Poll: Do you have, or plan to get, an electric car?

[NGD]

They bought it knowing it wasn't a Tesla and it works for their purpose.

This is key unless you want to pay top dollar.
Hope this is helpful. Here were our criteria for getting a full EV.

• 200 mi range
• Under $33k after rebates etc
• Charge under 6 hrs @ 220v
• Not raise insurance through the roof.​

Here is why we went with a plug-in hybrid.

• Rolling power outages due to Californias reliance on renewable energy
• Better rebates for our particular vehicle
• 600mi est range before fueling
• Refuel takes minutes
• 30 mile ev is half daily driving (when kids have sports)

This is a vehicle that could easily be our only car, but we would still need a AWD/4WD for snow. I dont believe a full EV would not have suited our situation.

 

[Kent88]

• Rolling power outages due to Californias reliance on renewable energy

huh?

 

[Kent88]

I'm not too familiar with what is going on in California besides wildfires. But doing some really quick googling it looks like the blackouts were a very recent event, and the cause is underestimating peak air-conditioning demand, a large part of that being a failure to anticipate just how bad global warming had become.

So congrats on your new Hybrid, I suppose. Because unless I'm very much mistaken (which is entirely possible) if that is on a list of why you weren't buying an EV, you must've bought a new vehicle within the past week or so.

• 200 mi range
• Charge under 6 hrs @ 220v

I'm pretty sure this wont work at all with cars and gear that are publicly available at the moment. I think a Chevy Bolt on a level 2 charger (240v 40amps) gets somewhere around 20 mile/hour-charge. You're talking about 34 miles/hour-charge. You'd have to significantly boost the amps to get to that. I think my Volt charges a little more than 10miles/hour-charge on 16 amps. So assuming this is linear, you're looking at 56 amps getting you just shy of 34miles/hour charge. I genuinely don't know how many people's residences can handle that kind of draw without investing in some serious new equipment. Anyone here with some experience as an electrician, is that something that could be easily set up in someone's house, alongside their existing system? Anyone here who follows charging tech better than me, are there any EVs on the market below $120,000 that can handle 240v 56amp charging?

I could be very wrong, but this reminds me of a video I once saw where an engineer was asked how a blue line could be drawn with a red marker, with a team of clients demanding he make that possible.

 

[NGD]

I'm not too familiar with what is going on in California besides wildfires. But doing some really quick googling it looks like the blackouts were a very recent event, and the cause is underestimating peak air-conditioning demand, a large part of that being a failure to anticipate just how bad global warming had become.

The explanation of this would require a new thread. It basically boils down to mismanagement of the Public Utilities Commission, a largely subsidized push for "renewable" energy and the closure of existing power plants that couldn't compete with less regulated renewable energy. Also while the current round of power outages are more recent, it happened last year as well. Some more rural areas were out of power for 4-5 days. In the suburbs where I live it was just over 2 days. The local radio jocks make the joke that if the wind blows to hard, the power goes out. If it doesn't blow hard enough, the power goes out.

So congrats on your new Hybrid, I suppose. Because unless I'm very much mistaken (which is entirely possible) if that is on a list of why you weren't buying an EV, you must've bought a new vehicle within the past week or so.

Had the Hybrid since September. As I've stated before...I would have preferred a Volt. Due to the situation with the local electric utility...its cheaper to charge late at night and we originally left around 6 for morning workouts.

I'm pretty sure this wont work at all with cars and gear that are publicly available at the moment.

Correct. Currently the technology hasn't evolved enough to fit these criteria which was why the hybrid was a better choice. I would have perhaps splurged a bit for a larger full electric..but the South Koreas cars are were new (to my knowledge) and I don't like testing unproven designs for automakers. A model 3 was very tempted, but just out of budget and charging parameters.

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

I'm not too familiar with what is going on in California besides wildfires. But doing some really quick googling it looks like the blackouts were a very recent event, and the cause is underestimating peak air-conditioning demand, a large part of that being a failure to anticipate just how bad global warming had become.

The explanation of this would require a new thread. It basically boils down to mismanagement of the Public Utilities Commission, a largely subsidized push for "renewable" energy and the closure of existing power plants that couldn't compete with less regulated renewable energy. Also while the current round of power outages are more recent, it happened last year as well. Some more rural areas were out of power for 4-5 days. In the suburbs where I live it was just over 2 days. The local radio jocks make the joke that if the wind blows to hard, the power goes out. If it doesn't blow hard enough, the power goes out.

Some of us are old enough remember why "Enron" is a bad word and why Gray Davis got recalled for the Governator back in the early 2000s. That was when "rolling blackouts" first entered the lexicon. Then there was the 2011 San Diego blackout. Last year PG&E got into trouble proactively blacking people out during potential high-risk wildfire times. And now they're talking about it again as we deal with this heat wave.

Something like that tends to cause memories. And causes a lack of trust in our utilities to actually supply power to our homes.

 

[Kent88]

Also while the current round of power outages are more recent, it happened last year as well. Some more rural areas were out of power for 4-5 days. In the suburbs where I live it was just over 2 days.

Last year PG&E got into trouble proactively blacking people out during potential high-risk wildfire times.

That is the explanation I've been reading as well.

 

[NGD]

That explanation explains what happened last year. This year its due to a lack of power once the sun goes down and solar power farms stop being effective. Unless the utility buys power at premium rates from another state then the alternative is to start shutting down sections of the grid to lighten the load.

@bwarbiany You left out Micheal Peevey, former VP of SoCal Edison and President/Commish of the Ca PUC ‘02-‘15

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

@bwarbiany You left out Micheal Peevey, former VP of SoCal Edison and President/Commish of the Ca PUC ‘02-‘15

I'm sure if I wanted to come up with an exhaustive list of our PUC mismanagement we could add bunch of names ;-)

 

[NGD]

@bwarbiany Hah, very true. His is worth noting though. Google him

@RePete just read that link. Those hyper milers are awesome. I’ve heard positive things about the Kias. If I were looking for a new car today they would go on the list.

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

@RePete just read that link. Those hyper milers are awesome. I’ve heard positive things about the Kias. If I were looking for a new car today they would go on the list.

Allow me to speak in favor of everyone who has been on a road behind a hypermiler.

They can DIAF.

 

[NGD]

Just wonder if this happened to anyone else when they first drove on electric. The first couple of times you come to a stop light you think “did the car just shut off?” because its so quiet?

Maybe it's just because I’ve driven older vehicles all my life. The kids still make fun of me about it

 

[bleme]

Allow me to speak in favor of everyone who has been on a road behind a hypermiler.

They can DIAF.

HyperMiler's aren't only in EV's either. I get behind ICE vehicles all the time and wonder if they forgot they have a gas pedal, merging onto a 70mph freeway at 35mph! If they want to DIAF, that's definitely how to get there...

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

HyperMiler's aren't only in EV's either. I get behind ICE vehicles all the time and wonder if they forgot they have a gas pedal, merging onto a 70mph freeway at 35mph! If they want to DIAF, that's definitely how to get there...

I know. I haven't even been stuck behind a hypermiling EV. Most of them here in SoCal think that if they put their foot to the floor in a Tesla and rocket to 60 like a Corvette that it's still "green".

No, my experience was driving behind my best friend roughly 20 years ago when he was hypermiling his Hyundai. I've known him since we were 2 years old. I almost killed him that night.

 

[Kent88]

Lolz, I frequently drive 5mph under on the freeway with my Volt.

 

[RePete]

Lolz, I frequently drive 5mph under on the freeway with my Volt.

Around here, people pass and look at you like you are hyper-miling if you go the speed limit!

I posted that article partly just to make the point that range is dependent on many factors. The EPA range rating is just an average.

Today I drove to a work site which is about 59 miles from my home. It is mostly highway. I am able to charge while I work. On the way there, I went 50 miles on electric, and 9 on gas. As an experiment, on the way home, I kept the cruise control set to 64mph. I made it home on all electric, with 4 miles of range still on the car. So how you drive does make a difference, if range is your main concern.

 

[S-Met]

This isn't comparable but related. Slowly I've been replacing my lawn equipment over to electric and the difference is night and day. Although I haven't made the plunge and bought an electric lawnmower (I have a 5 year old Honda that refuses to die), I can weed wack and blow off yard debris with rechargeable machines early in morning or in evening without annoying neighbors.

Mostly this and is quite relevant.
Electric/battery mower isn't good enough for my front or back yard let alone both in a day. Weed whacker and blower are, just barely but i have two batteries and have to wack-then-charge, mow then blow or I run out of juice.

I've been eyeing battery mowers and battery cars. I have a hybrid, but full battery is a ways off for me. I cover too many miles and too many places without power. Not without charging stations, but without electricity. And what about these brownouts and blackouts, I know they aren't all the time, but I can’t be reliant in inconsistencies.

I don't have a time frame, but Electric vehicles (and mowers) will eventually be in my future. They just need a little more time and development before they are right for me.

 

[Kent88]

Battery Powered Lawn Equipment thread

 

[AzOr]

Mostly this and is quite relevant.
Electric/battery mower isn't good enough for my front or back yard let alone both in a day. Weed whacker and blower are, just barely but i have two batteries and have to wack-then-charge, mow then blow or I run out of juice.

I've been eyeing battery mowers and battery cars. I have a hybrid, but full battery is a ways off for me. I cover too many miles and too many places without power. Not without charging stations, but without electricity. And what about these brownouts and blackouts, I know they aren't all the time, but I can’t be reliant in inconsistencies.

I don't have a time frame, but Electric vehicles (and mowers) will eventually be in my future. They just need a little more time and development before they are right for me.

I'm jealous at the size of the yard you must have!

 

[NGD]

I think @S-Met and most others here are on the same page. An electric car doesnt make sense for our situations right now. Once better battery tech comes out it will likely be a different story for many of us. Theres a boatload of potential and ability to utilize new designs is fantastic. Its just not quite there yet.

 

[RePete]

As a followup to my post above. Today on the way in I set the cruise control to 60mph. Slightly different route. 57 miles all electric, with 7 miles of range leftover. So efficiency was much better both directions, just by slowing down a little. Highway speeds really eat up juice.

 

[vampirebeer]

As a followup to my post above. Today on the way in I set the cruise control to 60mph. Slightly different route. 57 miles all electric, with 7 miles of range leftover. So efficiency was much better both directions, just by slowing down a little. Highway speeds really eat up juice.

hmmm... how far can you get if you are doing 85?

 

[RePete]

hmmm... how far can you get if you are doing 85?

My car doesn't go that fast. Except when my wife drives.

 

[vampirebeer]

My car doesn't go that fast. Except when my wife drives.

mine has a hard time with speeds lower than 75...

 

[RePete]

mine has a hard time with speeds lower than 75...

Mine is only bad if she is worried we are going to be late somewhere. Then I hear "let me drive, we'll get there faster".

 

[Kent88]

GM EVs (probably some others as well, but I haven't checked any out) give scores for driving technique, terrain, climate settings, and outside temperature, to give the driver an idea of why they're getting the mileage that they do.

Driving at highway speeds brings down the driving technique score, but in my experience it won't take it below zero by itself.

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

GM EVs (probably some others as well, but I haven't checked any out) give scores for driving technique, terrain, climate settings, and outside temperature, to give the driver an idea of why they're getting the mileage that they do.

Driving at highway speeds brings down the driving technique score, but in my experience it won't take it below zero by itself.

Huh, they have technology to critique driving?

I guess that's for the single guys?

 

[Kent88]

Yep. I figure it is sort of an extension of range anxiety. These vehicles advertise a certain range more than ICE vehicles do, so when it varies (especially when it dips below the number they advertise) it is probably a good idea to tell the driver why.

 

[Kent88]

Actually, with my car showing my technique score like that, I've been thinking of getting one of those tattlers from my insurance agent. When one can see how they're driving and correct themselves near instantaneously it makes a lot more sense than installing a tattler and driving blind.

 

[NGD]

So efficiency was much better both directions, just by slowing down a little. Highway speeds really eat up juice.

This is something that I would have not taken into account prior to purchasing. The drop in efficiency drops substantially when driving at highway speeds me. In Nevada where the speed limit is 80mph for many freeways, I imagine its a pretty big penalty to efficiency and increase in charging time.

 

[NGD]

I didnt realize hybrids and EVs came with a performance interpretive technology assistant. PITA for short.

Yes, I’m terrible at acronyms.

 

[Kent88]

 

[NGD]

Toyota gives much less info. But they do give you 800 pages of manual to read. My kid suggested they might sell more cars if they included a Harry Potter book instead.

 

[Kent88]

It's pretty nice that digital copies are available. The search function is darn helpful.

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

Actually, with my car showing my technique score like that, I've been thinking of getting one of those tattlers from my insurance agent. When one can see how they're driving and correct themselves near instantaneously it makes a lot more sense than installing a tattler and driving blind.

I always wonder what one of those tattlers would think when I take my Jeep off-roading. They'd probably think I was a maniac.

 

[Kent88]

Oh I wouldn't install it in my Jeep. I'd avoid plugging it in there.

 

[AzOr]

I always wonder what one of those tattlers would think when I take my Jeep off-roading. They'd probably think I was a maniac.

The insurance co would probably wonder why you're driving out in the middle of nowhere at .2 mph, and doing a lot of idling.

 

[NGD]

Tattle: vehicle is pointed southwest while traveling on a northwest arc.

Insurance adjuster: turns off Gymkana video and watches geotracker

 

[Bilsch]

Tesla gives you several options for how to view your consumption and estimate range. I find this page is the most useful as you can see moment by moment how you are doing and adjust accordingly if you wish. The larger troughs and peaks shown here are from cars changing lanes in and out of in front of me.

 

[Kent88]

Is it true you can change settings to Ludicrous speed?

 

[NGD]

@Bilsch have you had the car long enough to get through a good winter storm? Just curious how the cold impacts the Tesla batteries. We know a family that got stuck in a blizzard coming down from tahoe due to dead battery. Our winters aren't even that cold.