Poll: Do you have, or plan to get, an electric car?

[fatjay]

They certainly got interesting when they were put on a fire sale to be sold and gotten rid of. The lack of support would concern me though, parts supply for jobs like brakes or struts, electrical repairs if and when needed. Does this concern you at all?

Yes and no. The car was made by magna in their austria plant. They also make jaguar and mercedes. So there are parts overlap. EV brake pads last 100k miles due to regen, so I figure that there would be time to figure that out. Plus after less than a year, there's dozens of part-outs on ebay.

 

[AzOr]

I always thought they looked like twins to the Polestar 2.
The Polestars can be had for low 20’s and they’re still in business. There’s two in my neighborhood and according to to my 30 second discussion w one of the owners, he loves it. Not bad looking either.

 

[Kharnynb]

polestars and the new volvo electrics look much better than previous models.

 

[Kharnynb]

 

[Airborneguy]

I’m trading up to a lightly used Model Y Performance next weekend. I figure if my car’s value has been unnaturally depreciated, may as well trade for another one that’s facing the same situation.

I’m going from a 2020 3 performance to a 2023 Y Performance. This one has even less miles than mine did when I bought it used in 2022.

I’ll be giving up FSD, but I don’t use it enough to justify keeping my car for that reason alone.

 

[Bilsch]

Everyone has different priorities for vehicles. I like rare, unique, and head turning. I've never owned a honda, toyota, hyundai, or kia. I've had more than 50 cars in my life. A friend of mine has had 4.

The ocean has one of the most advanced battery management systems including teperature management, but i only have a level 1 charger, as I havent' finished running power to my shop yet. I have a 100' 12ga extension cord from the back of the house on a 20a circuit. Also the worst of it was when the high temps were around 10f and the low's were below 0f.

If it had one of the best battery management systems it would not suffer from all those troubles and low efficiency you describe. Neither of my Teslas have those issues. Your troubles are obviously some of the reasons this brand didn't make it.

 

[doug293cz]

Interesting commentary on FSD.

https://www.facebook.com/share/p/169AtTRu3P/

Brew on

 

[fatjay]

If it had one of the best battery management systems it would not suffer from all those troubles and low efficiency you describe. Neither of my Teslas have those issues. Your troubles are obviously some of the reasons this brand didn't make it.

How much time have you spent on a level 1 charger? Because i've been almost exclusively on level 1. Yes, you can power through efficiencies by applying enough amps. But for slow charging at very cold temps, not so much.

 

[Bilsch]

How much time have you spent on a level 1 charger? Because i've been almost exclusively on level 1. Yes, you can power through efficiencies by applying enough amps. But for slow charging at very cold temps, not so much.

I take issue with your statements about how EV look terrible and perform terrible when it seems most of the problems you had were operator error. Although I suppose I would complain about an ICE vehicles utility and efficiency if I had to fuel one using only a one gallon gas can.

And yes I use level 1 from time to time. It's certainly slow but I haven't seen the kind of power loss you have claimed. But then the Tesla battery management and thermal system is the best there is.

 

[fatjay]

I take issue with your statements about how EV look terrible and perform terrible when it seems most of the problems you had were operator error. Although I suppose I would complain about an ICE vehicles utility and efficiency if I had to fuel one using only a one gallon gas can.

And yes I use level 1 from time to time. It's certainly slow but I haven't seen the kind of power loss you have claimed. But then the Tesla battery management and thermal system is the best there is.

Tesla has the best battery management system on the market, hands down. I don't think anyone would argue that.

And my system charges fine in the warmer weathers, so that's not a problem either.

But I would say your comparison to an ICE vehicle to 1 gallon gas can wouldn't be the same. Unless you were saying you were filling with a 1 gallon gas can, and 3/4 of that gallon spilled out on the way. Or you had to use 3/4 gallon of fuel to add 1 gallon of fuel.

My time of use billing just got approved, so I will be switching to grid charging for my EV, as well as finishing up my power run to the shop, so I can properly charge at 40a 220v.

 

[z-bob]

I saw a video a couple of days ago about a new Tesla Model C coming soon, powered by an aluminum ion battery* instead of lithium, with the base models projected to sell for less than $20000. With a maximum range of about 560 miles (realistically closer to 500). It sounds like vaporware to me, but if it's real I could get onboard with that.

*I really doubt aluminum batteries are ready for mass production.

Edit to add link: www.youtube.com/watch?v=5jbXOro6BwU

 

[Bilsch]

I saw a video a couple of days ago about a new Tesla Model C coming soon, powered by an aluminum ion battery* instead of lithium, with the base models projected to sell for less than $20000. With a maximum range of about 560 miles (realistically closer to 500). It sounds like vaporware to me, but if it's real I could get onboard with that.

*I really doubt aluminum batteries are ready for mass production.

Tesla has said nothing about such a model and there is so much guessing it's impossible to know if thats a thing or not.

Personally I think Tesla will switch most of it's manufacturing capacity to robotaxi if the testing in June goes as they plan. This would tend to explain why lately Elon doesn't seem to care what groups of customers he alienates.

 

[fatjay]

If i were to buy a tesla, it would be a model 3 base. That particular car has LFP batteries instead of NMC. LFP batteries are heavier and have lower charge and discharge thresholds. However they don't have that pesky thermal runaway issue, and they have 3+ the cycles of NMC. I use LFP for my house and solar system, and i can fully charge and discharge them every day for 20 years before seeing any meaningful reduction in capacity.

 

[Bilsch]

If i were to buy a tesla, it would be a model 3 base. That particular car has LFP batteries instead of NMC. LFP batteries are heavier and have lower charge and discharge thresholds. However they don't have that pesky thermal runaway issue, and they have 3+ the cycles of NMC. I use LFP for my house and solar system, and i can fully charge and discharge them every day for 20 years before seeing any meaningful reduction in capacity.

That is wise. Tesla has been saying they will be converting as many of their cars to LFP as practical. For the same reasons you give.

 

[sibelman]

saw a video

more interesting if there were a link, but this could be less than vaporware

 

[z-bob]

more interesting if there were a link, but this could be less than vaporware

Lemme see if I can find it again...

Here it is: I'll also add it to my previous post

 

[Bilsch]

Lemme see if I can find it again...

Here it is: I'll also add it to my previous post

Looks a little hoky to me. Any new battery chemistry has to go though many years of testing before it would be released for use in a car.

 

[z-bob]

Looks a little hoky to me. Any new battery chemistry has to go though many years of testing before it would be released for use in a car.

Agreed. I think aluminum ion batteries are the way of the future, but I doubt it's the very near future.

 

[sibelman]

There have been SO many articles about revolutionary new battery technology -- lots of excitement in the lab, sometimes amplified by corporate folks in car companies. But what we all need is better batteries in cars/trucks we can actually buy, not promotion of non-existent products.

Further big battery improvement seems highly likely.

 

[Broothru]

Looks a little hoky to me. Any new battery chemistry has to go though many years of testing before it would be released for use in a car.

Or use the Elon Musk model for Testing & Evaluation. Like the one he used (and is still using) for autonomous driving systems and algorithms?

“Well we thought the public wanted aluminum batteries that could go 900 miles between charging cycles and recharge in less than 3 minutes. Did you expect us to thoroughly test them before releasing them to the public?”

 

[Bilsch]

Or use the Elon Musk model for Testing & Evaluation. Like the one he used (and is still using) for autonomous driving systems and algorithms?

“Well we thought the public wanted aluminum batteries that could go 900 miles between charging cycles and recharge in less than 3 minutes. Did you expect us to thoroughly test them before releasing them to the public?”

Or conversely look at what they have already done with their battery packs being the most reliable ones on the market. I mean you can cherry pick only the negatives but I choose to look at the successes and I could not be happier with my Teslas.

 

[Broothru]

A cousin, now a retired electrical engineer for CALTRANS, first introduced me to Teslas about 7 or 8 years ago. To say he’s an advocate would be a gross understatement. He’s had ‘several’ including two he’s bought for his daughter. His latest is a Cybertruck, and I must say that it’s the first time I’ve ever judged his intellect or sanity.

I’ll admit that I was initially blown away with the brand, and seriously considered breaking my 50 year love affair with Volvo to add one to the stable of autos. I even had plans for installing a Power Wall and solar panels. I’d like to say that Elon was the reason for deferring my decision to buy, but that factor is merely a more contemporary reason.

More to the point, his ‘eccentricities’ are more a factor in poisoning the corporate empire that was Tesla, and as many have pointed out, he didn’t build or design anything. All the genius comes from the people who work there. He simply bought it (and them).

But in any business enterprise, one should work hard to under-promise and over-deliver. Musk has done just the opposite. While many of Tesla’s achievements (battery management tech, innovation of services, etc.) have been groundbreaking, so have been some highly promised yet never delivered features like self-driving (without wrecking) and self-igniting vehicles. Given the fact that there are many highly talented people working for Tesla (and SpaceX), some of the more spectacular missteps of both companies suggest toxic leadership at the top.

I’m quite an advocate for non-fossil powered vehicles, and I’m not afraid of automation and safety backup technologies for we mere humans. I own/drive/LOVE a hybrid car, and am seriously looking at adding an electric Volvo to the mix, if I can get a deal done before the price goes up 25% (or more).

I’m glad you (and my cousin) are so pleased with Tesla. I’m looking for a product (and a company) that is not focusing on ‘flash’ and cult of personality but rather one that has a proven track record on safety integrated with innovation, performance and reliability.

For all that Tesla has delivered in the past, I don’t hold much hope or trust in its current leadership and corporate culture to deliver those necessary features in the near term without a major change in both.

 

[Bilsch]

More to the point, his ‘eccentricities’ are more a factor in poisoning the corporate empire that was Tesla, and as many have pointed out, he didn’t build or design anything. All the genius comes from the people who work there. He simply bought it (and them).

This is said a lot but if one simply looks at the timeline you realize Tesla only had the Roadster when Elon bought in the company in 2004 and the concept of the Model S debuted in 2008 and wasn't sold until 2012. The founders had very little to do with the S and nothing to do with the X, 3, Y or CT.

That being said I'm not a fan of everything he does and lately even less so. Just a few months ago I dumped all the stock I had in the company and not a moment too soon as far as I'm concerned. Regardless the guy and his company have done great things. The most important of which was proving that EV were more then curiosities and could be better then ICE vehicles for for everyday transport. Without Elon I seriously doubt we would be where we are today in the electrification of transport progress. So again one can choose to focus on the negative or look at the successes. I (mostly) choose the latter.

And lastly no matter how much I hate the guy I would never disadvantage myself by purchasing inferior products just because I was mad at his antics. That really only hurts me and no one else. I have to laugh at the people selling a perfectly great car at a huge loss because of politics or hurt feelings. What a colossally stupid thing to do.

 

[Kent88]

In this thread, let's keep talk about the top guy at Tesla to things closely related to EVs. We can acknowledge that he's also a controversial person who has taken on some "distracting projects", but this isn't the place to discuss his role in the government or relationship with politicians.

Kent88,
HBT Moderator

 

[Kharnynb]

As far as I can see, Tesla has been surpassed by other more traditional companies in quality, which is backed up by recent surveys. Volvo and BMW doing especially well.
The model 3 seems to be the best Tesla left, while the cyber truck was left out of most for to little sold, but would have dragged that number down a lot.
Tesla has lost a lot of their best people to other manufacturers due to being so cheap and anti union.

 

[Airborneguy]

I like my car.

 

[Kharnynb]

I like my car.

that's all that matters!
the car I would like is way too expensive for poor old me, but i've got an old volvo 121 that's basically dead but almost rust-free that i'm planning to electrify at some point when money allows.

 

[Airborneguy]

that's all that matters!
the car I would like is way too expensive for poor old me, but i've got an old volvo 121 that's basically dead but almost rust-free that i'm planning to electrify at some point when money allows.

I’d love to attempt to electrify my Jeep.

 

[Kent88]

As things progress, I'm excited that I'll likely have a wealth of EV choices when the time comes to replace my one and only car. In particular, I'm hoping that the selection at the smaller, cheaper end of the range improves.

Barring a disaster, my current Bolt should be the worst BEV I will ever own, and aside from an odd parking brake issue it's been a nice car.

 

[mashdar]

I just wish Toyota would get in the game. If I were buying today, I'd be looking hard at the Mazdas, but it'll be a few years before my Prius reaches retirement age.

edit: hmm, I thought Mazda had a little electric hatchback. Am I wrong? Maybe I was looking at their hybrids when we bought our last car.

Also, I just remembered Buzzyforks, but ... It's just too weird looking for me, and this is coming from a Prius driver.