The CAD thread

[GilaMinumBeer]

The reason I say this, is that in a CAD class I took in high school the teacher had us do everything in model space. When I learned the difference, it changed my life haha

Same was true for me as well. Took me a while to grow accustomed to paper space.

 

[treacheroustexan]

This is true. At our office we all have the same sheet taped to our monitors, computer towers etc that lists each color the coincides with the appropriate line weight and scale factors etc.



I would also suggest getting in the habit of setting base points in your drawings. In the future if you have to xref multiple drawings into a single drawing, base points will help you get them all in the right place.

Another thought, paper space vs model space. Use them appropriately. Set up a viewport (with title sheet if you have one) in paper space and show your drawing through the vp. Easier to scale too.

The reason I say this, is that in a CAD class I took in high school the teacher had us do everything in model space. When I learned the difference, it changed my life haha

What is the main difference between model and paper space? You're both drawing to everything to their full size, correct? Is paper space scaled for drawings that need printed out on paper? haha (sorry haven't got that far yet to experiment)

 

[jmcquesten]

Model space is full (real) size, paper space is the size the drawing will be printed. A "viewport" is placed on the sheet (paper space) which allows you to scale the (model space) drawing to fit on a sheet.

 

[kev211]

What is the main difference between model and paper space? You're both drawing to everything to their full size, correct? Is paper space scaled for drawings that need printed out on paper? haha (sorry haven't got that far yet to experiment)

You got it... Kinda haha. Model space is where the drawings are in full size (where you are correct) hence the name model space. These drawings can be either live, blocked in, xref'd in etc. Paper space is where your title block or otherwise is. This is where you create your sheet for printing hence the name paper space. You can draw a viewport in paperspace and use the viewport to control the scale of the drawing. So basically...

Model Space: Full size, Scale: 1'=1'-0"
Paper Space: Scaled Drawings, 1/4"=1'-0" for example

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

Essentially, yes.

In model space, on a detail sheet with sections at varied scales, you'd have to scale everything around the largest object on the page. if something changes and you have to edit the original drawing, rescale/reinsert, revise, rescale, etc..

In paper space, the sheet is actual size. The models are actual size and they xref/imported into a designated viewport at the appropriate scale. If you need to edit you just go to the original model and the edit will reflect in the referenced viewport.

Been a VERY long time since I used paper space and it was rather clunky then. I am sure it has changed a bit since.

 

[seefish]

Change the autocad default shortcuts (edit aliases), they are intuitive but annoying in that you constantly have to move your hands around the keyboard. I like to keep my left hand as stationary as possible and keep my right hand on the mouse.

If you are going for mechanical then I would learn revit. Architects and Mechanical all seem to be using it these days. If you go to work for an architect then learn how to draw a property line lol.

 

[Rhumbline]

Model space and paper space is probably the most confusing issue in CAD.

Think of it this way, model space is where you do all your drawing. Paper space is where you set up your drawing for printing. Another way to think of it is model space is the picture, paper space is the frame.

You draw a building floor plan that is 50' x 100'. You obviously won't print that full size, and you need more accuracy than just printing to fit the paper. This is where paper space comes in. You can set the scale to something that will fit the paper you are using, maybe 1/8" = 1'.

At that scale you floor plan will measure 6.25" x 12.5" on paper.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

If you are going for mechanical then I would learn revit. Architects and Mechanical all seem to be using it these days. If you go to work for an architect then learn how to draw a property line lol.

They hire that out to the Civil engineers who can read a legal description.

 

[dkwolf]

They hire that out to the Civil engineers who can read a legal description.

...and understand real-world coordinates, and that not everything lies in a perfect ortho plane, and a model space drawing should NOT be scaled down to architectural units.


Architect is a four-letter word in my office. (Send them a topo drawing, on state plane coordinates. Get the same drawing back from them, scaled down 1/12, rotated so the building sits ortho, and moved to 0,0.)

 

[Clarke]

CAD sounds like fun the way you all describe it. I know nothing, just earwigging on the thread.

CAD is one of those tools, your imagination is your only limitation with it. You can design, create, render, customize, program, basically taylor to your needs.

To some of us CAD gurus, it is like a video game and it can be quite fun to master this software.

 

[dkwolf]

When I took my first CAD class, we were using Autocad R14 -- they had just upgraded from R12. We had 30 students in the class, but only 15 computers in the lab, so we all paired up. Most 'teams' would take turns running the computer while the other watched. Not me and my partner - one ran the mouse, the other ran the keyboard. We worked amazingly well at it - and we both learned the keyboard shortcuts COLD.

I'll echo some of the earlier statements - I can type almost as fast with my left hand as your average user can with both hands.

Think about model space and paper space like this: Model space is where you do everything relative to real-world dimensions. Paper space is where you put all of the annotation and dimensions.

 

[TheCADJockey]

The best part is, you don't have to listen to any of us. The company that hired me didn't give a damn about old projects I did, how many buildings I designed or how I would draw a 1/4" NPT(M) thread. They only cared that I knew how to get it done to their standards. I draw everything completely different than my boss does, but the end product always comes out the same. Don't over-complicate things, just get comfortable with it and make it work for you. It is just a tool.

 

[unviewtiful]

I'm a mechanical engineer and I use Creo Parametric (the new version of Pro/Engineer) on a daily basis for work. I learned AutoCAD in high school, SolidWorks in college, and then transitioned to Pro/E when I started working. I boot up AutoCAD at work every once in a while, but I don't create anything in it, I typically just use it as a viewer since it's used mostly for electrical schematics here. The transition to Pro/E was pretty rough for me because SolidWorks is sooooo much more user friendly. In the end, they do about the same thing but PTC likes to make things more difficult and convoluted than they need to be. If you want to get into the 3D side of things, SolidWorks usually has student versions available, ask your school about it.

The 3D modeling world is so much different than traditional 2D drafting, and there's not a good way to learn other than using your chosen/mandated program... a lot. Find someone more experienced with the software at your company and ask them as many questions as they'll answer. And there's a tutorial video for just about everything if you search the internet.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

When I took my first CAD class, we were using Autocad R14 -- they had just upgraded from R12. We had 30 students in the class, but only 15 computers in the lab, so we all paired up. Most 'teams' would take turns running the computer while the other watched. Not me and my partner - one ran the mouse, the other ran the keyboard. We worked amazingly well at it - and we both learned the keyboard shortcuts COLD.

I'll echo some of the earlier statements - I can type almost as fast with my left hand as your average user can with both hands.

Think about model space and paper space like this: Model space is where you do everything relative to real-world dimensions. Paper space is where you put all of the annotation and dimensions.

Ha. I started with AutoCAD 8 or 9 when machines still ran DOS and everything was a green line you assigned to a pen.

I absolutely adored solid modeling.

 

[GotPushrods]

Hehe...you guys crack me up. I can still type a LOT faster with both hands but that's the idea - keep one had on the keyboard and one on the mouse.

I don't use it for work, but have over 50 common shortcuts mapped in Sketchup to use only left-hand keys, nothing past 5, T, G, or B. Some with SHIFT+ or ALT+ combos. You can get very, VERY fast once you get used to your environment and shortcuts.

I work with computers, but no paychecks for CAD. Sometime wish I had used CAD for a job, I do love it. Any time I've moved in the last 15 years, the new home is fully 3D modeled in a few weeks. Ya know... for furniture planning. Cause you clearly can't figure out where stuff goes without an overly detailed 3D model.

 

[VApatriot]

Good lord. Back when I was in college, my first mechanical drawing class was on an actual Vemco machine, you know a real drafting table with actual pencils, scales, erasers, and real paper. My first exposure to AutoCad was back in the DOS days, you want to talk about slow.... I used to use AutoCad LT when I was designing and building assembly equipment and tooling when I was an Advanced Manufacturing Engineer. Now I just screw around with it to do things like laying out the kitchen back splash for tiling to minimize waste and not over buying.

 

[TheCADJockey]

The college I studied architecture at didn't even let us touch a computer right away. The first two years consisted of nothing but conceptualization, manual drafting and lettering. It was a nightmare; I wouldn't trade it for anything. Speaking of nightmares... save it whenever you are about to attempt to hatch something. Hatch and Gradient can cause sudden health problems.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

Good lord. Back when I was in college, my first mechanical drawing class was on an actual Vemco machine, you know a real drafting table with actual pencils, scales, erasers, and real paper.

Did that in High School. Loved it. And then they introduced us to those spinning eraser machines with cheap erasers. God the frustration of seeing one of those tear a hole into the paper while still leaving the line intact.

 

[jeffersonjames]

Hey,

I am a Sr. Designer for a Pool Manufacturer. I use CAD everyday for work and as a way to layout future art projects. The biggest word of advice would be to learn some key commands.

 

[The_Dog_42]

I'm a mechanical engineer and I use Creo Parametric (the new version of Pro/Engineer) on a daily basis for work. I learned AutoCAD in high school, SolidWorks in college, and then transitioned to Pro/E when I started working. I boot up AutoCAD at work every once in a while, but I don't create anything in it, I typically just use it as a viewer since it's used mostly for electrical schematics here. The transition to Pro/E was pretty rough for me because SolidWorks is sooooo much more user friendly. In the end, they do about the same thing but PTC likes to make things more difficult and convoluted than they need to be. If you want to get into the 3D side of things, SolidWorks usually has student versions available, ask your school about it.

The 3D modeling world is so much different than traditional 2D drafting, and there's not a good way to learn other than using your chosen/mandated program... a lot. Find someone more experienced with the software at your company and ask them as many questions as they'll answer. And there's a tutorial video for just about everything if you search the internet.

I agree with this a lot. I started on pro 2000i, went to solidworks, then hit unigraphics & AutoCAD at the same time, then wildfire 4 then catia v5, then back to creo and creo 2. Creo & AutoCAD use keyboard commands the best and learning them will make you faster but not a better drafter / engineer. Understanding DFM / DFS / DFA / DFC and being able to apply it to a part is HUGE. Many engineers can't do this well.

My advice is model something up, then go talk to the nearest shop supervisor about how to build it. Figure out how to make your model better. In the end, most people don't make money on cad, they make money on product.

 

[theDREWery]

Worked as an engineer/designer for three years, Auto-CAD and Solidworks. When you get to 3D, learn to import from 2D dwg to 3D sketches, saves tons of time on redraws.

Now that I don't have software through work, I've been using progeCAD 2009 Smart for a free 2D system. Just recently got introduced to Onshape, it's the cloud based Solidworks. I think it's still in beta, but it's free and open to the public. Kinda wonky so far, but definitely worth checking out for anyone interested in 3D software.

 

[treacheroustexan]

Been practicing some. Next time you need a fan bezel, I'm your guy!

 

[ScrapRoomBrewer]

Nice job! Keep at it!

 

[kev211]

Looks good! Keep it up!


On another note... Anyone know if theres a way to xClip an OLE object? I have some scanned documents I need to put in some sheets as OLE's and the dang things wont clip

 

[Rhumbline]

Looks good! Keep it up!


On another note... Anyone know if theres a way to xClip an OLE object? I have some scanned documents I need to put in some sheets as OLE's and the dang things wont clip

I don't know exactly what effect you're going for but could you just create a new viewport that only showed the portion of the doc you are interested in?

Failing that, you could create a region(s) that blocked off the parts you don't want to see.

 

[kev211]

I don't know exactly what effect you're going for but could you just create a new viewport that only showed the portion of the doc you are interested in?

Failing that, you could create a region(s) that blocked off the parts you don't want to see.

Ya thats what Ive been doing but the OLE objects are tables that I want to clip to a specific line and it would be easier with xclip. What Ive switched to doing is converting the PDF's to PNG's and importing those and clipping them. Adds another step but the text reads better. Anywho, sorry to thread jack OP. Back to your stuff

 

[treacheroustexan]

Ya thats what Ive been doing but the OLE objects are tables that I want to clip to a specific line and it would be easier with xclip. What Ive switched to doing is converting the PDF's to PNG's and importing those and clipping them. Adds another step but the text reads better. Anywho, sorry to thread jack OP. Back to your stuff

Hey it's not all about me. All cad discussion allowed

 

[Rhumbline]

Ya thats what Ive been doing but the OLE objects are tables that I want to clip to a specific line and it would be easier with xclip. What Ive switched to doing is converting the PDF's to PNG's and importing those and clipping them. Adds another step but the text reads better. Anywho, sorry to thread jack OP. Back to your stuff

What version of autocad are you using? What format are the tables in, excel, word?

 

[kev211]

What version of autocad are you using? What format are the tables in, excel, word?

Old autoCAD haha. the office is updating to the latest version after the new year but for now we're using acad2006. And the tables are in excel. We've also scanned some images and imported those

 

[Rhumbline]

Ok, that explains it. Things should get easier after the upgrade.