Why bother with stainless?

[McCuckerson]

With heat conductance is conductance but I can see how stainless will help keep your HLT temperatre more stable - beeing a much poorer conductor of heat you don't loose as much heat through the walls of the tank as you would with aluminum. You are probably heating the tank with imersion heaters.

Exacly

 

[thargrav]

I worked in a commercial kitchen for 5 years. They DON'T use stainless stock pots, the large ones were all aluminum. They simply don't use them. I cannot believe this debate is still going on

Because most have not worked in a commercial kitchen and they don't know this.

 

[Spintab]

I worked in a commercial kitchen for 5 years. They DON'T use stainless stock pots, the large ones were all aluminum. They simply don't use them. I cannot believe this debate is still going on

Commercial kitchens also aren't fermenting the food they boil in the pots. Every speck of everything that leaches into your wort at some point makes its way past or through cells of yeast. It's been said before that sanitizing an immersion chiller in the boiling wort actually adds minerals that are beneficial to the yeast. I'm sure the same is true for aluminum but who knows how the yeast react to it.

 

[McCuckerson]

Commercial kitchens also aren't fermenting the food they boil in the pots. Every speck of everything that leaches into your wort at some point makes its way past or through cells of yeast. It's been said before that sanitizing an immersion chiller in the boiling wort actually adds minerals that are beneficial to the yeast. I'm sure the same is true for aluminum but who knows how the yeast react to it.

That is such a reach that I am not even going to respond to it..... oh wait I just did.... so based on what you're saying, aluminum pots have a finite number of boils associated with them, while stainless does not? Then why do some commercial breweries use copper BK?

 

[thargrav]

Commercial kitchens also aren't fermenting the food they boil in the pots. Every speck of everything that leaches into your wort at some point makes its way past or through cells of yeast. It's been said before that sanitizing an immersion chiller in the boiling wort actually adds minerals that are beneficial to the yeast. I'm sure the same is true for aluminum but who knows how the yeast react to it.

Aluminum has been used by cooks for longer than any of us have been around. And cooking subjects the pots to extreme temperatures, strong acids, strong caustics and a host of solvents. If there were ANYTHING in aluminum that was bad for our health or that affected flavor we would have known about it long ago. After cooking the kitchen will subject their aluminum pots to caustic cleaners & scouring pads before throwing utensils into them and then not so gently pitching them on the shelf.

Brewing on the other hand exposes aluminum to mild acids and relativey low heat. We just break 212F to bring our wurt to a boil and hold it there for a hour or so. Then we pamper our brew pots for fear that we may do something to break the "majic".

Oh, and I've worked food too.

 

[Spintab]

Fair enough. I'm stretching and I know the kitchen is one of the best examples of where things have been proven to work so I won't argue that.

As far as copper in commercial breweries though, it's most likely the same reason most use stainless steel. It's easy to manipulate. Copper is malleable and easily welded or soldered. Once aluminum is formed, that's pretty much that, and welding it takes a fine hand. Copper is expensive as all hell now so most copper kettles are probably hand-me-downs.

You know one other property of copper is it's inherent rejection of bacterial growth. This is why it is used in potable water applications. Otherwise copper would be a terrible material for those applications.

 

[CanadianQuaffer]

I know aluminum works just fine for brewing and there are no known side affects in any regard for using it, but I must say I find it funny how defensive proponents of aluminum get whenever this debate comes along.

I own a 2010 V6 Camaro and am a member of a Camaro forum and V6 owners almost always react the same way whenever the V6 vs V8 debate comes along.

Aluminum may work just fine, just as my V6 works just fine, but really, at the end of the day, we'd all rather have the V8.

 

[yorkbrew]

I know aluminum works just fine for brewing and there are no known side affects in any regard for using it, but I must say I find it funny how defensive proponents of aluminum get whenever this debate comes along.

I own a 2010 V6 Camaro and am a member of a Camaro forum and V6 owners almost always react the same way whenever the V6 vs V8 debate comes along.

Aluminum may work just fine, just as my V6 works just fine, but really, at the end of the day, we'd all rather have the V8.

QFT

/thread

 

[thargrav]

I know aluminum works just fine for brewing and there are no known side affects in any regard for using it, but I must say I find it funny how defensive proponents of aluminum get whenever this debate comes along.

I own a 2010 V6 Camaro and am a member of a Camaro forum and V6 owners almost always react the same way whenever the V6 vs V8 debate comes along.

Aluminum may work just fine, just as my V6 works just fine, but really, at the end of the day, we'd all rather have the V8.

I agree - my V8 is a stainless steel pot with a tri-metal bottom and I use this pot because a commercial 60 qt aluminum pot is too expensive for me. I also believe so many brewers are against aluminum pots because they have only used the cheap thin turkey fryer aluminum pots. Put a commercial qiality heavy duty aluminum pot in their hands and most would be asking - why stainless?

 

[CanadianQuaffer]

QFT

/thread

Hey relax, I was just having some fun.
Basically just saying that, rightly or wrongly, stainless is "the thing* to aspire to have, just like a V8 Camaro is (compared to a V6)

But I don't know what you posted above even means.

 

[OneHoppyGuy]

I want a V10 Viper

 

[CanadianQuaffer]

I agree - my V8 is a stainless steel pot with a tri-metal bottom and I use this pot because a commercial 60 qt aluminum pot is too expensive for me. I also believe so many brewers are against aluminum pots because they have only used the cheap thin turkey fryer aluminum pots. Put a commercial qiality heavy duty aluminum pot in their hands and most would be asking - why stainless?

Are you joking about the cost of a commercial grade aluminum pot or are they really that expensive?

 

[Spintab]

I know aluminum works just fine for brewing and there are no known side affects in any regard for using it, but I must say I find it funny how defensive proponents of aluminum get whenever this debate comes along.

I own a 2010 V6 Camaro and am a member of a Camaro forum and V6 owners almost always react the same way whenever the V6 vs V8 debate comes along.

Aluminum may work just fine, just as my V6 works just fine, but really, at the end of the day, we'd all rather have the V8.

This comes full circle to my original point. Every thread I read prior to starting this one is splattered with pro aluminum comments, yet not a single brewing supply I've come across sells aluminum kettles, and very few stainless proponents speak up. There must be a News Corp. station somewhere advocating the use of aluminum. It's getting aluminum users all pumped up and angry while the stainless users take a more passive and pragmatic approach. Either that or there is some major private interest in the sale of stainless steel kettles, preventing aluminum from becoming the widespread brewing norm

 

[lumpher]

i had a 28 qt aluminum pot that i used for sparge water. used it about 10 times. propane burner burned holes in the bottom. switched to a sanke hlt. been using it for years, and it's still in great condition. use what you want, but i will only use ss

 

[Beezy]

I know aluminum works just fine for brewing and there are no known side affects in any regard for using it, but I must say I find it funny how defensive proponents of aluminum get whenever this debate comes along.

I own a 2010 V6 Camaro and am a member of a Camaro forum and V6 owners almost always react the same way whenever the V6 vs V8 debate comes along.

Aluminum may work just fine, just as my V6 works just fine, but really, at the end of the day, we'd all rather have the V8.

That's pretty much what I said. You will find defensive people in any discussion. I definitely am driving a Cavalier here but thankfully an aluminum pot is not holding me back from making great beer.

 

[CanadianQuaffer]

That's pretty much what I said. You will find defensive people in any discussion. I definitely am driving a Cavalier here but thankfully an aluminum pot is not holding me back from making great beer.

I have an aluminum pot that I use for BIAB (because it's tall and narrow and fits teh bag better) but I use my SS mega-pot for all other boiling applications.

The aluminum works just fine, but I am just so proud of my mega-pot. Makes no sense, I know, but there you have it.

 

[thargrav]

Are you joking about the cost of a commercial grade aluminum pot or are they really that expensive?

Here's a good one for $125 with freight.
Johnson Rose Stock Pot 60 Quart at FoodServiceDirect!

There are cheap aluminum pots being sold as "commercial pots" - the seller is lying to you. If the pot, any pot, has any type of rolled lip then it is not commercial.

My tri-metal base pot was about $60.00.

 

[thargrav]

Here is a 80 quart commercial pot for $145 with freight.
Johnson Rose Stock Pot 80 Quart at FoodServiceDirect!

 

[tesilential]

I bought this 80 qt aluminum pot with the lid for $50 on craigslist.

Is this a suitable brew kettle to add weldless sightglass and bulkhead/valve kits? Planning on dropping almost $100 bones to trick it out from brewhardware.com.

 

[thargrav]

I bought this 80 qt aluminum pot with the lid for $50 on craigslist.

Is this a suitable brew kettle to add weldless sightglass and bulkhead/valve kits? Planning on dropping almost $100 bones to trick it out from brewhardware.com.

This should be a good heavy duty pot but it's not the grade you'd find in most restarants. Most restarants use pots made from 6 gauge aluminum and the walls are 1/4" thick, the walls of your pot should be around 3/16" thick.

It's definitely better than any turkey fryer pot out there and I suspect it's better than most "good" stainless steel pots being sold to homebrewers! And it should be better than my tri-metal pot. I'm going to start watching Craigslist.

 

[baddad]

Wow, I can't belive some people ....... Beer has been being made for a few thousand years, and those that came before us.didn't use SS or AL , and I'd bet they're beer was way better.than.anything around today, craft, and commercial.
Bitten line......... Use what.works good for you.

 

[bigbeergeek]

Beer has been being made for a few thousand years, and those that came before us.didn't use SS or AL , and I'd bet they're beer was way better.than.anything around today, craft, and commercial.

You're a silly ninny.

 

[rico567]

The biggest reason I have an SS pot is because that's what I ended up with originally. I got a 30 qt pot super cheap ($40 delivered) and it's always suited my needs. If I'd ended up with aluminum, I'm sure it would work for how I brew. I do agree with the part about aluminum being more reactive to certain cleaners, though. Not every material is suitable for all occasions, and SS probably has the broadest set of applications, even though it's certainly pricier as a general rule.

 

[noodle23]

I know aluminum works just fine for brewing and there are no known side affects in any regard for using it, but I must say I find it funny how defensive proponents of aluminum get whenever this debate comes along.

I own a 2010 V6 Camaro and am a member of a Camaro forum and V6 owners almost always react the same way whenever the V6 vs V8 debate comes along.

Aluminum may work just fine, just as my V6 works just fine, but really, at the end of the day, we'd all rather have the V8.

And its the same with the debate between Ford and Chevy. I have a mustang and will defend mustangs to the death over camaros. With that being said I have all SS brewing pots because i find it works better for me. I have a confidence in SS that i don't with AL. I work at a winery and everything is SS. Maybe because i've been using it for going to 8 years on an almost daily bases.

So when you build your rig do you want a Chevy 1500 or Ford F150. Same functionality and both will get the job done just a good as the other but which do you like better.

 

[Beezy]

Wow, I can't belive some people ....... Beer has been being made for a few thousand years, and those that came before us.didn't use SS or AL , and I'd bet they're beer was way better.than.anything around today, craft, and commercial.
Bitten line......... Use what.works good for you.

I would be willing to bet the farm on the idea that the best beer in history is being made right now and hopefully even better in the future.

 

[Malticulous]

I don't think there has been much improvement in beer since Louis Pasteur's book and Hansen's pure yeast culture. The improvements after those are (even) more about money. Stainless is much more durable than enameled steel and wood casks used back then but I doubt it makes beer any better.

 

[Kuhndog]

Wow, I can't belive some people ....... Beer has been being made for a few thousand years, and those that came before us.didn't use SS or AL , and I'd bet they're beer was way better.than.anything around today, craft, and commercial.
Bitten line......... Use what.works good for you.

Yeah beer has been made for 1000s of years but did you know the success rate back then? Heck they didn't even know what yeast was and how it worked until about 200 yrs ago. It was a cross your fingers and see what happens deal. The exception to that might be monastaries...but guess what - they were very clean compared to most places nowadays. There weren't a lot of people there, they were very clean and really didn't touch each other, they were usually isolated from the public...when you have that environment - it probably would have been difficult to screw things up....but I'm sure it happened.

Also you have to understand that bacteria is a lot stronger nowadays due to antibiotics, mutations...etc. Things are a lot stronger today than they were back then and we're in constant contact with people. As to the containers themselves - the water was cleaner where monastaries were located. We'll never know how the beer tasted....to most Europeans - they fermented wine and beer because the water quality was bad and it was full of toxins. They knew that the liquid that was fermented was somehow better for them vs the water that was available.

To me - it's a very intriguing and almost unbelievable that they could repeat the process and actually have it succeed...but I'm sure they used a portion of the last batch to make the next and there lies the reason why it would work - maybe not always but maybe a good coin flip....there was some active yeast to get the new batch going.

I will agree with most on here with the cleaning aspect and the oxidation. If all you have to do is scrub a little, clean and sanitize...life is good. I would have preferred aluminum but there is just something in the back of my mind that says go with SS and don't worry about it. I know the cooking industry uses Aluminium but cooking is different....there is oil, water...etc. They'll not cook tomato sauce in it...without getting a metal taste. For me it's just better cleaning and some piece of mind.

 

[CanadianQuaffer]

And its the same with the debate between Ford and Chevy. I have a mustang and will defend mustangs to the death over camaros. With that being said I have all SS brewing pots because i find it works better for me. I have a confidence in SS that i don't with AL. I work at a winery and everything is SS. Maybe because i've been using it for going to 8 years on an almost daily bases.

So when you build your rig do you want a Chevy 1500 or Ford F150. Same functionality and both will get the job done just a good as the other but which do you like better.

What year and model is your 'stang?

 

[noodle23]

What year and model is your 'stang?

05 v6 so I know the v8 v6 battles u speak of

 

[H-ost]

A copper chiller left in a SS pot for storage won't eat through the bottom of the pot but in an Aluminum one it can.