Steeping grains in 7.5 gallon brew pot?

[rack04]

I'm planning my first brew this weekend. I purchased an extract kit with specialty grains. The instruction say to steep the grains in 2 gallons of 155 degree water for 30 minutes and then add top off water. Is this the recommended procedure or can I just steep the grains in the full boil volume?

 

[Yooper]

I'm planning my first brew this weekend. I purchased an extract kit with specialty grains. The instruction say to steep the grains in 2 gallons of 155 degree water for 30 minutes and then add top off water. Is this the recommended procedure or can I just steep the grains in the full boil volume?

You can, but sometimes it's better practice to just always use 1.5 quarts of water per pound of grain, and then add water for the boil. The reason is that some grains must be mashed, and those instructions sound like a mini-mash. After you steep, lift out the grain bag, and pour 170 degree water over it to get to your boil volume. It's easiest if you do that in a strainer or colander over the brewpot.

If you always steep/mash in the correct amount of water, and then pour 170 degree water over the grains to bring up your liquid to the boil volume, then you never have to change your technique.

 

[rack04]

You can, but sometimes it's better practice to just always use 1.5 quarts of water per pound of grain, and then add water for the boil. The reason is that some grains must be mashed, and those instructions sound like a mini-mash. After you steep, lift out the grain bag, and pour 170 degree water over it to get to your boil volume. It's easiest if you do that in a strainer or colander over the brewpot.

If you always steep/mash in the correct amount of water, and then pour 170 degree water over the grains to bring up your liquid to the boil volume, then you never have to change your technique.

Thanks for the reply. What is the purpose behind the added water being 170 degrees?

I guess what I could do is calculate the amount of water that needs to be added and bring that up to 170 degrees using a 30 qt brew kettle and propane burner. On the gas stove I could steep the grains in a 20 qt brew kettle and then transfer that to the 30 qt brew kettle outside. That way I can better regulate the steeping temperature. Does this sound like a good process? Do the grains need to be washed into the steeping water?

 

[jvcjbl]

What about just steeping the grains in 6 gallons of water (5 gallon batch) to allow for evaporation)? I have done this and have done the "top up" method.

 

[rack04]

What about just steeping the grains in 6 gallons of water (5 gallon batch) to allow for evaporation)? I have done this and have done the "top up" method.

That was my original question but was told that it is better practice to steep in a smaller volume and then top off with 170 degree water. Steeping in the full boil volume sounds much easier but I want to make sure that I use the "correct" process so that if anything is wrong with the final product I can blame it on the recipe and then find ways to improve the recipe.

 

[Jawbox0]

You can, essentially you're just doing Brew In a Bag if you use the whole volume of water.

EDIT: The more I think about it, the more I realize that going that thin, might seriously impact efficiency. I mean a thinner mash is good, but... that thin might be too much.

 

[jvcjbl]

You can, essentially you're just doing Brew In a Bag if you use the whole volume of water.

EDIT: The more I think about it, the more I realize that going that thin, might seriously impact efficiency. I mean a thinner mash is good, but... that thin might be too much.

But... unless I am thinking totally wrong. If you steep in say 2 gallons of water and then top up to 6 for inital boil... how is that different from steeping in 6 from the get go? They both have the same water amount.

 

[Yooper]

What about just steeping the grains in 6 gallons of water (5 gallon batch) to allow for evaporation)? I have done this and have done the "top up" method.

But... unless I am thinking totally wrong. If you steep in say 2 gallons of water and then top up to 6 for inital boil... how is that different from steeping in 6 from the get go? They both have the same water amount.

The difference is mashing and the process. In order for proper conversion, from starch to sugar, the grain must be kept at a prescribed pH with a prescribed temperature and time. The water volume is what affects the pH. In 6 gallons, the mash would be very very thin and the pH way too high as a result.

 

[jvcjbl]

The difference is mashing and the process. In order for proper conversion, from starch to sugar, the grain must be kept at a prescribed pH with a prescribed temperature and time. The water volume is what affects the pH. In 6 gallons, the mash would be very very thin and the pH way too high as a result.

This brings me to a question then. I am attempting the Life & Limb "clone" recipe on here. It only calls for 3/4 lbs of grains. Doesn't mention partial mash... steep, or what. Suggestions?

Life & Limb Clone

 

[RM-MN]

This brings me to a question then. I am attempting the Life & Limb "clone" recipe on here. It only calls for 3/4 lbs of grains. Doesn't mention partial mash... steep, or what. Suggestions?

Life & Limb Clone

I'm pretty new to the all grain but as I've heard and read, there are a very few grains that have to be mashed or have the power to convert other grains. Looking at the listed grains in that recipe, I don't see any of them in there so you would be steeping the grain for the color and flavor.

 

[Yooper]

I'm pretty new to the all grain but as I've heard and read, there are a very few grains that have to be mashed or have the power to convert other grains. Looking at the listed grains in that recipe, I don't see any of them in there so you would be steeping the grain for the color and flavor.

Correct! I still just always used 1.5 quarts per pound when I did extract and PM batches, just so I had the same technique all the time.

In a case like this, I'd steep the grain in a quart of water in a small pot (so the grain can be covered) and bring my boiling volume up to a boil- that way you can be steeping and bringing the water up to a boiling temperature at the same time! When the steep is over, just pour the resulting liquid into the boil kettle, too, and be on your way.

 

[jvcjbl]

Thanks for the input guys!! I was planning on doing a 6 gal boil to account for loss for a final of a 5 gal batch. Once the steeping is done... do you suggest rinsing or just drain and discard?

Correct! I still just always used 1.5 quarts per pound when I did extract and PM batches, just so I had the same technique all the time.

In a case like this, I'd steep the grain in a quart of water in a small pot (so the grain can be covered) and bring my boiling volume up to a boil- that way you can be steeping and bringing the water up to a boiling temperature at the same time! When the steep is over, just pour the resulting liquid into the boil kettle, too, and be on your way.

 

[Yooper]

Thanks for the input guys!! I was planning on doing a 6 gal boil to account for loss for a final of a 5 gal batch. Once the steeping is done... do you suggest rinsing or just drain and discard?

Rinsing is fine- and again, it'll be a technique that you can keep no matter what the grain bill.

You can either "dunk" the grain bag in a fresh volume of water (165-170 degrees is perfect, but not that critical), or pour that water over the grain bag in a strainer over your brewpot.

 

[jvcjbl]

Thanks for the advice. 155'f steep for 30 mins?

One kit I did suggested heating the water to this temp and then removing from heat... adding grains and cover and allow to sit for 30 mins. Another kit suggested adding the grains right away and raise the water to this temperature over a 30 min period and then remove.

I am looking to get a "normal" routine in place that I can use all the time and disregard all other suggestions.

Rinsing is fine- and again, it'll be a technique that you can keep no matter what the grain bill.

You can either "dunk" the grain bag in a fresh volume of water (165-170 degrees is perfect, but not that critical), or pour that water over the grain bag in a strainer over your brewpot.

 

[Yooper]

Thanks for the advice. 155'f steep for 30 mins?

One kit I did suggested heating the water to this temp and then removing from heat... adding grains and cover and allow to sit for 30 mins. Another kit suggested adding the grains right away and raise the water to this temperature over a 30 min period and then remove.

I am looking to get a "normal" routine in place that I can use all the time and disregard all other suggestions.

Yes, 155 for 30 minutes is fine!

Different instructions are usually fine, but like I said, I'm more of a creature of habit and I want to be able to do the same thing each time I brew. Doing each batch the way we described here covers you no matter what- partial mash, extract with steeping grains, even all grain- without changing to a different technique based on the ingredients. If you treat every batch like this, using 1.5 quarts of water per pound of grain, then rinsing with up to .5 gallons of water per pound of grain (or up to your boil volume), then you can make any beer with any ingredients.

 

[jvcjbl]

I want to get into this "habbit"... so heat to 155' and then remove from heat and steep... or submerse immediately and then heat up to 155' and then remove grain bag?

Yes, 155 for 30 minutes is fine!

Different instructions are usually fine, but like I said, I'm more of a creature of habit and I want to be able to do the same thing each time I brew. Doing each batch the way we described here covers you no matter what- partial mash, extract with steeping grains, even all grain- without changing to a different technique based on the ingredients. If you treat every batch like this, using 1.5 quarts of water per pound of grain, then rinsing with up to .5 gallons of water per pound of grain (or up to your boil volume), then you can make any beer with any ingredients.

 

[Yooper]

I want to get into this "habbit"... so heat to 155' and then remove from heat and steep... or submerse immediately and then heat up to 155' and then remove grain bag?

Actually, the grains will be room temperature so once you add the grains, the temperature of the water will drop a little- maybe 5-10 degrees. So heat the water to 160-165 and then add the grains.

 

[jvcjbl]

Actually, the grains will be room temperature so once you add the grains, the temperature of the water will drop a little- maybe 5-10 degrees. So heat the water to 160-165 and then add the grains.

Thank you sir. What is your opinion on batch sizing? The last batch I made I started with a 6 gallon boil. It was my first batch with my equipment and didn't take time marking the carboy for volume. I added to primary and let it ferment. When I transferred to secondary I noticed it was rather low, like 1 gallon low. How can I prevent this in the future? Did I boil at too high a temp causing excessive evap or do you really lose that much to trub and absorption?

 

[Yooper]

Thank you sir. What is your opinion on batch sizing? The last batch I made I started with a 6 gallon boil. It was my first batch with my equipment and didn't take time marking the carboy for volume. I added to primary and let it ferment. When I transferred to secondary I noticed it was rather low, like 1 gallon low. How can I prevent this in the future? Did I boil at too high a temp causing excessive evap or do you really lose that much to trub and absorption?

Sir?

Anyway, if you rack a couple of times (like to secondary and to the bottling bucket), it's not uncommon to lose some volume. I don't typically use a secondary, but there is often a couple of inches of trub in the bottom of the fermenter after I rack so I realize I lose some volume.

What I would do is mark your primary with a 5 gallon mark. Then just make sure you start with 5 gallons, if that's the "batch size" of your recipe. I make up my own recipes, so I usually start with 5.25-5.5 gallons in the fermenter to end up with a 5 finished gallon batch. I have my fermenter marked at those levels.

Overall, don't worry about it, though. If you end up with 4.25 gallons of good beer instead of 5 gallons, it's not a big deal.

 

[jvcjbl]

Sorry... Force of habbit being in my industry (all male dominated). You tend to not look at avitars or profiles for that matter (obvious details), since it is all about turn around time and not looking immediately into the fine details until things are rolling.

One of the kits I have made recommended topping up in the secondary to get to "final volume". I couldn't see that being good, but just diluting. Following a recipe that is scaled for a 5 gallon batch, will it get screwed up by increasing it to 5.25?

Sir?

Anyway, if you rack a couple of times (like to secondary and to the bottling bucket), it's not uncommon to lose some volume. I don't typically use a secondary, but there is often a couple of inches of trub in the bottom of the fermenter after I rack so I realize I lose some volume.

What I would do is mark your primary with a 5 gallon mark. Then just make sure you start with 5 gallons, if that's the "batch size" of your recipe. I make up my own recipes, so I usually start with 5.25-5.5 gallons in the fermenter to end up with a 5 finished gallon batch. I have my fermenter marked at those levels.

Overall, don't worry about it, though. If you end up with 4.25 gallons of good beer instead of 5 gallons, it's not a big deal.

 

[Yooper]

Sorry... Force of habbit being in my industry (all male dominated). You tend to not look at avitars or profiles for that matter, since it is all about turn around down and not looking immediately into the fine details until things are rolling.

One of the kits I have made recommended topping up in the secondary to get to "final volume". I couldn't see that being good, but just diluting. Following a recipe that is scaled for a 5 gallon batch, will it get screwed up by increasing it to 5.25?

Not really screwed up, but certainly adding water will dilute it. A quart isn't much, but then again what would you gain? A few ounces of beer? I'd rather just settle for a bit less beer, and make a 5.5 gallon batch when I buy my own ingredients instead of a kit.

 

[jvcjbl]

Not really screwed up, but certainly adding water will dilute it. A quart isn't much, but then again what would you gain? A few ounces of beer? I'd rather just settle for a bit less beer, and make a 5.5 gallon batch when I buy my own ingredients instead of a kit.

The life & limb clone I am doing says "boil volume 6.5 gal" and batch size "5 gal" is that to account for loss?

 

[BoxofRain]

Quick question Yooper.

Yesterday I brewed a batch that called for me to steep 10oz of crystal in 2 gallons of water.

By your methods, I should have steeped the crystal in a quart (well, really .9375 of a quart but...you get my drift) and then rinsing it with 40oz (5 cups) of 170 degree water.

 

[rack04]

The life & limb clone I am doing says "boil volume 6.5 gal" and batch size "5 gal" is that to account for loss?

Yes that is to account for loss but the recipe is scaled for a 5 gallon batch size. My understanding is that you should target the batch size and OG of the recipe and determine with your equipment the boil volume necessary to hit those values.

 

[jvcjbl]

Yes that is to account for loss but the recipe is scaled for a 5 gallon batch size. My understanding is that you should target the batch size and OG of the recipe and determine with your equipment the boil volume necessary to hit those values.

So targeting the "batch size" I should got with a smaller "boil size" then?

 

[Yooper]

So targeting the "batch size" I should got with a smaller "boil size" then?

Well, it depends on how much you boil off. I boil off 1.25 gallons in the winter, and closer to 2 gallons in the summer (opposite many of you!). So, I start with 7 gallons for my boil volume in the summer, and 6.5ish in the winter. That gives me a 5.25-5.5 gallon batch.

 

[Yooper]

Quick question Yooper.

Yesterday I brewed a batch that called for me to steep 10oz of crystal in 2 gallons of water.

By your methods, I should have steeped the crystal in a quart (well, really .9375 of a quart but...you get my drift) and then rinsing it with 40oz (5 cups) of 170 degree water.

Ideally, yes. But again, we're talking about steeping grains so it doesn't really matter as much. Another thing- with only 10 ounces of grain, it'd be hard to have enough water in your pot to cover it with only .9365 of a quart. You'd have to use a pretty small pot to totally immerse the grain. If you're dealing with such small quantities of grain, it probably makes more sense to use more water just to make it a "one pot job". No harm, since crystal isn't a base malt, but not my preference in the process. I don't think I ever used less than a couple of pounds of grain, and then you're dealing with at least 1/2 gallon of water so that really wasn't an issue for me.

 

[BoxofRain]

Ideally, yes. But again, we're talking about steeping grains so it doesn't really matter as much. Another thing- with only 10 ounces of grain, it'd be hard to have enough water in your pot to cover it with only .9365 of a quart. You'd have to use a pretty small pot to totally immerse the grain. If you're dealing with such small quantities of grain, it probably makes more sense to use more water just to make it a "one pot job". No harm, since crystal isn't a base malt, but not my preference in the process. I don't think I ever used less than a couple of pounds of grain, and then you're dealing with at least 1/2 gallon of water so that really wasn't an issue for me.

Thanks. Yes, this is certainly not practical with such small amounts. I just want to always be mindful of this process as I start to get into larger amounts and mini mashes.

 

[elf_brewery]

What I do with my extract brew (6 gallon final, electric kettle) is heat 3 gallons to 152-154, then add the grain bag for 30 minutes. While the steep is going on, I've already started boiling 1 gallon of water, which I turn off when it boils and I leave it sit till the steep is finished. I'm guessing the water is at 180F at that point. I pull out the grain bag, let it drip a little while, then put it in a big pot and pour the very hot water over it and swish the bag around for 20 seconds or so, pull the bag up, let it drip, then put it aside. The sparge is then added to the kettle, the DME is added and kettle is adjusted for boiling.

I have read that the temperature, as long as it is between 150-170F doesn't really matter. Does ramping up during steeping make any difference?

BTW, I end up with 3 gallons of wort, which I chill to 86F, then add 3 gallons of cold water from the fridge, which brings the pitch temperature down to 65F. This saves time and water. It may not be the most efficient, but I still reach my OG target.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

Does ramping up during steeping make any difference?

• With a mash, "mashing out" (raising mash temp to 170F and holding for 15 minutes) is done to stop the enzymes from acting on the sugars.
• With a steep, there are no enzymes to stop.