Bile (vomit) taste/odor

[Eormenric]

I just brewed a batch of gruit and wound up with a smell, and to a lesser degree a taste, of bile in the beer. It's been in the bottle about 8 weeks now, and was in the primary for a month then went to bottles. Other than that, it's great. My friends actually had several batches-scottish ales, wheat beers, and stouts, taste this way-and threw them all out because they never improved. We're both extract+grain brewers.

This particular off flavor is not one I or my friend can find anything about. Does anyone know what I'm talking about and have a clue to the cause(s)? Thanks!

 

[homebrewer_99]

Now you know why no one brews "gruit" anymore!!! Sorry, I couldn't resist...

It sounds fishy (no pun intended) if you and your friends have had similar problems like this in the past.

Do you have more info such as recipe, fermenting temps, notes, etc?

Maybe there's someone closer to you that can drop by and lend some pointers. It's always good to have a brewing buddy around that can offer assistance.

 

[GRHunter]

It smells and tastes like bile ... otherwise it's great? I am no expert but I would say that something is horribly wrong. Assuming that all of your equipment is in good order and properly sanitized I would assume that there is something wrong with your process. Can you explain in a little more detail on what your brewing process is?

 

[homebrewer_99]

I did a GOOGLE search and came up with this guy:

http://www.fortunecity.com/boozers/brewerytap/555/gruit.htm

The article is older so he may not be available, but it's worth a try.

 

[merddyn2002]

if you can share your recipe that would be helpful.

If the odor and/or flavor intensifies over time it's most likely an infection.

 

[COLObrewer]

It has to be something common between you and your friends, do you use the same equipment? I'd hate to say water is the culprit buy I guess it's possible.

 

[GRHunter]

It has to be something common between you and your friends, do you use the same equipment? I'd hate to say water is the culprit buy I guess it's possible.

Being many beers into brew day yesterday I guess I missed the part that all his friends had the same issue. So after re-reading this post with a few more functioning brain cells I would suggest looking at where the OP and his friends have commonality in their beers. Water is prime suspect, as would be fermentation temperature. But I would still like to hear what his process is.

 

[Eormenric]

Thanks, everyone. Yeah-it's not just my gruit-my friends' stout, wheat and scottish had it, too. I don't know what's common-not water-I live in COlorado, they live in MN and tried different waters to get rid of the problem on their end. They used bleach to sanitize, I used starsan.
My fermentation temperature is about 70 degrees-they ferment at room temperature. What more would be useful to know about my process? I steeped the grains in a grain bag as per standard procedure, and then boiled the herbs (rather than hops) for 30 minutes, and added the extract for 15 minutes of the boil (late extract method). Then I cooled in a water bath and poured it into the primary and topped off with filtered water to get to 2.5 gallons (it's a half batch). And added the yeast. Then I left it in primary for 4 weeks and bottled.

Thanks again.

 

[GRHunter]

Thanks, everyone. Yeah-it's not just my gruit-my friends' stout, wheat and scottish had it, too. I don't know what's common-not water-I live in COlorado, they live in MN and tried different waters to get rid of the problem on their end. They used bleach to sanitize, I used starsan.
My fermentation temperature is about 70 degrees-they ferment at room temperature. What more would be useful to know about my process? I steeped the grains in a grain bag as per standard procedure, and then boiled the herbs (rather than hops) for 30 minutes, and added the extract for 15 minutes of the boil (late extract method). Then I cooled in a water bath and poured it into the primary and topped off with filtered water to get to 2.5 gallons (it's a half batch). And added the yeast. Then I left it in primary for 4 weeks and bottled.

Thanks again.

What about your equipment? All it would take would be one piece of equipment that is non-food grade to contribute to some off flavors.

 

[Eormenric]

My fermenter is a better bottle. My kettle is an enameled canning pot. My hoses could be old/non-food grade, although I've used them for many batches, even one since, and didn't have this problem. Bottling bucket is food grade, and has been used before and since. ?????Anything else???? Thanks for your good questions.

 

[ballzac]

Any commonalities in the hop or grain bill, or the yeast used? Poor quality or old hops can cause some pretty bad flavours. Your fermentation temp seems fine, but it depends on what yeast you are using.

 

[ballzac]

Also, are you able to elaborate on the exact smell/taste? Is it acrid and bitter like bile, or is it more the sickly kind of smell, or both?

 

[Eormenric]

I can't think of any commonalities-we order from different stores in different parts of the country. And we never did actually cross-taste our beers-but it is so striking that we would describe it the same way. It its almost a sickly sweet smell-with a taste second. It could almost be ok-I've drank a couple and struggled through it.

 

[ballzac]

Doesn't sound like a hop problem (which it may have been if it was more bitter/acrid). I think it would be fallacious to assume that you are both experiencing the same problem, even though you describe it the same. I wouldn't rule it out though.

Could possibly be a yeast issue. What yeast did you use, and what was your attenuation like? It's possible that your friend has a poor process somewhere along the line that you don't know about. Sounds like your process is fine, so it could be a yeast issue or perhaps just the herbs you used or something particular to this recipe. Perhaps different causes are resulting in defects that are descriptively similar. What herbs did you use?

 

[944play]

Could possibly be a yeast issue.

+1. I've been noticing that low and medium gravity beers fermented with Chico yeast (and its analogs) tend to taste a little pukey to my palate. Both the famous and the not-so-famous brewpub here in town exhibit it as well as North Coast and, indeed, Sierra Nevada.

Wish I had a pH meter.. damn it, now I have to shop for a pH meter.:fro:

 

[EricT]

Thanks, everyone. Yeah-it's not just my gruit-my friends' stout, wheat and scottish had it, too. I don't know what's common-not water-I live in COlorado, they live in MN and tried different waters to get rid of the problem on their end. They used bleach to sanitize, I used starsan.
My fermentation temperature is about 70 degrees-they ferment at room temperature. What more would be useful to know about my process? I steeped the grains in a grain bag as per standard procedure, and then boiled the herbs (rather than hops) for 30 minutes, and added the extract for 15 minutes of the boil (late extract method). Then I cooled in a water bath and poured it into the primary and topped off with filtered water to get to 2.5 gallons (it's a half batch). And added the yeast. Then I left it in primary for 4 weeks and bottled.

Thanks again.

I would look into the Herbs you guys used. Can you post the Recipe?