For those that keg condition

[shoreman]

For those that keg condition, can you post what your process is? Do you use any online calculators for certain styles?

I recently conditioned a keg and found that the first few pints were super foamy and the carbonation in the beer was a bit underwhelming. The foam and head was fantastic, but not super carbonated - and it was a saison. Would have been perfect for a British style Bitter or something.

I'm hoping to just use bursts of co2 to replace the pressure and keg condition all my beers.

Thanks for any replies.

 

[Jag75]

https://www.brewersfriend.com/keg-carbonation-calculator/

This is what I use . 99% of the time i force carb . Most of the beers i do are about the same volumes except stouts. I set to 30 psi for 36 hours . Then i set to 12 -14 psi for another 36 hours . It's pretty much fully carbed after that . You can fine tune after that .

 

[lump42]

I use the same calculator as Jag. I built a spunding valve and set the release pressure a few tenths of co2 volume low and for the temps in my basement (60-70). I add the same amount of sugar to prime as would bottle and let it sit for a week or two. I'll then put the keg on serving pressure for a few days to finish carbing and to let the rest of the yeast settle out. First pint or two may be murky/chunky depending on the yeast strain and fininings. I usually only do this if I have a waiting line to get into the keezer.

 

[friarsmith]

+1 on the BF calculator. I usually refrigerate 1.5 quarts of saved wort (aka speise) from the boil in a 2 quart sanitized mason jar. Within a day or two after the beer reaches FG, I put the speise in the keg, purge, and rack beer as usual. Since I mostly make lagers I leave the keg in a 60* ferm chamber or in my cool basement for a week to clean up diacetyl and carbonate. You could let a keg of ale sit 1-2 weeks at room temp then chill for a few days before pouring.

 

[b-boy]

I force carb. It's just easier. I transfer right to the keg, seal, and pressurize in the kegerator. I don't have to mess with sugar calculators. I don't have to boil and cool sugar water. There's less chance of over-carbing.

 

[Vale71]

For those that keg condition, can you post what your process is? Do you use any online calculators for certain styles?

I recently conditioned a keg and found that the first few pints were super foamy and the carbonation in the beer was a bit underwhelming. The foam and head was fantastic, but not super carbonated - and it was a saison. Would have been perfect for a British style Bitter or something.

I'm hoping to just use bursts of co2 to replace the pressure and keg condition all my beers.

Thanks for any replies.

That sounds more like a serving issue than a carbonation issue. If your system is not correctly set up you'll end up losing lots of CO2 to foaming and the beer in the glass will appear undercarbonated. If you then let the carbonation in your keg decrease by setting too low of a serving pressure than the issue probably fixed itself and the excessive foaming stopped as the beer became tuned to your system instead of the other way around as it should be.

 

[odie]

I just put fresh kegs on CO2 for a while at my intended serving pressure. They sit in a temp controlled freezer around 55' (35' if a lager). I know it won't fully carb since my serving mid 30s. when a tap opens I just move it in and let it rip. after a couple days the serving temp & press combo should finish up the carbing process?

 

[odie]

that calculator tells me I gotta be negative pressure??? I'm planning to try nitro on a stout...everyone is telling me like 1.2-1.4 vol max carb before I hook up the beer gas?

 

[shoreman]

Thanks.

I know how to force carb a keg and have done that for years, I don't really want to debate that in this post.

I'm more looking for information/process on natural carbonation in the keg with either sugar added or Speise as @friarsmith mentioned.

 

[shoreman]

+1 on the BF calculator. I usually refrigerate 1.5 quarts of saved wort (aka speise) from the boil in a 2 quart sanitized mason jar.

Do you notice a higher quality of carbonation, head retention and pour with using the saved wort vs corn sugar prime?

 

[friarsmith]

Tighter bubbles, more compact and usually longer-lasting head, less carbonic bite, "smoother" mouthfeel I suppose, and improved shelf life as the speise/remnant yeast scavenges a lot of oxygen in the carbonation process. You also save a lot of CO2 in your tank and free-up fermenters faster. FWIW I haven't noticed a lot of difference between using DME/water as the carbonating solution or saved wort. I prefer to use saved wort and save DME for starters.

 

[brewbama]

Just transfer to a keg with a few gravity points remaining until FG and slap a spunding valve on the keg. You’ll free up the fermenter even faster.

 

[Jsmith2154]

For those that keg condition, can you post what your process is? Do you use any online calculators for certain styles?

I recently conditioned a keg and found that the first few pints were super foamy and the carbonation in the beer was a bit underwhelming. The foam and head was fantastic, but not super carbonated - and it was a saison. Would have been perfect for a British style Bitter or something.

I'm hoping to just use bursts of co2 to replace the pressure and keg condition all my beers.

Thanks for any replies.

+1 on the BF calculator. I usually refrigerate 1.5 quarts of saved wort (aka speise) from the boil in a 2 quart sanitized mason jar. Within a day or two after the beer reaches FG, I put the speise in the keg, purge, and rack beer as usual. Since I mostly make lagers I leave the keg in a 60* ferm chamber or in my cool basement for a week to clean up diacetyl and carbonate. You could let a keg of ale sit 1-2 weeks at room temp then chill for a few days before pouring.

I have a festbier fermenting right now. I want to keg condition it. Do I absolutely need a spunding valve? I’ve been contemplating making one anyway but with current stay at home I’m not sure how quickly I could get the parts.

 

[Transamguy77]

I have a festbier fermenting right now. I want to keg condition it. Do I absolutely need a spunding valve? I’ve been contemplating making one anyway but with current stay at home I’m not sure how quickly I could get the parts.

I am going this route now and I got all the parts on amazon except for the ball lock quick disconnects. took about a week total.

 

[friarsmith]

I've never used a spunding valve. You shouldn't need one as long as:

1) the beer is within the last 4 points or so of expected FG (as determined by a forced fermentation test or indicated by past experience) or
2) FG is reached and you use an appropriate amount of speise/dextrose/DME

Worse case scenario-- if the beer is a little over-carb'd you can just relieve the pressure before serving. Be sure to give the keg a few days to reach serving temp before testing it. It'll be hella-foamy if you test a pint before it gets cold.

 

[Jsmith2154]

I was leaning towards method #2. Though I do force ferment tests I mainly use them for yeast harvesting and I am odd about my Fermentations. As soon as I pitch yeast I do everything possible to not open a fermentor.
You have piqued my curiosity on speise method I may start reading up on it.

 

[friarsmith]

You have piqued my curiosity on speise method I may start reading up on it.

I have found that using/saving 1.5 qt chilled wort from the brew day in a half gallon sanitized mason jar (kept in refrigerator until kegging) is about as effective as using 3-4 oz dextrose in just enough boiled water to dissolve it. The former is more 'traditional' and complies with German R'bot (if that matters to you), but if you get busy at the end of a brew day and forget about the speise, mixing up dextrose (or dme) a week later works just fine.

 

[Die_Beerery]

Brewed Friday 5/8, yeast pitched 4:30pm Fermented at 66f, with bells house yeast
Spunded Sunday 5/10 @ 4:30pm @68f
Will most likely be fully carbed and at FG tonight.

So 48hrs from yeast pitch to spund, another 24 for FG and full carb, in the lowest oxygen environment possible.
72hrs isn't bad for a beer turn around.
Beer stats:
2 hearted ipa type beer
1.062 og
1.013 spund
1.009-10 Fg

 

[VikeMan]

2 hearted ipa type beer

What style of lager is that?

 

[Die_Beerery]

What style of lager is that?

Contrary to popular assumption, I do like (properly) made ales as well!

 

[Dr_Jeff]

I would like to know about the electronic spunding valve/system pictured below.
I have the "standard homemade device" that most people build.

Brewed Friday 5/8, yeast pitched 4:30pm Fermented at 66f, with bells house yeast
Spunded Sunday 5/10 @ 4:30pm @68f
Will most likely be fully carbed and at FG tonight.

So 48hrs from yeast pitch to spund, another 24 for FG and full carb, in the lowest oxygen environment possible.
72hrs isn't bad for a beer turn around.
Beer stats:
2 hearted ipa type beer
1.062 og
1.013 spund
1.009-10 Fg

 

[Die_Beerery]

I would like to know about the electronic spunding valve/system pictured below.
I have the "standard homemade device" that most people build.

Sure, It's on my blog here:
http://www.********************/brewing-methods/spunding-automation-and-logic/

 

[Dr_Jeff]

Thanks, I've been looking over the information at the link that you provided and already do a large portion of what you outline as my usual practice.

Do you build and sell that device?
If so, how much?

I usually brew two beers (10 gallon batches) in tandem, with the first beer 30-45 minutes ahead of the first.
I've been fermenting under pressure for a couple of years now, and when my beers finish, they are usually mostly or fully carbonated and I transfer under pressure to sanitized fully purged kegs jumpered together. So I would need two of the devices to go on the fermenters and a control unit that would support the two fermenters, or two control units.

thx,
Jeff