ale vs lager

[grego2]

Ok, I have been searching for awhile about the subject of temps for a lager, I have put the first batch (ale) into secondary and it is sitting nicely at 66 -67 degrees. I have decided to brew a lager for my next batch but I can't seem to find the answer for a couple of questions about the lager brew.
1. Do you ferment at 65-70 degrees in the primary or is it lower? Consider that you use lager yeast.
2. What is the warmest that you can keep a lager in either the primary or secondary before it goes bad (taste like crap, no seriously, crap)?
3. Will keeping it at 66-70 degrees make it taste awful ? I would be keeping the ale and lager in the same fermentation cooler.
4. I have read about using ale yeast to make it ferment at higher temps but does that only mean for the primary then you "cold filter" or "lager" the beer at 55 degrees?

And finally, what do you do with the leftover yeast and trub?

 

[nick1023]

it depends on what kind of lager you are making, those temps would be fine for a california steam lager but for the typical lager they would be too high. I havent brewed any lager except for steam lager so I dont know from personal experience but from what I have read, primary lager fermentation should be about 50f secondary should be about 40f and a couple of days before the end it should be elevated to 60f. this is hard to do without refridgeration, thats why I stick with ales which do good at 70f typically.

 

[nick1023]

i want to make sure I answered your questions.. yes making a lager at 66-70f would taste aweful... no you dont have to "cold filter" or "lager" an ale beer only a lager beer.... get rid of the leftover yeast and trub... unless you wanted to reuse the yeast but thats another can of worms.

 

[Kaiser]

2. What is the warmest that you can keep a lager in either the primary or secondary before it goes bad (taste like crap, no seriously, crap)?

Califiornia common aside, I don't recommend trying a lager if you cannot keep the fermentation temps below 60F and can't lager it for a while at below 50F. If you are after a clean tasting beer and can't do lagers, use a clean ale yeast and ferment it in the mid 60s. This should give you a cleaner beer than trying to make a lager at no-ideal temps.

I gave Dude a Pale Ale made with WY1056 (fermented at 65F and stored at 50F in the secondary) and he thought it was a lager. This tells me that you can get a very clean tasting beer w/o using lager yeast and lager temps.

Kai