Question about yeast starter, fermcap, and weird floaters

[Yooper]

I started my yeast starter on Thursday. I'm making 1000 ml starter out of a Wyeast smack pack. On Friday evening, I noticed a "lump" swirl by on the stir plate. I figured it was a little clump of DME that didn't dissolve completely, but didn't worry about it.

Last night, the lump still swirled by, so I got curious. I turned off the stir plate, and let it sit for a minute. I took the foil off of the yeast starter, and there on top were three little clumps of clear goo. At first I thought, "Uh oh! Rope infection!" but I used a sanitized spoon and took out the little goo balls. Very small, under pea sized, and soft and smooshy. I thought the starter was toast, but decided to keep it going.

Today I turned off the stir plate and inspected it through the glass. No goo balls, just a nice white yeast on the bottom. I took off the foil. There may be a very slight hint of a sour-ish smell, but I didn't use any hops in my starter and it's not really sour like lacto may be.

The thoughts I had were it's either an infection, or a side effect of the Fermcap I used. I used quite a bit more than the instructions call for- because my 1000 ML starter was inclined to boil over more than once. I added it until it stopped threatening to boil over. My question is just that- is this an early infection process and do I need to dump this starter? Or could it somehow be coagulated goo from the Fermcap?

Any thoughts?

I'd hate to throw out $8 of yeast, but I'd hate even more to throw away a whole batch of beer!

 

[SD-SLIM]

I would guess it's a side effect of Fermcap...since Fermcap's active ingredient is Dimethylpolysiloxane (a silicone anti-foaming agent). FDA allows 10 pats per million of this stuff to be used, but it must be removed prior to bottling/kegging...having said that it seems you used way more than the FDA allows and probably deems safe.
So my advice...be safe and dump...but that's just me!

 

[djsethall]

Instead of throwing out the whole batch of yeast, why not decant and throw slurry into a fresh batch of starter mix, sorta like washing the yeast? I think that would do the trick by getting rid of the excess fermcap. Instead of boiling in the flask, I boil in a pan, then pour it into the flask while it is still very hot. This seems to sterilize the inside of the flask and you dont have a problem with boil over. If this works, you can thank me by putting your pics back up in the boneyard. LOL

 

[beninan]

Women are not allowed to ask questions.



Ok, just kidding.
I've never used fermcap so I'm not sure, but I would double the size of the starter and see if it reoccurs.

 

[ArcaneXor]

Could it be proteins/break material?

 

[Yooper]

Could it be proteins/break material?

No, no way. They were very small goobers. Soft, pliable, clear. Three small goobers. Not break material like I've ever seen! And not really any sort of coagulated protein. These had the consistency of of a very soft gelatin. I first thought lacto or rope infection, but there were only three little goobers. I've never seen anything like it!

 

[djsethall]

I think I gave you a solution. Try it or dump it. Did you save the goobers for diagnosis under a microscope? If it is just gelatinized fermcap, then there will be no cells besides yeast in the goobers.

 

[wyzazz]

You didn't happen to take a pic of the little goobers did you Yooper? I use fermcap in all of my starters and beers and have never seen anything like what you are describing. I'd likely throw out the starter and start again, not worth risking the beer.

 

[Yooper]

You didn't happen to take a pic of the little goobers did you Yooper? I use fermcap in all of my starters and beers and have never seen anything like what you are describing. I'd likely throw out the starter and start again, not worth risking the beer.

No, I didn't. I chilled it, and the spent wort on top was beautifully clear. I decanted it, and the yeast looks fine and smells great.

 

[wyzazz]

No, I didn't. I chilled it, and the spent wort on top was beautifully clear. I decanted it, and the yeast looks fine and smells great.

Give it a shot then, even if it is infected somehow you may never even notice depending on how fast you drink the beer. BUT, if you're concerned or just a little doubtful I'd just throw it out.

 

[Yooper]

Give it a shot then, even if it is infected somehow you may never even notice depending on how fast you drink the beer. BUT, if you're concerned or just a little doubtful I'd just throw it out.

I'm still on the fence. I'm mashing in now, so I have about two hours to contemplate!

 

[wyzazz]

I'm mashing in now, so I have about two hours to contemplate!

I'm gonna live vicariously through you for the day, how's it smell?

 

[Homercidal]

It's the fermcap. I've used baby gas drops and the last time I added to my starter it came out and clumped up a bit. Maybe I didn't shake it up good enough. Eventually it broke up and integrated into the starter (as far as I know!) I added it during the fermentation stage, not the boiling stage because I had a large pan for boiling, and I added only when the stuff wanted to climb out of the Flask!

I would not worry about it. You know there is a seldom used, but very wise saying in homebrewing circles: RDWHAHB.

As far as the FDA allowable amounts, I don't' know about Fermcap, but the baby gas drops you give directly to a baby, so by using common sense and a bit of calculus, I figure a few drops in 5 gallons of beer is probably going to be ok (since much of it is PROBABLY going to settle down and not get racked into the finished beer...)

 

[Hugh_Jass]

yep, fermcap. Pitch it. It'll be fine. Any residual will drop out with the trub.

 

[astropunk]

What you describe sounds exactly like clumps of fermap. A tiny bit of that stuff goes a long way, and you probably added way too much. I use 5 drops to boil up to 7.5 gals in an 8 gallon pot. That amount is enough to prevent boilover.

 

[Yooper]

I'm doing a 10 gallon batch today, so I'll go ahead and pitch that yeast in one fermenter, and a different yeast in the other. I'm finishing up the fly sparge now and will be starting the boil in a minute.

 

[Yooper]

Well, it's all done. The yeast looked great, and I didn't see any more goobers at all, so I'm hopeful. I pitched that yeast in one fermenter (Denny's Favorite 50) and a washed Wyeast 1335 in the other.

The recipe was:

14 lbs Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM) Grain 77.26 %
2 lbs Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 11.04 %
1 lbs Caramel/Crystal Malt - 10L (10.0 SRM) Grain 5.52 %
1 lbs Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (40.0 SRM) Grain 5.52 %


2.00 oz Cascade [8.50 %] (60 min) Hops 25.4 IBU

2.00 oz Cascade [8.50 %] (15 min) Hops 12.6 IBU
2.00 oz Cascade [8.50 %] (1 min)

1.00 oz Centennial [9.60 %] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops
1.00 oz Simcoe [12.70 %] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops -

It's supposed to be a sorta clone of 21st Amendment's Bitter American seasonal. I got a can of this as a gift from a fellow HBT'er, and I fell in love. Well, not with her, but with the beer. Although she's pretty cute, honestly.
Anyway, I thought I'd give a clone a short. I thought the Denny's Favorite yeast would be perfect for this beer. Most people would use an American ale yeast (s05 or Wyeast 1056) but I really like the way Denny's Favorite brings out the malt without underattenuating and without subduing the hops. I think that is the key to that beer- a session APA/IPA with great hops flavor balanced by malt. I got an OG of 1.048 for 10.75 gallons- perfect!

 

[Homercidal]

Mmm... That sounds tasty!

Am I an alcoholic if beer sounds good at 8:30 in the morning??

 

[wyzazz]

Am I an alcoholic if beer sounds good at 8:30 in the morning??

Nope, I keep sipping on my coffee and thinking how much better a Chocolate Hazelnut Porter would be for breakfast.

 

[Homercidal]

Whew! The beer urge is gone. All that's left is the shakes...

 

[Yooper]

Whew! The beer urge is gone. All that's left is the shakes...

Oh, good! That's super easy to fix. You know what you have to do!