Spike Complete System

[Bohern]

Thanks Wreck! I'll check all of that out.

EDIT: It shipped!! Happy I am.

 

[Bohern]

It's here!

 

[Gibberoni]

Nice! Enjoy your first brew with it.

 

[Bohern]

I am hoping to brew sometime next week. I will keep you guys posted with my results

 

[Bohern]

OK so I did the wet test today with some issues as follows.

1-the first test seemed to be going really smooth but then it went south fast. I had a couple of valves and fittings with very small leaks so no big deal. Then I noticed the HLT was getting real full and then the mash tun had lost about two gallons of water. So I then shut it all down and went over all of the fittings in question. By doing so I found the problem with the mash tun drain to the HLT.

Part 2-Everything went very smooth for the most part, mash tun and hlt volumes held and had no leaks. Then I tried to simulate switching to the spage part and transferring to the BK at the same time. This is where things went south. I was transferring WAY too quick and thought I was set to (key word being thought) I was going slow.I could not keep the mash tun level consistent to save my life.

Now my question is this, what is the best way to regulate the water in the tun (over the grain bed easiest)

I have the Spike valves but are using Blichmann pumps with the linear control valve. I was thinking it would be easiest to control level with pumps or am I missing something?

 

[Gibberoni]

Now my question is this, what is the best way to regulate the water in the tun (over the grain bed easiest)

With me, I simply open the BK input valve by a crack. I do the same with the MLT input from the HLT and then open and close every 15 or so minutes. I maintain a relatively stable layer of water over the mash.

I would also like to say that today's brew was actually ON TARGET! Brewed my Wee Heavy recipe to hopefully be ready for Xmas or New Years, so needed to get it in today. Target OG was 1.085 and I hit 1.083. 80% efficiency. So happy I was able to finally hit my numbers!

 

[Bohern]

With me, I simply open the BK input valve by a crack. I do the same with the MLT input from the HLT and then open and close every 15 or so minutes. I maintain a relatively stable layer of water over the mash.

I would also like to say that today's brew was actually ON TARGET! Brewed my Wee Heavy recipe to hopefully be ready for Xmas or New Years, so needed to get it in today. Target OG was 1.085 and I hit 1.083. 80% efficiency. So happy I was able to finally hit my numbers!

That is fantastic news! Congrats and working through the issues and nailing it. I may have questions later hahaha.

 

[Bohern]

@Gibberoni what did you change in your process to hit your numbers?

Stir, mash / sparge differently or was it beer smith set up?

 

[Bohern]

OK, first brew day done and here are some results. (btw I learned a lot today)

Mash PH was 5.48

OG was 1.042 (target was 1.044)

So for a first go with no herms experience not too bad.

Been cooler brewing with my brother in law for a year or so.

 

[Bohern]

Long story but I wound up with a 20G dip tube for the mash tun and I used it in the mash tun during the sparge.

 

[Gibberoni]

@Gibberoni what did you change in your process to hit your numbers?

Stir, mash / sparge differently or was it beer smith set up?

I did a 2 hour mash and stirred during the mash multiple times. I also installed loc-line braid in a circular pattern to help with the channeling from the hose that came with the setup.

 

[Bohern]

I did a 2 hour mash and stirred during the mash multiple times. I also installed loc-line braid in a circular pattern to help with the channeling from the hose that came with the setup.

They sent me the 20G false bottom along with the 20G pick up tube. It made a great sparge arm and I figured out ow best to control the flow finally.

 

[Zenmeister]

OK so I did the wet test today with some issues as follows.

1-the first test seemed to be going really smooth but then it went south fast. I had a couple of valves and fittings with very small leaks so no big deal. Then I noticed the HLT was getting real full and then the mash tun had lost about two gallons of water. So I then shut it all down and went over all of the fittings in question. By doing so I found the problem with the mash tun drain to the HLT.

Part 2-Everything went very smooth for the most part, mash tun and hlt volumes held and had no leaks. Then I tried to simulate switching to the spage part and transferring to the BK at the same time. This is where things went south. I was transferring WAY too quick and thought I was set to (key word being thought) I was going slow.I could not keep the mash tun level consistent to save my life.

Now my question is this, what is the best way to regulate the water in the tun (over the grain bed easiest)

I have the Spike valves but are using Blichmann pumps with the linear control valve. I was thinking it would be easiest to control level with pumps or am I missing something?

While it looks like you have the leak problems mostly fixed, a common problem is where the coils in the HLT attach to it with the Push To Connect fittings. If it isn't in tight, it WILL leak. I have learned that (twice) as the HLT starts to fill up and the MT starts to drain. Now, I always double and triple check the fittings.

As to balancing the water during sparge and into the BK, I first off use the two valves closest to the receiving kettles. It is easy and convenient to use. They are at the top of the MT and the input to the BK. I have them both set very low. I mean VERY low. Sparging on my 20 gal system is about 40-50 minutes, but I now always hit my numbers.
Back to your question about balancing them... If you are working those two valves, you can do them both simultaneously, and I always reference a point on the volume etchings on the MT to see how it is going. As you get them close, you will only make very tiny minor adjustments. One thing I did that helped significantly, is that I marked with a green sharpie the point where both valves pointed to when it was set. Now I set to those points, make those minor adjustments from there and am usually pretty close. If you'd like I will see if I can post some pics.

Enjoy your system. I am now on batch 14, and love the challenges of it. It seems that I am learning every time I brew, and brew days are always fun.

 

[Bohern]

Now I set to those points, make those minor adjustments from there and am usually pretty close. If you'd like I will see if I can post some pics.

Yes please! I think I have things working, but more info is always welcome.

 

[Bohern]

2nd brew day in the books and I love this system. I have now learned what adjustments I need to make in beersmith to get my numbers on the money. I have been close on both but next brew should be dialed in.

Cheers mates!

 

[Rlawlyes]

Second brew day complete

I tweaked my BeerSmith profile and was able to hit very close to all my numbers. It looks like I'm getting about 73% brew house efficiency and 85% mash efficiency so I'm happy with that.

I also learned that the HERMS coil can apparently back itself out of its fittings. It worked perfectly the first brew and leaked during this one. Luckily I had mashed in low for an acid rest and I could just stick my whole arm in there and fix it. I'll just need to make sure it's seated before the next brew day.

5 hours total brew day including cleanup. I love this system

Could you give me an idea of what your beersmith profile looks like? I have the 20 gal system and I am trying to nail the profile down.

Also, how do you manage a 5 hour brew day with cleaning? I average about 8 hours with cleaning.

 

[augiedoggy]

Long story but I wound up with a 20G dip tube for the mash tun and I used it in the mash tun during the sparge.

View attachment 643485

the hose really should work just as well for both recirculation and sparging without channeling since you should have an inch or so of liquid sitting on the grainbed at all times. it should more or less be swirling.
You may already know this but if you use that arm while recirculating you would be oxidizing the hell out of your wort. maybe slip a hose on the end for recirculation?
For just sparging it wont hurt anything to use it without a hose and you wont have to worry about siphoning back to the HLT.

blichmann makes a float switch to regulate sparge level and keep flow consistent if you dont like to manually keep checking it which is what we do even at the brewery.

 

[Bohern]

the hose really should work just as well for both recirculation and sparging without channeling since you should have an inch or so of liquid sitting on the grainbed at all times. it should more or less be swirling.
You may already know this but if you use that arm while recirculating you would be oxidizing the hell out of your wort. maybe slip a hose on the end for recirculation?
For just sparging it wont hurt anything to use it without a hose and you wont have to worry about siphoning back to the HLT.

blichmann makes a float switch to regulate sparge level and keep flow consistent if you dont like to manually keep checking it which is what we do even at the brewery.

Thanks augie!

I only used the tube like that just for sparge and used the tubing for recirc during the mash on my brew. This past brew I used the tubing for both.

My numbers were better the first brew and I think I know why.

I am also looking at a better way to keep the level during sparge where I want them but for now I am just having to keep playing with the valves. But good news is I know where the spots are now.

 

[TheMadKing]

Could you give me an idea of what your beersmith profile looks like? I have the 20 gal system and I am trying to nail the profile down.

Also, how do you manage a 5 hour brew day with cleaning? I average about 8 hours with cleaning.

Here is how I have mine set up. It realistically predicts my volumes very well

To get my brew day down to 5 hours I do as many things in parallel as possible.

• I heat strike water and HLT water simultaneously - and weigh out all hops, grains, and water additions while heating
• I usually mash for 60 minutes tweaking mash temp as needed
• sparge for about 30 minutes adjusting flow rates to mash the runoff to the sparge flow as needed
• I have the boil element turned on as soon as its covered in wort so that I'm boiling almost as soon as the sparge is complete
• As soon as sparge is complete I start cleaning the mash tun by scooping out most of the grain into a bucket and the vacuuming the rest out with a shop vac
• I spray out the mash tun with pressurized water then vaccuum and repeat.
• When there's no visible residue remaining, I undo my TC fitting on the mash tun outlet and pull out the dip tube and false bottom to clean under it.
• When no visible residue is remaining I scrub out the mash tun with barkeepers friend and a sponge and use the rinse/vacuum method repeatedly until I'm confident there's no soap residue
• Once the mash tun is clean I sanitize my fermenter and prep my yeast for pitching
• By the time the boil is complete the only thing I have left to do is chill, transfer to fermenter, pitch yeast, and clean the boil kettle and pump.
• I fill the boil kettle with the remaining HLT water, add oxyclean and recirculate it through the wort pump and chiller for 10 minutes, then drain and rinse/vacuum until there's no residue

 

[augiedoggy]

Here is how I have mine set up. It realistically predicts my volumes very well

To get my brew day down to 5 hours I do as many things in parallel as possible.

• I heat strike water and HLT water simultaneously - and weigh out all hops, grains, and water additions while heating
• I usually mash for 60 minutes tweaking mash temp as needed
• sparge for about 30 minutes adjusting flow rates to mash the runoff to the sparge flow as needed
• I have the boil element turned on as soon as its covered in wort so that I'm boiling almost as soon as the sparge is complete
• As soon as sparge is complete I start cleaning the mash tun by scooping out most of the grain into a bucket and the vacuuming the rest out with a shop vac
• I spray out the mash tun with pressurized water then vaccuum and repeat.
• When there's no visible residue remaining, I undo my TC fitting on the mash tun outlet and pull out the dip tube and false bottom to clean under it.
• When no visible residue is remaining I scrub out the mash tun with barkeepers friend and a sponge and use the rinse/vacuum method repeatedly until I'm confident there's no soap residue
• Once the mash tun is clean I sanitize my fermenter and prep my yeast for pitching
• By the time the boil is complete the only thing I have left to do is chill, transfer to fermenter, pitch yeast, and clean the boil kettle and pump.
• I fill the boil kettle with the remaining HLT water, add oxyclean and recirculate it through the wort pump and chiller for 10 minutes, then drain and rinse/vacuum until there's no residue

View attachment 644795

this is almost exactly our process on the 3bbl system at the brewery only the sparge takes longer and we perform a long step mashout... And we scoop our grain out of the manway into 4 or 5 15 gallon totes and call the farmer to come pick up

Sometimes we will pre measure and mill our grains the day before as well as preheat the strike water the night before while im there bartending..

 

[augiedoggy]

At the brewery we sparge at about 1.5gpm using an inline flow meter... maybe that has something to do with the 85% efficiency? as mentioned at home I do 1.8gmp flow during recirc and 1gpm sparge flow and get 91%. Beside mill crush I do not see any other possible differences in our methodes... oh and we do adjust the ph.. that can make a big difference.
I will mention in case I forgot before that I went from 87% to 91% when just starting to do a proper mashout with the rims and slowing my sparge from 1.8gpm to 1gpm...

 

[TheMadKing]

At the brewery we sparge at about 1.5gpm using an inline flow meter... maybe that has something to do with the 85% efficiency? as mentioned at home I do 1.8gmp flow during recirc and 1gpm sparge flow and get 91% beside mill crush I do not see any other possible differences in our methodes... oh and we do adjust the ph.. that can make a big difference.

I do adjust pH, and I suspect that you're correct that it's all down to flow rate. I've noticed a "breakover" point on my last couple brews where if my flow rate creeps up to the point where ANY channeling is happening my efficiency tanks.

Do you baffle your incoming sparge water before it hits the grain bed? I have just been running mine directly from a hose connected to the return port.

 

[augiedoggy]

I have a stout style sparge spinkler pipe at the brewery... at home I use a simple hose sitting on the grainbed now.

 

[augiedoggy]

when recirculating I have a separate hose laying on the grainbed at brewery.. see my edited post above

 

[Rlawlyes]

Here is how I have mine set up. It realistically predicts my volumes very well

To get my brew day down to 5 hours I do as many things in parallel as possible.

• I heat strike water and HLT water simultaneously - and weigh out all hops, grains, and water additions while heating
• I usually mash for 60 minutes tweaking mash temp as needed
• sparge for about 30 minutes adjusting flow rates to mash the runoff to the sparge flow as needed
• I have the boil element turned on as soon as its covered in wort so that I'm boiling almost as soon as the sparge is complete
• As soon as sparge is complete I start cleaning the mash tun by scooping out most of the grain into a bucket and the vacuuming the rest out with a shop vac
• I spray out the mash tun with pressurized water then vaccuum and repeat.
• When there's no visible residue remaining, I undo my TC fitting on the mash tun outlet and pull out the dip tube and false bottom to clean under it.
• When no visible residue is remaining I scrub out the mash tun with barkeepers friend and a sponge and use the rinse/vacuum method repeatedly until I'm confident there's no soap residue
• Once the mash tun is clean I sanitize my fermenter and prep my yeast for pitching
• By the time the boil is complete the only thing I have left to do is chill, transfer to fermenter, pitch yeast, and clean the boil kettle and pump.
• I fill the boil kettle with the remaining HLT water, add oxyclean and recirculate it through the wort pump and chiller for 10 minutes, then drain and rinse/vacuum until there's no residue

View attachment 644795

Thanks for sharing your process, I am going to try this on my next brew day. I have the 20 gallon system and my volumes are a bit different. Is there a reason you have the .5 gallon recoverable mash dead space? Also, where do you enter the HERMS dead space? I have mine set currently at 1 gallon dead space in the mash (non recoverable), due to the .5 gal in HERMS, and .41 gal in the mash tun (per spike). I love the system, but currently experiencing low efficiencies (50%) and missed SG. I believe it could be between the volumes, sparge (channeling), or grain crush.

 

[Rlawlyes]

So my wife and I wanted to do a gose, so we started a brew on Wednesday to allow it to kettle sour until tomorrow. I really wanted to make sure that I got every ounce of efficiency that I could based on everyone suggestions so I took my time and made sure that I did everything I could.

1) I recirculated the mash as slowly as I possibly could with my setup
2) I added a locline semi circle to allow the mash to recirc around the mash, rather than though the silicone hose into 1 spot.
3) I stirred the mash every 15 minutes

Even with doing all of these things, I missed my OG by 8 points... 1.030 instead of 1.038. I checked my system in beersmith to make sure I didn't accidentally set my BH efficiency way to high, but it is set at 72% I was always easily able to hit at least 72% with my previous gas setup.

The last thing now is to crush the grain myself I guess.

On a side note, I finally took the time to compare the digital readout of the temperatures against my thermapens (used two to make sure the results were the same), and ALL THREE of my temp probes are reading 2*F under the actual temp. 2* can make a big difference in the mash so I will be adjusting my PIDs before my next brew.

How does the locline connect? I have never used one, but I may pick one up to see if that helps my efficiency at all.

 

[TheMadKing]

Thanks for sharing your process, I am going to try this on my next brew day. I have the 20 gallon system and my volumes are a bit different. Is there a reason you have the .5 gallon recoverable mash dead space? Also, where do you enter the HERMS dead space? I have mine set currently at 1 gallon dead space in the mash (non recoverable), due to the .5 gal in HERMS, and .41 gal in the mash tun (per spike). I love the system, but currently experiencing low efficiencies (50%) and missed SG. I believe it could be between the volumes, sparge (channeling), or grain crush.

It's just shuffling beans from one pile to another

The way I think about it, There's no unrecoverable dead space at all because you run your sparge water through the HERMS coil before it enters your mash tun, and you can just add more sparge water to account for any losses due to the system, so any volume you lose, you can always make up.

In other words, I sparge to reach my preboil volume, so the only reason I have the 0.5 gallons in the mash tun is to account for the volume occupied by the false bottom so that my strike water volume is accurate.

As Auggie said above, I'd drastically reduce your flow rate, especially during mash recirc.. Like barely trickling, and it should help.

 

[augiedoggy]

Thanks for sharing your process, I am going to try this on my next brew day. I have the 20 gallon system and my volumes are a bit different. Is there a reason you have the .5 gallon recoverable mash dead space? Also, where do you enter the HERMS dead space? I have mine set currently at 1 gallon dead space in the mash (non recoverable), due to the .5 gal in HERMS, and .41 gal in the mash tun (per spike). I love the system, but currently experiencing low efficiencies (50%) and missed SG. I believe it could be between the volumes, sparge (channeling), or grain crush.

There is no non recoverable dead space as long as your flushing the wort from herms coil and space under the false bottom with sparge water at the end of a brew .

 

[Rlawlyes]

Thanks guys, I'll try everything on my next brew day.

 

[Bohern]

@augiedoggy and @TheMadKing how do you guys handle doing a mash out? Meaning ramp up and how long before you start sparge?