be helping him financially to buy a vehicle, I'm leaning towards getting him into a 4-seat truck. Not F-150 class, but more Ranger/Tacoma class. I just want to have a truck around when I need it lol!

When I replace my Flex (when the kids start heading to college), an EV truck might be in the cards though. I wouldn't hate the idea of an F-150 Lightning. I'm not 100% sure I'll go to an EV with the next vehicle, but it's definitely going to be something I'm looking REALLY closely at given the timeframe for that purchase (4-5 years away).

I believe DC fast chargers / level three charging stations can charge a vehicle battery to 80% in half an hour. I think Teslas use that kind of charging at their supercharger stations. That's enough time to get out, stretch, use the washroom, and grab a snack. I think most Teslas have a range above 400miles, so that's half an hour to add another 320(ish) miles, which at 70mph will take one over 4hours to deplete.

We have an occasional outlier trip, but when we switch to a true BEV we plan on keeping a gas vehicle until we really get comfortable with the charging networks. EV charging networks are probably going to expand a lot over the next few years. I know my state has plans for a certain number to be installed along major roads in that time, which I assume will help road trippers a lot.

I think some of those numbers might be a little bit on the high end (i.e. range of "most" Teslas and the fact that you probably aren't depleting to 1% charge before you arrive at the Supercharger station), but I don't view road tripping as a personal deterrent to an EV. I don't do it often enough to matter, and many of the road trips I'd be doing are within distances that maybe a SLIGHT increase in total travel time doesn't inhibit me. Plus, as you point out, there's a chance we may end up being a one BEV, one ICEV family, in which case we have the ICEV available for the road trip.

Even then, unless I'm pretty much traveling cross-country, which I don't plan to do, the added charging time isn't a dealbreaker. And on the few times that it is (i.e. if I were to drive from SoCal to San Antonio, 19 hrs straight through, where my in-laws recently moved), renting an ICEV car for a week isn't exactly difficult.

 

[Airborneguy]

I’ve done NJ to Orlando straight through. In a gas car its about 17 hours. It took me 21, including driving straight through Ian’s remnants swinging back into SC.

Significant time added, sure. But as a frequent road tripper (I hate flying), I can honestly state that the more frequent stops were welcome.

I have driven to Colorado twice and Tennessee once, with numerous 7-9 hours road trips to various other locations. In the Army, I drove back and forth between Colorado and Iowa I don’t know how many times.

On both Colorado trips, there and back, I booked it as much as possible, stopping late at hotels to sleep before another full day of driving. Both times I distinctly recall feeling like crap for at least a day afterwards.

On this past Florida trip, I left my house at 12pm and arrived in Orlando at about 9am. Besides the fact that I was able to charge in places where there were lines or even empty gas tanks because of Ian, I arrived just as the event I was attending kicked off.

I stayed up until around 5pm before taking a nap, then went right back to it. Because of my charging naps and the self-driving, I was more relaxed than after any past extreme road trips.

I’m driving back to Florida in a few weeks. Heading down alone, but driving back with my wife and stepdaughter who are flying down to meet me.

 

[Kent88]

Huge battery gives Ram 1500 REV 500 miles of range between charges

 

[Rodent]

Huge battery gives Ram 1500 REV 500 miles of range between charges

I only get around 320 miles per fill up on my 2005 Dakota, so that's definitely going to get me where I need to go and back well over 98% of the time

Now the question: would I add two years of working to snag one of these before an early retirement? with solar panels added to the shop roof, I'd be able to charge for 'free' except for the rare occasional few days of snow each year

 

[day_trippr]

Have to say that is a pretty good looking e-truck

 

[Dland]

Huge battery gives Ram 1500 REV 500 miles of range between charges

One specification to check out if one were to consider a truck like that would be tare vs GVW. If one were actually use as a truck that is, would want to check how much battery pack weight limits the truck's load capacity.

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

I can only imagine what that thing weighs with max battery capacity configuration.

 

[Airborneguy]

I’m down in Florida now. I just saw my first full Supercharger with cars waiting. Thankfully I was just meeting my friend there.

 

[El Whedo]

We have one charger in the village I live in.

It is in the parking lot at our public park. But because it's right in front of the door to the village office, it's always blocked by folks doing business at the office.

It would have been much smarter to put it all the way to the opposite side of the parking lot directly across the street from the tavern, and with a direct view up and down the tiny shopping district. Then tourists charging their cars would be tempted to drop some coin before moving on in 40 minutes.

I live about a block away and walk or bike past many time a day. I've never seen it used once.

 

[Kent88]

I just found a fast charger in my town/village. It's at the far end of a truck stop / diner parking lot. I don't know if it's getting used much, but I'm glad it's there. When I get a true BEV I'll probably use it once in a while to top off before a road trip, but I'm still planning on installing a level 2 charger in my garage some day.

 

[day_trippr]

If Walmart is into it, there must be profit to be had...

https://www.theverge.com/2023/4/6/2...hicle-stations-nationwide-ev-charging-network
Cheers!

 

[passedpawn]

If Walmart is into it, there must be profit to be had...

https://www.theverge.com/2023/4/6/2...hicle-stations-nationwide-ev-charging-network
Cheers!

Walmart does not always make the best decisions. Look into their business in Germany - completely flop. Or Walmart Express (basically Walgreens-sized Walmart's).

I'm not suggesting a supercharger network isn't a good idea - it is! I'm suggesting that all that glitters isn't gold at Walmart.

 

[Kent88]

Walmart's partnership with Electrify America seemed like a good idea. I wish they'd just keep working with EA, or maybe another network like Chargepoint.

But they aren't asking me.

 

[passedpawn]

The company that should be looking at a national charging network is Starbucks. Duh. Charge car, drink a crazy-expensive coffee. Win win.

But they aren't asking me

 

[Kent88]

I've been saying for years that movie theaters need to have fast chargers available. Hotels need them as well.

DC fast chargers can almost work into the gas station model. We have to stay with gas pumps while we pump already, but then a lot of people are used to going in for the washroom, maybe grabbing a snack. If we can just plug in to a DC charger when we roll up, and leave it while we check out the convenience store, that would work.

 

[Airborneguy]

Heading down on this trip, I saw my first ever nearly fully ICE’d supercharger (in NC, phot below) and in Orlando I encountered a line for the first time. I didn’t need to charge to get to my destination so I skipped topping off and just waited for my friend, who thankfully had gotten a spot before the line formed.

I would never make this trip in a non-Tesla. I use plugshare to look for free chargers. It gives me a perspective on what owners of other EVs deal with. The superchargers are generally located in very convenient places. I rarely have to drive a mile off the highway, meaning they are often even closer than gas stations (at the nearest one typically).

On these stops, I’ve only seen third-party chargers a few times.

 

[Airborneguy]

Get this. The friend I am visiting in Florida had a Tesla service appointment this morning. When he saw my car parked next to my buddy’s, the tech asked if I’d had the wiring harness recall done yet. I haven’t. Or, as I can say now, HADN’T.

Meanwhile, my wife’s Outback fuel pump recall is still not complete because we can’t get an appointment at a dealer who actually has the parts that won’t take up an entire day and require us to switch cars with my father in law without disrupting our lives all that much.