Do you consider electric/automated brewing equipment to be cheating?

[Gunshowgreg]

I have been doing BIAB with a pulley system for a couple years and it works really well for me. Started with the mashtun cooler and haven’t looked back. Clean up is easy and I also do no chill with that saves lots of time. . I have been interested in some of the brew kettles like Claw Hammer or Gigawort or Grain father. They seem nice. Be cool to brew on my countertop. However it seems like they are kinda automated and do a lot of things for you. My knowledge on them is not all that great. But is using this type of equipment cheating? Im curious what people think about the equipment if they have used it and if they are worth the money. The Claw Hammer one looks nice but sets you back $1000.00. Do you find it takes the fun out of brewing compared to other methods?

 

[Jonakr]

I think "cheating" is going to the local pub and spending $15 on a pint or two.

I also do "no chill" once I didn't have a pool to push heat into anymore, but still use my 15 gallon stockpot on a propane burner because there's only the cost of propane, no new equipment.

The point is to make something you enjoy or can share with others. There's no cheating on how you get there.

If you truly don't understand how and why what you are doing works, then, maybe.

 

[Broken Crow]

I used to think of electric car windows as cheating or lazy, for that matter; what's wrong with points and condenser and a distributor cap? Is kegging cheating?
A competent brewer can figure out how to brew with almost anything, however simple or complex...It's all a matter of what works for you.
If you're already doing BIAB, what is it you feel you're missing? Can you simply add to, or modify your current gear?

 

[fluketamer]

not cheating.

i recently made the move to electric aio. the black friday price made me do it. lol

countertop brewing is more of a luxury then you realize until you get one of these. i can brew anywhere i have a 120 v outlet and a little ventilation.

yard garage basement kitchen table. its really foolproof. mine was dirt cheap so definatley worth the money.

having temp controlled heating and stability as opposed to the stove top has made this so much easier and more fun. also i dont use the automated settings so i dont feel the aio does much for me im still doing the work its just easier.

pull the trigger you wont be disappointed

 

[Rish]

Definitely cheating! That's why I mash and boil using wooden vats and hot stones.

 

[Bobby_M]

Yes, it's cheating as long as every bit of technology in your modern life is also cheating. An electric all in one brewing system is hardly doing "a lot things for you". It literally just accurately holds your mash temperature for you. I don't think panicking and adding boiling water to your mash every 10 minutes is some kind of rite of passage.

 

[passedpawn]

"Cheating" implies there are rules.

Rules are for Germany. Brewing is one area I do not need anyone else's rules LOL.

 

[Airborneguy]

"Cheating" implies there are rules.

Rules are for Germany. Brewing is one area I do not need anyone else's rules LOL.

Exactly. Not even worth a vote.

 

[madscientist451]

Many years ago, I asked about BIAB right here on HBT; a well known member commented: “learn to brew the right way”. So “cheating” and doing things the right way change over the years and vary from person to person. Brew what you want and how you want to.

 

[Broken Crow]

Definitely cheating! That's why I mash and boil using wooden vats and hot stones.

Wooden vats!? Lucky you! Anything other than clay and reeds is cheating.

 

[Sammy86]

Not cheating at all.

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

I have both all in one and a very big electric system and love both for different reasons, as most i started out very basic so I call it a "luxury rig" not cheating

 

[lumpher]

I have an AOI system, but I still feel like without my miniscule amount of knowledge I could come out with sewage instead of the swill I manage to miraculously make.

 

[Somesaymybeerisdrinkable]

If a system that stops heating at a preset temperature is cheating then isn't automatic fermentation temperature control also cheating?

 

[redrocker652002]

Funny this came up. I was telling my wife that the AIO are cool if for no other reason that they mostly have timers and I can have the strike water ready and waiting when I get up. That saves me at least 30 minutes during the prep time. I also like the idea of temp control to do step mashes and mash outs. The basket is cool, but honestly I like my bag cause I can squeeze the heck out of it and get that last little bit. But, with all considered the AIO machines are cool and might be a purchase at some point, but for now I will stick with my propane burner and 10 gallon kettle. Great post though.

 

[Clint Yeastwood]

If it's cheating, all factory brewers are cheating.

I think it may be a bad investment, based on my own experience, but it's definitely not cheating.

 

[FugacityBrews]

Switching to a modular eBIAB setup was a great move for me. I used to brew in my garage on a propane burner and deal with the heat, the cold, running out of propane and changing the tank, dragging a hose to my wort chiller, step mashing as gently as possible etc.

If I wake up on brew days and it’s 2 degrees outside or 95 degrees outside, it no longer matters. If I want to step mash, I turn the dial on my controller. My wort chiller hose drop is right next to my setup in the basement.

My brew day routine has been extremely simplified and I enjoy brewing now more than ever before. I could still screw up a recipe or a batch (and I have) so I don’t think it’s cheating - it’s about convenience and about making it easier to be consistent.

 

[Exception13]

Nope, not cheating.

 

[McMullan]

I don’t consider evolution to be cheating. Besides, I’ve spent a lot on brewing so that I didn’t have to cheat.

 

[DevilsCups]

They are the definition of "work smarter not harder". Without my AIO I wouldn't be able to brew in my apartment, so no. If I had a house and a garage and all that, I'd maybe have a more traditional setup, but maybe not.

Anyways - it's just equipment consolidation. Making wort is making wort.

 

[MikeCo]

AIO systems are the way to go if you're thinking of buying a new brewing setup. I honestly don't know why so many homebrewers still fly sparge on 3-vesel systems.

 

[jdauria]

I mean are pro breweries that use automated systems or even electric systems (small brewery here in Mass was all electric) instead of standing over a caldron over a wood fire like back in the old days, cheating? Of course not.

 

[FswBG]

Definitely not cheating in my op. Just using the tools available to improve your product. It's up to the brewer to decide the level of involvement in their process. Even Weihenstephan university uses a fully automated lab with all the latest equipment in their end to end brewing process for controlled consistency and efficiency.

 

[mac_1103]

I honestly don't know why so many homebrewers still fly sparge on 3-vesel systems.

I'm not sure why someone who has been using a 3-vessel system for years and has developed a process that works well and gives them results that they're happy with would want to switch, but I'm also not sure what that has to do with the original question.

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

It's only cheating if you hide it from your original system, otherwise it's considered and "open relationship" between you and your systems. Progressive Maybe, but not cheating.

 

[sibelman]

Cheating? Hmm. Not the word I'd choose.

My mill is a great example: I don't need to crush grains with a rolling pin or mallet, which would be kinda crazy. Not cheating at all. But, recently I added a motor to my mill because my shoulders are wearing out, which takes me out of the process somewhat. That's not "cheating" per se, but may be the kind of thing you're asking about, @Gunshowgreg.

I use some automation, electric (PID temperature control) and mechanical (AutoSparge™). But I don't want to go too far with that, certainly not to the point where a system locks me in to its method or timing. I also like feeling connected to the process, and don't want robots to take that away from me. Using machines to aid the process isn't cheating per se, but you should decide what's a good aid, and which ones go too far for you.

Note: the best reason to avoid an all-in-one is maintainability: if a proprietary part fails, replacement could be expensive or impossible.)

 

[MaxStout]

I do woodworking, too. Some people prefer to use only hand tools, and that's fine. But I much prefer using thickness planers, jointers, table saws, etc.

 

[wstumper]

Switching to a modular eBIAB setup was a great move for me. I used to brew in my garage on a propane burner and deal with the heat, the cold, running out of propane and changing the tank, dragging a hose to my wort chiller, step mashing as gently as possible etc.

I'm looking at switching to eBIAB, but I'm also looking at 240v with water/wort/mash everywhere, electric cords everywhere, electric controllers, pumps, heating elements, etc.

 

[PCABrewing]

I think the internet is cheating...
We should require these discussions be carried out via US Mail.

For me it's a hobby and I somewhat enjoy the effort of a manual system but I don't fault others who want to automate. Everybody can make their own decision and that's wonderful.

 

[RM-MN]

I think you should start with a single grain of barley, raise it, replant, etc until you have enough barley to plant 20 acres, then save out a bushel that you will malt. Hops will need to be raised from seed too! Capture wild yeast and propagate and save the best until you finally have a strain that makes drinkable beer.

Or maybe just let someone else to that work while you do the work you are good at and buy the product from the people who are good at all the other things. Specialization can get you better results.

 

[odie]

cheating?

Electric? no.

Automated? yes.

 

[lumpher]

I'm not sure why someone who has been using a 3-vessel system for years and has developed a process that works well and gives them results that they're happy with would want to switch, but I'm also not sure what that has to do with the original question.

Mostly time available and what we can invest in it. I still have my 3 piece system, but I use my AIO mostly because I can tell it what to do, keep it at a certain temp, and not have to watch it, turn the propane up or down, etc. A flip of a switch or open a valve and I can go back to other things that need doing. Right now I couldn't brew if I had to concentrate on it for 4-5 hours, but I will again at some point, so willing to have both.

 

[marc1]

Wooden vats!? Lucky you! Anything other than clay and reeds is cheating.
View attachment 842257

We were evicted from our hole in the ground; we had to go live in the lake.



Seriously though, not cheating.

There's plenty to tweak if you want to, plus the whole cold side process you can obsess about.

 

[day_trippr]

There's dumb stuff like using post-boil wheat flour that might be considered cheating - though I'd call it unethical - or maybe using artificial extracts in place of real fruit derived products. But equipment evolves and exploiting same can't be considered cheating, lest literally everything in use today be considered cheating vs the primitive gear and methodologies of days deservedly gone by...

Cheers!

 

[lumpher]

I remember back in the days when REAL men brewed beer and we had to start the mash

 

[Closet Fermenter]

I understand that when the first boxed cake mixes came out, they were widely rejected. The women thought that just adding water, stirring it up, putting it in a hot oven on a timer was “cheating”.
A lot of market research was done and the product was changed. Now, the good lady had to supply, crack, and stir in her own egg! She was now involved in the ingredients and mixing. It wouldn’t work without her input. Box cakes became a wildly popular success!

So, just add your egg, stir, and brew on!

 

[Control Freak]

Look to the left.
Answer, Nope

 

[sibelman]

Buying commercial beer is definitely cheating.

 

[Broken Crow]

I remember back in the days when REAL men brewed beer and we had to start the mashView attachment 842333

 

[JAReeves]

I think the internet is cheating...
We should require these discussions be carried out via US Mail.

Cheating.

Carrier Pigeon or nothing.