Aging beer: Facts, myths, and discussion

[universalfrost]

i have an oatmeal stout that i let sit in secondary for at least 6 months and then bottle and foreget about for at least a year.. any sooner than that and it tastes like donkey piss... so minimum 18 months from brew to popping the bottle and its great.. ive been brewing this stout for 10 years and after about 2 years in bottle it starts turning bad, but literally 1 year and 364 days in a bottle and it's still great.

i also have sierra nevada celebration ales that I keep in my beer cellar along with some cask aged saisons that have been in bottle for over 4 years.. i popped a 3 year old celebration ale from 2014 last week and still perfect sierra nevada.

 

[specharka]

The problem with declaring our homebrew to be better once it's aged is that there is no objective way to know how the flavors have changed. Our own taste bud react differently over time. My wife went from thinking Yuengling was great to drinking Green Flash Double IPA in a matter of weeks After that Yuengling tasted awful to her-she changed, not the beer.
We may think we remember what it tasted like a year ago but we really can't. If we could somehow preserve the unaged beer to compare it with the aged version all our questions would be answered, but without some sort of time machine that's not gonna happen.
Aging is probably good for a few very strong beers, or maybe beers that are harsh due to over hopping, but, just like wine, I would bet 95% of our beers do not improve with age.

I think you could easily brew the same beer 3, 4 times in a row (assuming your process is sound), perform a blind vertical taste test, and come up with an objective sensory analysis.

 

[der_Missionar]

I find that I can consistently produce not just a drinkable product, but a very good beer in well under the oft quoted 6 week (1-2-3) timetable. Lately, I've even been able to get great results without resorting to all the crazy gadgetry that you see posted all over the DIY forum and plastered across my gallery. I've been brewing 6 gallon batches of all grain, single infusion mashed, batch sparged beer. I've never filtered my beer, I'm not doing anything complex, and I'm convinced that anyone can replicate the process. From my experience, here are the keys:

Keep the recipe simple. Heaps of spices, large amounts of strong flavored malts, hefty hops schedules, and non-traditional ingredients can force you to condition the beer for an extended period. There's nothing wrong with big, complex recipes, but don't expect a quick turnaround when brewing them.

Is the 123 rule, 1 week primary, 2 weeks secondary, 3 weeks in bottles?

You are then proposing 3 weeks primary, 3 weeks bottles?

 

[cmac62]

Is the 123 rule, 1 week primary, 2 weeks secondary, 3 weeks in bottles?

You are then proposing 3 weeks primary, 3 weeks bottles?

I'm of the opinion that secondary is only an extra chance to oxidize/infect the brew and it doesn't really add or take away anything.

 

[BostonianBrewer]

The only garuntee when aging beer is change.

 

[anotherbeerplease]

Aging does objectively benefit some beers. And some beers even require aging to come into their own. Take barleywine, a very extreme beer even though it might not taste "extreme", moreso it tastes unique. But it is indeed an extreme beer that benefits greatly from aging. A great barleywine might very well max the IBUs out at 100+, it should not taste bitter, or necessarily alcoholic. I personally brewed a 13% 100IBU barleywine this March that is only now in September beginning to come together. Previously it was far too bitter and alcoholic to enjoy. I expect that it will be another year before it is truly ready to drink.

I also brewed an 11% stout last summer 2017 that was great over the holidays last year. But only now has it truly become one of the best beers I've ever had, with notes of vanilla and chocolate and a smoothness that just wasn't there before.

Or take Marzen and Oktoberfest beers - traditionally/historically brewed in spring and stored until fall to drink. The lagering process objectively adds clarity and taste to these beers.

But I've also tried some of my own IPA brews, and one particular fall spiced ale, that just were not great after a few months in the keg. So it really depends on the beer. And what the brewer is going for. Stout/barleywine/lager, I say age it and drink it slowly, and see what happens!

 

[norsk]

Most of my beers go from grain to tap in 10 days or so, some as quick as 7 days, the Dark Belgian Strong being the exception, though even with that beer I think that the cellaring is over rated.

 

[BostonianBrewer]

Aging does objectively benefit some beers. And some beers even require aging to come into their own. Take barleywine, a very extreme beer even though it might not taste "extreme", moreso it tastes unique. But it is indeed an extreme beer that benefits greatly from aging. A great barleywine might very well max the IBUs out at 100+, it should not taste bitter, or necessarily alcoholic. I personally brewed a 13% 100IBU barleywine this March that is only now in September beginning to come together. Previously it was far too bitter and alcoholic to enjoy. I expect that it will be another year before it is truly ready to drink.

I also brewed an 11% stout last summer 2017 that was great over the holidays last year. But only now has it truly become one of the best beers I've ever had, with notes of vanilla and chocolate and a smoothness that just wasn't there before.

Or take Marzen and Oktoberfest beers - traditionally/historically brewed in spring and stored until fall to drink. The lagering process objectively adds clarity and taste to these beers.

But I've also tried some of my own IPA brews, and one particular fall spiced ale, that just were not great after a few months in the keg. So it really depends on the beer. And what the brewer is going for. Stout/barleywine/lager, I say age it and drink it slowly, and see what happens!

As I said...only change is guaranteed

 

[Chris Grubb]

I got a 5 gallon used bourbon barrel for Christmas.
Going to use it to age a porter, but I have a question.
How long should I let it sit to get the bourbon flavor but not too strong, and is the barrel sanitizing process the same as sanitizing a keg or fermenter?

 

[ThirstyPawsHB]

I got a 5 gallon used bourbon barrel for Christmas.
Going to use it to age a porter, but I have a question.
How long should I let it sit to get the bourbon flavor but not too strong, and is the barrel sanitizing process the same as sanitizing a keg or fermenter?

Have you tested it first? If the wood shrunk it'll take maybe a week to seal.

I did about 7days with my BA RIS seemed about right. It's a lot different then the 55gal barrels which take much much longer. You can sample with a santized turkey baster.

As far a santizing, use bourbon.

 

[IslandLizard]

^
Even a week maybe a bit too much for a Porter if it's a freshly dumped barrel. There is a lot of surface area (wood, Bourbon) compared to its volume compared to a 55 gallon barrel.

Maybe brew 2 batches and fill the barrel with the 2nd batch after the first is done enough after a few days.

 

[Chris Grubb]

Have you tested it first? If the wood shrunk it'll take maybe a week to seal.

I did about 7days with my BA RIS seemed about right. It's a lot different then the 55gal barrels which take much much longer. You can sample with a santized turkey baster.

As far a santizing, use bourbon.

What do you mean by seal? If I use it as a secondary with the bung in, what else needs to be done ?

 

[ThirstyPawsHB]

What do you mean by seal? If I use it as a secondary with the bung in, what else needs to be done ?

If the wood dries out it shrinks and will not hold anything. Take 1/2cup of bourbon, or water, pour it in swish it around. Do it outside just in case.

And yes, I'd check it after 3 days for flavor.

 

[Chris Grubb]

Thanks. I will try that out. If it has shrunk, is there a way to re-hydrate it to hold liquid?
Keep it in a humid basement for a few days?

 

[ThirstyPawsHB]

Great question. I used a sh!t ton of water over a many days. Think I washed out some flavor. Wood wont swell instantaneously, it needs time.

I'd do the .5-1cup bourbon thing. If leaks, let sit for 6-8hrs and then try again. Hopefully over time you see changes. LHBS sells them and thinking of getting another w/better knowledge.

Use cheep yet decent Wiskey like Ezra Brooks also.

 

[Davedrinksbeer]

I have used a 5 gallon bourbon barrel a couple times before, it was from a bourbon place in Indianapolis. Go ahead and make your beer, then when it’s time to put it in the barrel, boil 3 gallons of water, pour the boiling hot water into the barrel to sterilize it. Swish it around very carefully and pour out. Then siphon in your beer. Should take around 3 weeks sitting for the first beer to take on the bourbon flavors and then 3-4 weeks for your second beer. I’d go with a bigger beer your first time like a stout then do the porter in the barrel your 2nd time. If you don’t want to use hot water I’d sterilize it with a bottle of bourbon poured in there and rotate the barrel around for a few days and then save that bourbon for drinking or to reuse it again for sterilizing.

 

[Mitch S]

Great question. I used a sh!t ton of water over a many days. Think I washed out some flavor. Wood wont swell instantaneously, it needs time.

I'd do the .5-1cup bourbon thing. If leaks, let sit for 6-8hrs and then try again. Hopefully over time you see changes. LHBS sells them and thinking of getting another w/better knowledge.

Use cheep yet decent Wiskey like Ezra Brooks also.

I have used a 5 gallon bourbon barrel a couple times before, it was from a bourbon place in Indianapolis. Go ahead and make your beer, then when it’s time to put it in the barrel, boil 3 gallons of water, pour the boiling hot water into the barrel to sterilize it. Swish it around very carefully and pour out. Then siphon in your beer. Should take around 3 weeks sitting for the first beer to take on the bourbon flavors and then 3-4 weeks for your second beer. I’d go with a bigger beer your first time like a stout then do the porter in the barrel your 2nd time. If you don’t want to use hot water I’d sterilize it with a bottle of bourbon poured in there and rotate the barrel around for a few days and then save that bourbon for drinking or to reuse it again for sterilizing.

What kind of water did y'all use in the barrel? I've read somewhere (I think on a comment for a barrel for sale online) that you shouldn't use water directly from the tap. Something to do with chlorine affecting the wood adversely.

 

[IslandLizard]

What kind of water did y'all use in the barrel? I've read somewhere (I think on a comment for a barrel for sale online) that you shouldn't use water directly from the tap. Something to do with chlorine affecting the wood adversely.

Right, because they form chlorophenols. Any water that's used in brewing or wine/mead making should be devoid of Chlorine or Chloramines, which is what your water company adds to keep it sanitized. A 1/4 Campden tablet or a good pinch of K-Meta per 5 gallons eliminates either of them within minutes. No, charcoal filters don't or not very well.

 

[Davedrinksbeer]

What kind of water did y'all use in the barrel? I've read somewhere (I think on a comment for a barrel for sale online) that you shouldn't use water directly from the tap. Something to do with chlorine affecting the wood adversely.

When you boil the water for about 10 minutes that destroys all water contaminates in there. I live in Louisville though and we have very good city water. You could always go buy 2.5 gallon jug of spring water for $3 and boil that. My Barrel was well sealed so I never had a leakage problem. I would think Boiling water poured in would swell that wood and seal it.

 

[ThirstyPawsHB]

What kind of water did y'all use in the barrel? I've read somewhere (I think on a comment for a barrel for sale online) that you shouldn't use water directly from the tap. Something to do with chlorine affecting the wood adversely.

Interesting. I did use Austin tap. The beer, BA 10-Fidy clone, came out fantastic! The next was a BA Quad. I don't have enough data.

 

[Unicorn_Platypus]

Aging does objectively benefit some beers. And some beers even require aging to come into their own. Take barleywine, a very extreme beer even though it might not taste "extreme", moreso it tastes unique. But it is indeed an extreme beer that benefits greatly from aging. A great barleywine might very well max the IBUs out at 100+, it should not taste bitter, or necessarily alcoholic. I personally brewed a 13% 100IBU barleywine this March that is only now in September beginning to come together. Previously it was far too bitter and alcoholic to enjoy. I expect that it will be another year before it is truly ready to drink.

I also brewed an 11% stout last summer 2017 that was great over the holidays last year. But only now has it truly become one of the best beers I've ever had, with notes of vanilla and chocolate and a smoothness that just wasn't there before.

Or take Marzen and Oktoberfest beers - traditionally/historically brewed in spring and stored until fall to drink. The lagering process objectively adds clarity and taste to these beers.

But I've also tried some of my own IPA brews, and one particular fall spiced ale, that just were not great after a few months in the keg. So it really depends on the beer. And what the brewer is going for. Stout/barleywine/lager, I say age it and drink it slowly, and see what happens!

I think it depends on the barleywine style, yeast strain and hops. I recently brewed a 12% ABV American Barleywine and it tasted fantastic within ~3 weeks from brew day. Here was my process:

-I pitched 3 packs of Notty (rehydrated and used a sh*t ton of pure O2)
-fermented at 60 degrees for first five days (keeps it clean, low esters)
-raised to 70 for 9 days (this speeds things up)
-dry hopped in keg 3 days
-chilled keg overnight
-burst carbonated for 24 hours @ 35 PSI
-brought to serving pressure @ 10 PSI and let sit for 2 days
-drink beer

I use the clear beer system so I'm pulling beer from the top (sediment free). It also helps that Notty is a hell of a floculator.

I honestly prefered this beer at 3 days from being on gas vs. how it tastes after aging. But thats probably because it was a massively hoppy beer.

 

[user 205607]

Revenant English Mild

 

[BBQB]

Revenant English MildView attachment 636343

Please post the recipe for this vixen

 

[user 205607]

Sorry, not my beer, I was at the brewery. Fat fingering the app and posted on the wrong thread.

 

[TNTurkey]

I brewed my highest gravity beer so far about 7 months ago. It's a Belgian Tripel, OG 1.081, ABV 8.2%, bottled after 2 weeks in the primary and 2 weeks in the secondary.
It took a LONG time for the beer to bottle carbonate-it's just now gotten acceptably carbonated. I used corn sugar recommended for 2.3 vols by my brewing software. The carbonation thing is not such a big deal as I don't mind my beers a little bit on the flat side.
The main problem is that, after 6 months, it still has an overwhelmingly harsh alcohol character, and I would like to age it for at least another 6 months to see if this goes away. It has some really nice, complex malty flavors and I'd like to drink it at its best if possible.
Unfortunately, I don't have a cellar, and the best I can do is room temperature which averages about 76 in the summer and 68 in the winter.
Can I still age this beer for over a year at these temps, or am I asking for trouble?
Thanks for the great forum! I always find some fantastic info.

 

[cmac62]

Turkey, my best understanding is the higher the storage temp the quicker the beer ages. I don't know if there are any equations out there that will help work this out. I have a Barley Wine that I brewed 3 years ago sitting in my closet. The ABV is a little higher at about 10, and the temps are more stable at around 72 year round, but the beer is still moving in the positive direction. Actually I need to put a bottle in the fridge to give it a taste. I hope you get some different responses, because this is just my take from what I have read.

 

[TNTurkey]

Turkey, my best understanding is the higher the storage temp the quicker the beer ages. I don't know if there are any equations out there that will help work this out. I have a Barley Wine that I brewed 3 years ago sitting in my closet. The ABV is a little higher at about 10, and the temps are more stable at around 72 year round, but the beer is still moving in the positive direction. Actually I need to put a bottle in the fridge to give it a taste. I hope you get some different responses, because this is just my take from what I have read.

Thanks. I did put a bottle in the fridge today and will give it a try tomorrow. Maybe I’ll try one a month and see how it progresses.

 

[Johst12]

I recently purchased this new product (both variants) without a plan to do with it. I just wanted to check it out.
https://www.johnihaas.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/BH_2018023_Provoak_Flyer_PRINT.pdf

I made a test dry"wood" with the european version. Just one pellet straight into a bottle of german pils. I really liked the result. Nice barrell aged like aroma in the background, not too much. Hops didn't come out much.

I now have an imperial stout (5 gal) in the fermenter that would go nice with the barrel aged aroma. Its a 20P, 10 ABV, 50 IBU, 197 EBC beer, pretty dark and heavy. Would you guys give it a go? I'm a litte worried about extra oxidation, since I plan on keeping some bottles for a year or longer. Has any body experience with dryhopping and aging of imperial stouts?

 

[odie]

What beers do not like to age? I have a couple freezers I use to store kegs until a tap opens. But I don't want to have too many in the bullpen if there are downsides to "aging". I'm guessing anything hoppy will lose it's hoppiness over time...not sure how fast though

I have my first high gravity beer aging right now...about a 14% RIS. Brewed in feb, kegged in March, been sitting in a freezer at 55-60' ever since, probably half carbed (haven't actually left the CO2 on long enough at a PSI for carb it fully)… I just had a keg blow last night so I have a tap open...but I kinda want to wait while I get a nitro step up put together.

 

[Dave Sarber]

Let the RIS age for another 6 months.

You will be glad you did.