AB acquired Wicked Weed

[h22lude]

The Northern Brewer buyout sucked all the people I used to talk to are still there and last week they were offering $20 All Grain kits. I would have killed that $20 All Grain kit deal, except I just bought a 50 pound sack of grain.

You have the typical cheap consumer mentality. Give me everything as cheap as possible. I don't care what it does to the little guy. AB buying NB/MWS will eventually hurt your small LHBS. Your LHBS can't sell kits for $20. AB has so much buying power that they get grains for so cheap, they are still making money on $20 kits. Instead of supporting your LHBS, you go to NB because you want the best deal.

Now I'm not saying what you are doing is wrong. You can shop wherever you want. But it is naive to think these AB buyouts aren't hurting the small businesses.

 

[rodwha]

"If an Heiser Bush owned every Craft brewery in America and that meant I could get every beer in America in my store that wouldn't be the worst thing."

You've completely missed it then.

 

[Grannyknot]

Okay. Except most of these are not buyouts.

sorry "partnerships"

 

[rodwha]

"The people that do all the hard work are likely to get paid better..."

Obviously you haven't read much about what InBev often does, which is to close the original brewery and lay off those workers in efforts to save themselves money.

 

[h22lude]

"The people that do all the hard work are likely to get paid better..."

Obviously you haven't read much about what InBev often does, which is to close the original brewery and lay off those workers in efforts to save themselves money.

Wait, AB is more about money than helping the local economy? I'm shocked (insert internet sarcasm).

 

[h22lude]

I never really thought i'd see the day when any craft beer site had a majority of people saying not to worry about AB buyouts and that everything would be fine, possibly better.

I didn't think there would be this many people ok with it but I guess saving money for some people is more important than helping local mom and pop businesses.

 

[bajaedition]

bottom line in this discussion is we are seeing what can happen to an unregulated economy where power is garnered to those who can spend the most money.
A company has no moral responsibility, it only needs to make the most money it can. Bulldozing over anyone they want. If left unregulated then that is legal.
The sad part of this is we just elected an administration that favors big business.
What is happening is not just isolated to the beer industry but is happening everywhere. We no longer as a society value owning a successful business, instead we value cutting out our piece of the pie and walking away.
So when a craft brewer decides to get bought out, we sit here and complain that it was IN Bevs fault. But in reality it is the fault of the owner of the company bought out for taking IN Bevs money.
that is the bottom line, the owner took the money, he did not have to.
And it will get worse as we strip regulations from the law books in order to make America great again for big businesses only

 

[burnsie8791]

This tells me you don't know much about this brewery and their attention to detail and use of high quality locally sourced ingredients. Look at Goose Island for example and their 2015 BCBS. The fact is quality WILL suffer.

You are correct I don't know a ton about the brewery, Ive had some beers from them and enjoyed them. I do know that for ANY brewery to be successful attention to detail is a first and foremost. Being owned by INBEV has nothing to do with infections. The Bruery, Three Floyds, Revolution, and Central Waters have all had infected beers hit the market. I would argue all of those breweries pay a great deal of attention to detail.
BCBS still in my opinion is one of the better BA imp stouts on the shelf. The fact that you can now get it across the entire county is a plus in my book.

Being bought out is not gloom and doom for a brewery. It like being a fan of some indie band that get successful and deciding they suck.

If the product is good I'll consume it. The only exception would be if NAMBLA started a brewery. I might stay away from those beers.

 

[Grannyknot]

Regional Collaborations
Nationwide Collaborations
Membership in state brewers organizations
Use of Local grains in some beers (riverbend malt)
Use of locally sourced fruits and other additives

Wicked Weed was all well known for these things. Wonder what the future would hold in regards to those.

 

[madscientist451]

I never really thought i'd see the day when any craft beer site had a majority of people saying not to worry about AB buyouts and that everything would be fine, possibly better.

I don't know is a majority is saying don't worry or not worry, but generally I think homebrewers are a totally different market/opinion segment compared to your average beer consumer.
The beer business will always have startups, failures, successes, mergers, and buyouts. Its just the way things evolve. I'm certain that right now there are many entrepreneurs looking at these publicized "sellouts" looking at what the business model is and will either change their existing business or start yet another brewery.
If anyone wants to live in a truly regulated economy with government calling all the shots, I'd say move to North Korea.

 

[jmark]

... but I'm talking about objective measures of quality - shelf stability, consistency of product (where that is actually a goal), brewing practices etc.

So, you are talking about Budweiser.

WTF??? So forget that I was talking about independent craft brewers for a second... you're telling us that outside of Bud, not a single other brewer can produce beer with the objective qualities that I mentioned?



:smack:

 

[applescrap]

"The people that do all the hard work are likely to get paid better..."

Obviously you haven't read much about what InBev often does, which is to close the original brewery and lay off those workers in efforts to save themselves money.

According to this site, and post after post I have read, the only paid employees at most breweries are the head brewer. Everyone else is volunteer.

 

[applescrap]

Which indeed does help out that little guy for a portion of his profits if he only gave a portion of his company. But it has also helped AB/InBev in their goals of control. Maybe you missed Those parts in the movie?

At first they tried to stifle the little guys with deplorable practices. It didn't work as well as they had hoped and expected as passedpawn pointed out in his area, though it would be rather difficult to see what startups didn't make it. So now their tactic is to buy into any they can to again muscle in.

It's the business practices of AB/InBev I have an issue with and not big business. I had no problem buying Blue Moon or even Coors when there wasn't something else I preferred, though I do prefer to support local/small business who certainly can use the money more.

Maybe their tactics and practices don't mean much to others but it bothers the hell out of me and I refuse to deal with that.

Take a look at your clothes labels, good chance many were made in foreign countries by slave labored children. How many posts have you made in your life angry about that? What about alleppo and on and on. If you want to be bothered by stuff there are bigger human rights violations to worry about, no?

 

[hezagenius]

And in related news, Heineken completes its buyout of Lagunitas.....

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

WTF??? So forget that I was talking about independent craft brewers for a second... you're telling us that outside of Bud, not a single other brewer can produce beer with the objective qualities that I mentioned?

You said;

"Subjective measures like awards, "boutique"-ness etc. are ignored."

So, yes, I ignored the independent craft brewer label for a second and asked if

... but I'm talking about objective measures of quality - shelf stability, consistency of product (where that is actually a goal), brewing practices etc.

means Budweiser, who exemplifies those very metrics.

 

[rodwha]

Take a look at your clothes labels, good chance many were made in foreign countries by slave labored children. How many posts have you made in your life angry about that? What about alleppo and on and on. If you want to be bothered by stuff there are bigger human rights violations to worry about, no?

And it's people who don't care about the business practices but just want the cheap product that Levis and Nike opened the doors for the way things are now. Oh, and Levis 501's were my favorite in high school but I quit buying them and bought Wranglers instead despite the cowboy image they had.

And the internet wasn't born yet...

Again you seem to just miss it all.

 

[BrewKnurd]

If the assertions on this forum, and movies like the 2009 Beer Wars, are true, then AB is controlling the craft beer industry. In that case, I say keep up the good work! The craft beer explosion in my area in the last 8 years has been unbelievable.

Here's a list of Florida breweries that have opened since that movie.

Cocoa Beach Brewing Company,Cocoa Beach,2009
Cycle Brewing,St. Petersburg,2009
Swamp Head Brewery,Gainesville,2009
Intuition Ale Works,Jacksonville,2010
Pensacola Bay Brewery,Pensacola,2010
Barley Mow Brewing Co.,Largo,2011
Grayton Beer Company,Santa Rosa Beach,2011
Green Bench Brewing Company,St. Petersburg,2011
Naples Beach Brewery,Naples,2011
Organic Brewery,Hollywood,2011
Southern Brewing & Winemaking,Tampa,2011
Tequesta Brewing Company,Tequesta,2011
3 Daughters Brewing,St. Petersburg,2012
7venth Sun Brewery,Dunedin,2012
Big Storm Brewing Co.,Odessa(Pasco location),2012 (original),Clearwater (2nd location),2016 (Clearwater location)
Brew Bus Brewing,Tampa,2012
Copp Winery & Brewery,Crystal River,2012
Copperpoint Brewing Company,Boynton Beach,2012
Darwin Brewing Company,Bradenton,2012
Golden Horn Brewing Company,Tallahassee,2012
Hourglass Brewery,Longwood,2012
Mack House,Fort Lauderdale,2012
Miami Brewing Company,Homestead,2012
Aardwolf Brewing Company,Jacksonville,2013
Big Top Brewing Company,Sarasota,2013
Bone Island Brewing Company,Key West,2013
Brewers' Tasting Room,St. Petersburg,2013
Bugnutty Brewing Company,Merritt Island,2013
Calusa Brewing,Sarasota,2013
Coppertail Brewing Company,Tampa,2013
Fort Myers Brewing Company,Fort Myers,2013
Green Room Brewing Company,Jacksonville Beach,2013
Idyll Hounds Brewing Company,Santa Rosa Beach,2013
Intracoastal Brewing Company,Cocoa Beach,2013
Motorworks Brewing Company,Bradenton,2013
Ormond Brewing Company,Ormond,2013
Pair O Dice Brewing Company,Clearwater,2013
Point Ybel Brewing Company,Fort Myers,2013
Rapp Brewing Company,Seminole,2013
Sailfish Brewing Company,Fort Pierce,2013
Saltwater Brewing Company,Delray Beach,2013
St. Pete Brewing Company,St. Petersburg,2013
Tampa Beer Works,Tampa,2013
Two Henrys Brewing Company,Plant City,2013
Wynwood Brewing Company,Miami,2013
Angry Chair Brewing,Tampa,2014
Fat Point Brewing,Punta Gorda,2014
First Magnitude Brewing,Gainesville,2014
Islamorada Beer Company,Islamorada (original),2014 (original),Fort Pierce (2nd location),2016 (2nd location)
J. Wakefield Brewing,Miami,2014
JDub's Brewing Company,Sarasota,2014
LauderAle,Fort Lauderdale,2014
Mad Beach Craft Brewing Company,Madeira Beach,2014
MIA Beer Company,Doral,2014
New Smyrna Beach Brewing Company,New Smyrna Beach,2014
Orchid Island Brewery,Vero Beach,2014
Persimmon Hollow Brewing Company,DeLand,2014
Redlight Redlight Beer Parlour,Orlando,2014
Six Ten Brewing Company,Tampa,2014
Veterans United Craft Brewery,Jacksonville,2014
Ancient City Brewing,St. Augustine,2015
Bangin' Banjo Brewing,Pompano Beach,2015
Barrel of Monks Brewing,Boca Raton,2015
Bury Me Brewing,Fort Myers,2015
Cape Coral Brewing Company,Cape Coral,2015
Central 28 Beer Company,DeBary,2015
Concrete Beach Brewery,Miami,2015
Florida Keys Brewing Co.,Islamorada,2015
Grasslands Brewing Company,Tallahassee,2015
Infinite Ale Works,Ocala,2015
Waterfront Brewery,Key West,2015
81Bay Brewing,Tampa,2016
Arkane Aleworks,Largo,2016
Bog Brewing,St. Augustine,2016
Broken Strings Brewery and Black Cauldron Brewing,Orlando,2016
De Bine Brewing Co.,St. Petersburg,2016
Dead Lizard Brewing Company,Orlando,2016
Deadly Sins Brewing Company,Winter Park,2016
Grove Roots Brewing Co.,Winter Haven,2016
Gulf Coast Brewery,Pensacola,2016
Hell 'n Blazes Brewing Company,Melbourne,2016
Ocean Sun Brewing,Orlando,2016
Reprise Brewing,St. Cloud,2016
RipTide Brewing Company,Naples,2016
The Tank Brewing Co.,Miami,2016
Walking Tree Brewery,Vero Beach,2016
Southern Swells Brewing Company,Jacksonville Beach,2017
Tampa Bay Brewing Company,Tampa,1996
Engine 15 Brewing Company,Jacksonville Beach (original),2010 (original),Jacksonville (2nd location),2013 (2nd location)
Tomoka Brewing Company,Ormond Beach,2013
Wild Rover Pub and Brewery,Odessa,2013
Rebel Dog Brewing Co.,New Port Richey,2016
Wicked Barley Brewing Company,Jacksonville,2016
Cigar City Brewing,Tampa,2009

Totally off topic and just posted for a sense of perspective, here's the list of breweries that exist, at all, in Louisiana. Admittedly, its just from wikipedia, so I imagine there may be a handful missing.

40 Arpent Brewing Company[5] – Arabi, taproom,[6] opened in 2014
Abita Brewing Company – brewery and taproom in Covington, brewpub in Abita Springs, founded in 1986
Bayou Teche Brewery – Arnaudville, taproom, opened in 2010
Broken Wheel Brewery[7] – Marksville, brewery and taproom, opened in 2015
Cajun Brewing[8] – Lafayette, opened in 2015
Chafunkta Brewing Company[9] – Mandeville, founded in 2011
Chappapeela Farms Brewery[10] – Amite City, brewery and brewpub, opened in 2015
Courtyard Brewery[11] – New Orleans, tap room, opened in 2015
Covington Brewhouse – Covington, taproom, founded as Heiner Brau Brewery in 2005, renamed Covington Brewhouse in 2012
CottonPort Brewing[12] - Sterlington in Ouachita Parish, brewery and taproom, opened in 2016
Crescent City Brewhouse[13] – New Orleans, brewpub, opened in 1991
Crying Eagle Brewing Company[14] – Lake Charles, opened in 2016
Dixie Brewing Company – New Orleans; founded in 1907; the brewery was damaged by Hurricane Katrina in 2005; since then the beer has been contract brewed at other locations[15]
Flying Heart Brewing[16] - Bossier City, brewery and taproom, opened in 2015
Gnarly Barley Brewing Company[17] – Hammond, opened in 2014
Gordon Biersch Brewing Company – a national chain with several dozen brewpubs, including one in New Orleans
Great Raft Brewing – Shreveport, taproom, opened in 2013
Mudbug Brewery[18] – Thibodaux, taproom, opened in 2014
New Orleans Lager and Ale Brewing Company (NOLA) – New Orleans, taproom, opened in 2009
Old Rail Brewing Company[19] – Mandeville, brewpub, opened in 2013
Ouachita Brewing Company[20] – West Monroe, opened in 2015
Parish Brewing Company[21] – Broussard, taproom, opened in 2008
Red River Brewing[22] – Shreveport, brewery and taproom, opened in 2013
Second Line Brewing[18] – New Orleans, taproom, opened in 2014
Southern Craft Brewing Company[23] – Baton Rouge, taproom, opened in 2016
Tin Roof Brewing Company[24] – Baton Rouge, taproom, opened in 2010
Urban South Brewery[18] – New Orleans, taproom, opened in 2016

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

I can't really understand why anyone would care if ABInBev bought a brewery. The US passed the 5,000 brewery mark in 2016 and will probably go to 6,000 in a year or so. ABInBev can't buy them as fast as they are opening, there will always be more and more breweries, we aren't anywhere close to having a downsizing of the brewing business.
If Wicked Weed beer changes, there are plenty of other commercial beers to buy.
Or just make your own.

If you look at the wine market, it's dominated by a handful of major companies. This is from 2011, so it's a bit old, but I'm guessing the rough numbers are still similar.

Gallo has like 23% market share (including a bunch of subsidiary brands you've heard of and drink--if you drink wine). The company that makes Franzia has 16% market share. In fact, most of the brands that you've probably heard of are owned by one of those companies.

• The top 6 control 64% of the market.
• The top 30 control over 90% of the market.

Yet there are over 8,000 wineries in the US. And nobody is sitting here lamenting the state of "independent winemakers selling out" that I'm aware of.

Like it or not, this is where the beer industry is going. And it's ok. What it means is that there's room for the big guy AND the little guy.

That means a lot of breweries (and I think the US can easily support more breweries than wineries) are going to be very small, local, lifestyle businesses. They won't be sold on store shelves. They'll have tap rooms of their own, and maybe supply local restaurants. Or they'll be brewpubs. But there's no reason to think the growth in brewery count is going to stop any time soon.

 

[jmark]

You said;

"Subjective measures like awards, "boutique"-ness etc. are ignored."

So, yes, I ignored the independent craft brewer label for a second and asked if



means Budweiser, who exemplifies those very metrics.

So you completely missed my post that preceded that;

What I'd like to see is some industry group offer a 'Certified Craft' designation/logo that independent breweries can apply, and be approved, for which would guarantee a certain quality level as well as a level of independence. Breweries with the designation could use the logo on their packaging etc. which might help consumers make more informed choices.

Someone asked how you'd determine "quality" and I responded with the objective measures I mentioned since that's one way to level set across the industry, rather than some set of 'darling-of-the-month' breweries that spit out the 'flavor-of-the-month' products - and that's not meant to attack any particular type of brewery or style of beer; it's just meant to convey that having a certain set of standards across the industry means you can't talk subjectively.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

So you completely missed my post that preceded that;

Did not miss it, just looked past it because even you suggested to overlook the size. The subsequent question was tasked to elaborate on what "quality beer", or just "quality", is to which you responded with a generic set of "objective measures" ubiquitously associated with Budweiser.

When I questioned on that, you danced.

It's okay to associate Budweiser as quality beer, by your metrics, and still not like the corporation. But it does add to the irony.

 

[rodwha]

Apparently it's all just lost on some...

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

Apparently it's all just lost on some...

It is. But at least we are trying to help them find it.

 

[jmark]

Did not miss it, just looked past it because even you suggested to overlook the size. The subsequent question was tasked to elaborate on what "quality beer", or just "quality", is to which you responded with a generic set of "objective measures" ubiquitously associated with Budweiser.

When I questioned on that, you danced.

There are literally thousands of craft breweries that would be able to say they conform to the standards I mentioned, but for some reason you're trying to argue that I must have meant AB InBev even though I specifically, although maybe not explicitly, excluded them in my original post. Liking AB InBev or not has no bearing on the argument for a seal of 'Certified CRAFT'.

So yeah, whatever... that's some dancing.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

That means a lot of breweries (and I think the US can easily support more breweries than wineries) are going to be very small, local, lifestyle businesses. They won't be sold on store shelves. They'll have tap rooms of their own, and maybe supply local restaurants. Or they'll be brewpubs. But there's no reason to think the growth in brewery count is going to stop any time soon.

This. And I welcome it.

This trend is evident even in my jurisdiction. Antiquated laws are, slowly, being modernized to accommodate single strength regulation and pave the way for localized self-distribution, or self-dispence.

 

[Grannyknot]

...... Antiquated laws are, slowly, being modernized to accommodate single strength regulation and pave the way for localized self-distribution, or self-dispence.

The exact opposite is actually occurring here. Big Distribution lobbyists, financially backed by AB/MC, are driving laws that seem tailored to the special interests of large scale brewing companies.

 

[rodwha]

It is. But at least we are trying to help them find it.

I'll buy into the humor.

 

[bob1852]

There are literally thousands of craft breweries that would be able to say they conform to the standards I mentioned, but for some reason you're trying to argue that I must have meant AB InBev even though I specifically, although maybe not explicitly, excluded them in my original post. Liking AB InBev or not has no bearing on the argument for a seal of 'Certified CRAFT'.

So yeah, whatever... that's some dancing.

Once BA started changing their definition of "craft", it really soured me on the whole premise of the definition...

 

[jmark]

Once BA started changing their definition of "craft", it really soured me on the whole premise of the definition...

Yeah - that's true. IIRC, that was to placate Sam Adams. I don't know if it's true or not but on a mailing list I'm on, I just read that Jim Koch wants to do something along the lines of a craft seal too... not sure how I feel about it now

 

[bleme]

Shelf space for bread and tomatoes isn't really a fair comparison is it? It's not like there are hundreds of local tomato producers clamorous for 40 square feet of a grocery store.

I actually think this is a pretty effective comparison, but I live in farm country. If I want cheap, convenient tomatoes I go to the grocery store. If I want good tomatoes, I go to a roadside stand or the farmers market. If I want the very best tomatoes, I grow them myself. They all have their place.

If I haven't brewed in a while and just need something to fill the fridge, I go to the grocery store. If I am looking for something special, I go to the beer store. Luckily for me, they are in the same parking lot but that's beside the point...

 

[jmark]

I actually think this is a pretty effective comparison, but I live in farm country. If I want cheap, convenient tomatoes I go to the grocery store. If I want good tomatoes, I go to a roadside stand or the farmers market. If I want the very best tomatoes, I grow them myself. They all have their place.



If I haven't brewed in a while and just need something to fill the fridge, I go to the grocery store. If I am looking for something special, I go to the beer store. Luckily for me, they are in the same parking lot but that's beside the point...

I agree with your sentiments... problem is that the big boys start to control shelf space everywhere. But that shouldn't bother us - we can make our own damn beer, dammit!