That German Lager taste

[Bilsch]

In reference to @Bassman2003 video on making sauergut:



Are you using the 16- or 23-quart pressure cooker?

These are the items I would have to purchase - about $400 + shipping, which is ok - but is there a cheaper method?

As was mentioned in the video pressure sanitizing the jars isn't necessary but you will want to sanitize them well if not.

You can also rig a crockpot or some other electric cooker into a waterbath with an inkbird for temp control. Make a little cone hat top from reflectix for more clearance inside.

Using a small tubing (think fish tank line) connected to your CO2 supply you can carefully purge the headspace with the lids on but just lifted a little on one side to slip the tube in there. The idea here is to displace the oxygen then pull the tube, plop the lid in place and screw down the cap. The idea being when the CO2 goes into solution that will automatically create a vacuum under the cap.

There is no one perfect way so have fun and use your imagination.

 

[monkeymath]

Certainly malt that is not fresh won't make the best beer. However, I don't think the grapey flavor is a side effect of stale malt. I have detected it in some of my homebrews as well as purchased commercial German beers that were not stale themselves. All of the German malt (Weyermann) used in my homebrews came from a LHBS that turns over a lot of malt. They buy their malt from a local wholesaler/importer that also supplies most of the brewpubs and micros in the area. I taste it before I buy it and it's fresh.

I don't know what the grapey flavor source is but I tend to think it is part of either the barley or malt profile itself.

Now this is entirely anecdotal, but from what I've read and heard (e.g. Jeff Alworth), there aren't a lot of German breweries that choose Weyermann for their base malts. Not even in Bamberg, no.
Sadly, it's very hard to buy on a homebrew scale from maltsters other than Weyermann or Bestmalz, even inside Germany.

 

[z-bob]

I think Martin figured it out on another forum. (comment is mainly so I'm not accused of a "drive-by" ) HTH
https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic=26580.msg345444#msg345444

 

[Miraculix]

I think Martin figured it out on another forum. (comment is mainly so I'm not accused of a "drive-by" ) HTH
https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic=26580.msg345444#msg345444

Wow! There IT IS!!!

 

[BigEd]

Now this is entirely anecdotal, but from what I've read and heard (e.g. Jeff Alworth), there aren't a lot of German breweries that choose Weyermann for their base malts. Not even in Bamberg, no.
Sadly, it's very hard to buy on a homebrew scale from maltsters other than Weyermann or Bestmalz, even inside Germany.

I find it difficult to believe that a company such as Weyermann could stay in business for the last 140 years without having a base of commercial brewing customers in Germany. Selling a 25kg bag occasionally to a small percentage of North American homebrewers isn't going to cut it.

 

[BigEd]

I think Martin figured it out on another forum. (comment is mainly so I'm not accused of a "drive-by" ) HTH
https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic=26580.msg345444#msg345444

Thanks for that link and info. Sounds like a very plausible explanation.

 

[monkeymath]

I find it difficult to believe that a company such as Weyermann could stay in business for the last 140 years without having a base of commercial brewing customers in Germany. Selling a 25kg bag occasionally to a small percentage of North American homebrewers isn't going to cut it.

I got the impression their domestic sales were mostly specialty malts and Sinamar, an extract used to give beer a dark colour with little to no flavour impact.
But, as I said, anecdotal.

 

[couchsending]

I find it difficult to believe that a company such as Weyermann could stay in business for the last 140 years without having a base of commercial brewing customers in Germany. Selling a 25kg bag occasionally to a small percentage of North American homebrewers isn't going to cut it.

They export 90% of their malt, especially base malt. They can get more money for it outside of Germany. They invest a ton of money in the US market especially and have done a great job convincing US brewers that in order to make truly authentic German beer you need to use their products…

 

[Bobby_M]

My LD Carlson rep (take it with a grain of salt) told me that Avangard was the biggest maltster in Germany while Weyermann was in the list of smallest and corroborated the strong U.S. marketing campaign.

 

[Bassman2003]

That supports what I think I know. Avangard and Ireks being the largest supplies of base malts to the larger German breweries. (Outside of their own private operations).

 

[Red over White]

Embrace the malt selection we have even right now, in a couple years it's going to be a different world. Honestly, this feels like the beginning of the mid 90s brewpub crash all over again. Only this go round with LHBS' already fading, it's going to be worse when the craft breweries start to shutter, selection is going to be awful.

 

[Bassman2003]

I think that is a real possibility. I see distorted beer menus these days where most everything offered is "crazy beer". This is a sign to me that the craft world has 'jumped the shark'. Many German beers are not on the shelf anymore in stores either. So I can see a drop in the need for euro grains because those beers just are not being made as much. Could be limited market exposure by me though. Anyway, things are in flux.