Recipe Review

[jonuggs]

I've only got about 4 brews under my belt but I'm very eager to start designing my own recipes. Using a variety of sources, and Hopville's Beercalculus, I've come up with 2 recipes that I'd like some feedback on.

They are both designed with the winter/holidays in mind and are both partial mash. Any input would be appreciated, and I'd be glad to answer any questions that anybody has. In addition, I have some questions of my own that I'm eager to get some input on.

Caramel Gingerbread Porter
Steep:
3 lbs. Crystal 60
12 oz. Biscuit Malt
8 oz. Black Patent

Boil:
6.5 lbs. Amber Light Malt Extract syrup
8 oz. Blackstrap Molasses
8 oz. Brown Sugar
1 tsp. Irish Moss
1 tsp. Cinnamon
1 tsp. Powdered Ginger (or fresh, grated ginger)

Hops:
2 oz. US Fuggle
.5 oz. Tettnanger

Yeast:
Wyeast Scottish Ale



Chocolate Imperial Stout
Steep:
8 oz. Black Patent
8 oz. Roasted Barley
8 oz. Chocolate Malt

Boil:
11 lbs. Amber Malt Extract
1 tsp. Irish Moss
6 oz. Lactose

Hops:
1.5 oz. Goldings
.5 oz. Magnum
1 oz. Goldings (late)

Addition to Secondary:
4 oz. Cacoa Nibs

Yeast:
Wyeast Irish Ale


I will not be kegging, as I'm not set up for it. Both of these will be bottle conditioned. I'm worried about the potential for bottle bombs with the Imperial Stout. Do I need to do anything differently while bottle conditioning with a somewhat heavier beer like this?

Will the addition of molasses and brown sugar to my porter impart any flavor at all? A friend of mine described this recipe as ". . .bottling the vomit of a gingerbread man." Well, I don't want it to be quite that sweet, but I would like the gingerbread and caramel flavors to come through.


I think that's it for now. Thanks for the input.

 

[BigEd]

I've only got about 4 brews under my belt but I'm very eager to start designing my own recipes. Using a variety of sources, and Hopville's Beercalculus, I've come up with 2 recipes that I'd like some feedback on.

They are both designed with the winter/holidays in mind and are both partial mash. Any input would be appreciated, and I'd be glad to answer any questions that anybody has. In addition, I have some questions of my own that I'm eager to get some input on.

The first recipe is WAY overboard in crystal malt. BTW these are not partial mashes but extract with steeping specialty grains. There is no base grain here, hence no mash. One of the problems novice homebrewers often seem to encounter when writing recipes is a lack of understand of the ingredients. While there are lots of recipe software programs available, unfortunately they are only going to tell you gravity and color numbers and not whether the ratio of the ingredients listed is going to make a proper beer. So while you may like the looks of the raw numbers you may not like the flavor of the actual beer.

Caramel Gingerbread Porter
Steep:
3 lbs. Crystal 60
12 oz. Biscuit Malt
8 oz. Black Patent

Boil:
6.5 lbs. Amber Light Malt Extract syrup
8 oz. Blackstrap Molasses
8 oz. Brown Sugar
1 tsp. Irish Moss
1 tsp. Cinnamon
1 tsp. Powdered Ginger (or fresh, grated ginger)

Hops:
2 oz. US Fuggle
.5 oz. Tettnanger

Yeast:
Wyeast Scottish Ale

As I said above there is way too much crystal malt here. Three pounds is going to give you a lot of residual sweetness and is likely to also result in a "flabby", under-attenuated body to the beer. One pound of crystal is going to be plenty here. Black patent is pretty aggressive. Unless you appreciate its charcoal-like characteristics you might consider using a chocolate malt instead. Dry, light extract would be a better choice for your base rather than liquid amber IMO. The dry will ferment more fully and the addition of your specialty malts will provide plenty of color. Blackstrap molasses is another very aggressive ingredient. You will definitely taste it in the beer. This choice is purely subjective but unless you are a big fan a smaller quantity of a lighter molasses might be a better choice. In baked gingerbread cinnamon is an ingredient but is used in smaller quantity than ginger. I'd do the same here and cut back on the cinnamon by 50% and add that 1/2 tsp into the ginger amount.

Chocolate Imperial Stout
Steep:
8 oz. Black Patent
8 oz. Roasted Barley
8 oz. Chocolate Malt

Boil:
11 lbs. Amber Malt Extract
1 tsp. Irish Moss
6 oz. Lactose

Hops:
1.5 oz. Goldings
.5 oz. Magnum
1 oz. Goldings (late)

Addition to Secondary:
4 oz. Cacoa Nibs

Yeast:
Wyeast Irish Ale

As in the first recipe I would reduce and simplify. Switch the amber extract to light, preferably dry. Eliminate the black patent and use additional roasted barley and chocolate malt. For all that base try 1.75-2 lbs total, maybe a pound of roasted and 3/4 pound of chocolate.

I will not be kegging, as I'm not set up for it. Both of these will be bottle conditioned. I'm worried about the potential for bottle bombs with the Imperial Stout. Do I need to do anything differently while bottle conditioning with a somewhat heavier beer like this?

Make sure the beer is finished fermenting before you bottle it.

 

[BoomerSoonerBrewer]

Like myself, you've overdone it on the crystal. I would consider running your proposed recipe through hopeville.com or beersmith.

 

[Yooper]

for the first recipe, cut the crystal by 2/3 and it'll be better. I personally dislike the flavor of fermented molasses and brown sugar, but if you like it it'll be ok. Remember that once the sugar ferments out, the molasses tastes very unpleasant and not at all like a gingerbread would.

I'd use light LME and not amber, because of the specialty malts being used. Amber extract has crystal malt and other malts (Munich?) so you'd be doubling up on the crystal malt. Amber malt is really not a good ingredient for any recipe that is adding specialty malts.

1 teaspoon of cinnamon is a LOT. I might hold that back and had one cinnamon stick, maybe two, in secondary, or at the end of fermentation. And a teaspoon of ginger is likewise a lot. Spices are to be used sparingly as they can be overpowering if not careful.

Black patent is powerful stuff, and that is a stout with that much in it. Harsh, ashy, and astrigent would be the result of 8 ounces of BP in that beer. _____________________________________________________________

For the second recipe, again, I"d lose the amber extract because it already has crystal malt and such in it. Use light or pale extract only when you are using specialty grains.

Otherwise, that recipe looks ok.

 

[jonuggs]

Just wanted to say thanks for all the input. I'm going to modify the recipes based on everybody's input.

Also, BigEd - I humbly ask: how do I come to understand all of the ingredients without using them in recipes?

Thanks again!

 

[BigEd]

Just wanted to say thanks for all the input. I'm going to modify the recipes based on everybody's input.

Also, BigEd - I humbly ask: how do I come to understand all of the ingredients without using them in recipes?

Thanks again!

Re ingredients, the main point I was trying to make is that the ratio of ingredients used is commonly misunderstood and/or misused by folks starting out making their own recipes. Basic recipe formulation is covered in Palmer's "How to Brew" and there are more advanced publications on the topic like Daniel's "Designing Great Beers". I'm not belittling your efforts but you can reduce the mileage significantly on the learning curve by getting a handle on that compared to the "grab & dump" approach.

I'll try to make a crude analogy with cooking. If you had never made chicken soup and came up with a recipe using a three pound chicken along with two pounds of garlic and four pounds of carrots the ingredients would not be wrong but the soup may not come out tasting the way you think chicken soup should. However, if you looked up a number of chicken soup recipes in various cookbooks while they would all be different they would all share a basic, similar ratio of ingredients. Again to beat my dead horse of a point, it's the same with beer. Any beer is going to be predominantly base malt (or extract) along with much smaller amounts of specialty ingredients to accomplish specific targets of color, texture, flavor support, etc. Anyways I guess that's a long winded way of saying that 5-10% crystal malt (if you choose to use it) is normally plenty.