Other Half Daydream (oat cream IPAs) - all grain clone attempts

[Frieds]

So Im planning on taking a stab at this OatCreamIPA but using Columbus/Galaxy. I understand that Congress street uses all columbus on hot side and only 1.5oz of columbus and rest (~6oz) galaxy for the DH for a 5g batch- is that how you ran with this? ie vic secret in DH only with a touch of columbus in DH? Also wasn't sure if you put a dash of vic secret in WP or just used it exclusively in DH. Thanks.

Not sure if this helps but i kegged one last weekend that was 75% Columbus 25% Rakau in the kettle and then all Mosaic/Citra/Rakau In the dry hop with just a touch of Columbus and the flavour was unreal. I think the way you’ve planned your recipe will be fine but if you added a touch of Galaxy to the whirlpool as well I can’t see it making the beer any less enjoyable.

 

[Noob_Brewer]

Not sure if this helps but i kegged one last weekend that was 75% Columbus 25% Rakau in the kettle and then all Mosaic/Citra/Rakau In the dry hop with just a touch of Columbus and the flavour was unreal. I think the way you’ve planned your recipe will be fine but if you added a touch of Galaxy to the whirlpool as well I can’t see it making the beer any less enjoyable.

Thanks. Been prepping just now for this brew day tomorrow! Am doing mostly Columbus on hotside with a tiny late whirlpool addition of galaxy and in dryhop it’s flip flopped with BIg dose of galaxy and touch of Columbus. Excited!

 

[Fewer eyes]

Hey guys. Have scoured this thread in an attempt to recreate other half and new Zealand's garage projects 'no dreams till Brooklyn.' my local stores mill wont go fine enough to mill oat malt at all. Is it worth trying to brew with unmilled oatmalt? What kind of efficiency could I expect?

 

[Dgallo]

Hey guys. Have scoured this thread in an attempt to recreate other half and new Zealand's garage projects 'no dreams till Brooklyn.' my local stores mill wont go fine enough to mill oat malt at all. Is it worth trying to brew with unmilled oatmalt? What kind of efficiency could I expect?

I really hope you’re not messing with us with this question but if not here is your answer. Unless the whole kernels were mistakenly cracked, uncrushed grains won’t result in any sugars or proteins. Your better off running them through your blender or food processor

 

[Fewer eyes]

Errr *nervous laughter* yeah, joking. Nah I was serious, fairly new to brewing and guess I didn't think that question through entirely. Cheers.

 

[Dgallo]

Errr *nervous laughter* yeah, joking. Nah I was serious, fairly new to brewing and guess I didn't think that question through entirely. Cheers.

Sorry man. I most likely came off like a ****** and I sincerely apologize; recently I’ve seen people posting on here to troll.
Unless the grain husk is cracked, it is impermeable to water so you’ll yield very little at. Eat from the mash from those specific grains.

If you have a blender add about a pint of your mash water with the un crushed grains and rub it through a blender adding all contents to the top of your mash.

 

[VirginiaHops1]

Errr *nervous laughter* yeah, joking. Nah I was serious, fairly new to brewing and guess I didn't think that question through entirely. Cheers.

Have you already brewed? If not go pick up some flaked oats(quick oats) from the grocery store. Yeah your efficiency will be horrible using unmilled malted oats. I use them a lot and get mediocre efficiency even when I mill them, unless I have my mill set really really tight.

 

[Dgallo]

Have you already brewed? If not go pick up some flaked oats(quick oats) from the grocery store. Yeah your efficiency will be horrible using unmilled malted oats. I use them a lot and get mediocre efficiency even when I mill them, unless I have my mill set really really tight.

But if he substitutes the 30% malted oats for flaked oats In the common recipes in this thread, he’s going to be in a mess of trouble with his running.

 

[Fewer eyes]

Yeah I'm using a grain father and have battled with even small quantities of flaked oats even with hulls. Just found a store that says their mill will crush oat malt for me so 50% oat malt grain bill coming up this weekend!

 

[VirginiaHops1]

But if he substitutes the 30% malted oats for flaked oats In the common recipes in this thread, he’s going to be in a mess of trouble with his running.

Stuck sparge? I do BIAB so I guess I take that kind of stuff for granted

 

[Dgallo]

Yeah I'm using a grain father and have battled with even small quantities of flaked oats even with hulls. Just found a store that says their mill will crush oat malt for me so 50% oat malt grain bill coming up this weekend!

Idk where you’re located but Great Fermentation crushes all small kernel grains. If you’re within their shipping limit, check them out.

 

[Dgallo]

Stuck sparge? I do BIAB so I guess I take that kind of stuff for granted

I do the same. I use a false bottom Run and always assume we are all using the same process

 

[Frieds]

Hey guys. Have scoured this thread in an attempt to recreate other half and new Zealand's garage projects 'no dreams till Brooklyn.' my local stores mill wont go fine enough to mill oat malt at all. Is it worth trying to brew with unmilled oatmalt? What kind of efficiency could I expect?

I Had the No Dreams Til’ Brooklyn. It was delicious. They used Citra & Nelson Sauvin in there. Did you get to try the Sunrise Valley recently?

 

[Fewer eyes]

Idk where you’re located but Great Fermentation crushes all small kernel grains. If you’re within their shipping limit, check them out.

Auckland, New Zealand so naah, probably out of range.

I Had the No Dreams Til’ Brooklyn. It was delicious. They used Citra & Nelson Sauvin in there. Did you get to try the Sunrise Valley recently?

Yeah I'll be using sauvin and citra. yeah i tried Garage project's sunrise (brewed in collaboration with trillium) but was disappointed, especially after the quality of their collaboration on "Hapi Session's: Aro Sreet." Sunrise valley fell short on mouthfeel and was a bit dry for this style for my liking

Haven't seen people mentioning Dextrose in this thread? Is that for fear of drying the beer out? Im going to struggle to get a high ABV on the grainfather as already maxing out its grain capacity. This "drying out" turn of phrase has always confused me though: You're not making the FG any lower, you're just raising the SG yeah? I thought i might drop a bit of dextrose in to bring it up to 7.5/8%. no?

 

[royger]

Haven't seen people mentioning Dextrose in this thread? Is that for fear of drying the beer out? Im going to struggle to get a high ABV on the grainfather as already maxing out its grain capacity. This "drying out" turn of phrase has always confused me though: You're not making the FG any lower, you're just raising the SG yeah? I thought i might drop a bit of dextrose in to bring it up to 7.5/8%. no?

I added dextrose on my first attempt because my efficiency sucked, so I added ~10% dextrose during boil (compared against the grain bill). I was using Wyeast 1318 and IMO the resulting beer was slightly hot which I didn't particularly like. People enjoyed it, but if I have to add dextrose again I would keep it at ~5%, and maybe consider using some kind of raw sugar instead.

 

[Dgallo]

This "drying out" turn of phrase has always confused me though: You're not making the FG any lower, you're just raising the SG yeah? I thought i might drop a bit of dextrose in to bring it up to 7.5/8%. no?

You will be bringing the fg down though.... this is how it depletes the body and drys the beer out. You are raising the og with a 100% fermentable sugar meaning it will be converted purely into alcohol without any complex sugars remaining from it. Pure alcohols gravity is 0.787 which is much lower than water at 1.000 and it will lower the FG and thin it out/dry it out compared too if it wasn’t used. The amount of sugar you use and the OG of the beer without the sugar factored in will determine how dry and thin it will get

 

[BeerFst]

You will be bringing the fg down though.... this is how it depletes the body and drys the beer out. You are raising the og with a 100% fermentable sugar meaning it will be converted purely into alcohol without any complex sugars remaining from it. Pure alcohols gravity is 0.787 which is much lower than water at 1.000 and it will lower the FG and thin it out/dry it out compared too if it wasn’t used. The amount of sugar you use and the OG of the beer without the sugar factored in will determine how dry and thin it will get

@Dgallo based on our other exchanges I’m sure your probably aware but what you are referring to real extract vs apparent extract. A sugar addition will not change the real extract but will change your apparent extract (as measured by your hydrometer).

I suppose one could make an arbitrary ratio of abv to real extract and compare a beer with sugar to one that’s grain only.

that said I think the alcohol provides significant sweetness to a beer independent of fg. despite being 50% oats I had a beer that under actuated to be something like 5.5% and 1.024(apparent extract). It didn’t nearly have the body that a previous 9% stout had that also finished at 1.024.
I think for these beers you need have the real extract in the mid 1.020, which sugar shouldn’t really impact.

all that said, the easy solution is to use malt extract or brewers crystals which are basically sugar but still has some I fermentable a in it

edit: I’m realizing just now I mangled my point and the 9% beer didn’t have the same real extract as the 5.5% so clearly it would be sweeter/more body. But I do think if I’d added some sugar to boost to 6.5-7 it would have improved the perceived body despite the real extract stating the same

 

[Dgallo]

edit: I’m realizing just now I mangled my point and the 9% beer didn’t have the same real extract as the 5.5% so clearly it would be sweeter/more body. But I do think if I’d added some sugar to boost to 6.5-7 it would have improved the perceived body despite the real extract stating the same

Was just going to point that out. However what I am saying is doesn’t really apply to the point your trying to make. What I’m getting at is tht the op can not get the abv he wants due to size constraints with the grain father. He wanted to know if he can use sugar to boost his og so that he hit the abv he wants. What I was informing him on that sure he can use it to get the abv there but this would not produce the same body or mouthfeel of a beer that used grain or DME to reach the same abv. The one done with sugar would be thinner in mouthfeel/body than the latter

 

[Frieds]

Was just going to point that out. However what I am saying is doesn’t really apply to the point your trying to make. What I’m getting at is tht the op can not get the abv he wants due to size constraints with the grain father. He wanted to know if he can use sugar to boost his og so that he hit the abv he wants. What I was informing him on that sure he can use it to get the abv there but this would not produce the same body or mouthfeel of a beer that used grain or DME to reach the same abv. The one done with sugar would be thinner in mouthfeel/body than the latter

Would you substitute dextrose for DME in this style to bump abv but still keep some body?

 

[Dgallo]

Would you substitute dextrose for DME in this style to bump abv but still keep some body?

Exactly what I would do if I was in that situation. Bavarian wheat DME is a good choice because it’s made from 2 parts Pilsner malt and 1 part wheat malt

 

[isomerization]

Anyone used Brewer’s crystals to accomplish a similar thing (as using DME instead of dextrose)? Seems like it would be easier to work with.

https://www.northernbrewer.com/products/brewers-crystals-1-lb

 

[HopsAreGood]

Anyone used Brewer’s crystals to accomplish a similar thing (as using DME instead of dextrose)? Seems like it would be easier to work with.

https://www.northernbrewer.com/products/brewers-crystals-1-lb

Huh...I never knew that existed. I’ve used dextrose and dme to boost abv but this looks like a winner.

 

[Dgallo]

Anyone used Brewer’s crystals to accomplish a similar thing (as using DME instead of dextrose)? Seems like it would be easier to work with.

https://www.northernbrewer.com/products/brewers-crystals-1-lb

That’s an interesting product. I may use that in my next triple ipa to see what happens

 

[isomerization]

Now that I think about it, I believe @couchsending mentioned in the past. I had heard of it then, but haven’t used yet either.

 

[Fewer eyes]

Because everyone seems to be adding lactose to these beers anyway I figured if I need to bump up the alcohol with dextrose I can simply add a bit more lactose to reach my desired fg. Correct me but by my understanding pillowy mouthfeel or whatever you want to call it is largely a result of residual sugars (and to a lesser extent high chloride and maybe particulate from oats in this style?). So does it really matter if some more of the residual sugars are from malt or lactose? At what point would mouthfeel be percievably different if you had a really dry beer, say a pure pilsner malt with an fg of 1.008 that was then jam packed with lactose to bring it up to 1.02 vs an oat cream ipa?

Apologies if this is all a bit basic for this thread, you guys are well above my level!

 

[Noob_Brewer]

Well, I finally took a stab at this recipe (or a variation of it). Shout out to @MrPowers as I took most of his ideas on grain bill, step mash approach, and hop bill for this beer.

Grain Bill:
~48% 2-row
~24% malted oats
~13% flaked oats
~13% white wheat
~3% Carahell
0.5lb of dextrose added to boil

Hops: Columbus (mostly all on hot side) and Galaxy (mostly all on cold side).
Yeast: A24 - this is the first time I really made an attempt to "under" pitch. Pitch rate ended up being 0.62 from brewers friend calcs. Pitched and held at 68 degrees for 24 hrs and then let er rip to 74-75 at the high end. I normally just did the standard 0.75 pitch rates at 72-73ish for A24 prior to this one.

FG finished at 1.013 (8% ABV) and this beer is fantastic! Plenty of tropical sweetness and not dry at all. I love the fuller body and mouthfeel of this and is dangerous because you cannot taste any of the alcohol at all. For the first time - I got a beautiful ester profile of peach! The hydro sample prior to dry hopping a lot of galaxy was easily the best hydro sample I ever had. Took about 2 full weeks for the beer to fully mature and condition due to the 6.75oz of galaxy in the dry hop. This is truly an awesomely smooth tropical/stone fruit extravaganza! One of my favorite beers to date.

 

[Dgallo]

Well, I finally took a stab at this recipe (or a variation of it). Shout out to @MrPowers as I took most of his ideas on grain bill, step mash approach, and hop bill for this beer.

Grain Bill:
~48% 2-row
~24% malted oats
~13% flaked oats
~13% white wheat
~3% Carahell
0.5lb of dextrose added to boil

Hops: Columbus (mostly all on hot side) and Galaxy (mostly all on cold side).
Yeast: A24 - this is the first time I really made an attempt to "under" pitch. Pitch rate ended up being 0.62 from brewers friend calcs. Pitched and held at 68 degrees for 24 hrs and then let er rip to 74-75 at the high end. I normally just did the standard 0.75 pitch rates at 72-73ish for A24 prior to this one.

FG finished at 1.013 (8% ABV) and this beer is fantastic! Plenty of tropical sweetness and not dry at all. I love the fuller body and mouthfeel of this and is dangerous because you cannot taste any of the alcohol at all. For the first time - I got a beautiful ester profile of peach! The hydro sample prior to dry hopping a lot of galaxy was easily the best hydro sample I ever had. Took about 2 full weeks for the beer to fully mature and condition due to the 6.75oz of galaxy in the dry hop. This is truly an awesomely smooth tropical/stone fruit extravaganza! One of my favorite beers to date.

View attachment 689696View attachment 689697

Glad you got the ester profile with A24. Its all about the under pitch and temp drive. It’s awesome man! Beer looks good!

 

[couchsending]

Now that I think about it, I believe @couchsending mentioned in the past. I had heard of it then, but haven’t used yet either.

I’ve used it a handful of times. First saw it mentioned a while ago when Surly used it in Abrasive I believe. Similar sugar profile to malt but without adding more malt flavor. Seen pics of it being used at Treehouse. I don’t really use it anymore and I rarely make beer over 6.5% so I don’t really think it’s necessary. Not sure it makes much sense below an 8% beer personally.

 

[Noob_Brewer]

Glad you got the ester profile with A24. Its all about the under pitch and temp drive. It’s awesome man! Beer looks good!

Thanks man! yes Ive seen your posts about driving A24 for sure. Being new and always overbuilding my yeast starters by 100ml (using brew united) I seem to have always pitched more than anticipated when I enter the data into brewers friend and it tells me the actual pitch rate. For this one, I decided to forgo the overbuilding and just used brewers friend to tell me what I needed to add for DME to get about 0.6 for a pitch rate. Ive also been chickens**t to push the temps high out of fear of the unknown fusels range lol. Nevertheless - I now know what the ester profile of A24 can really be since I tasted the hydrometer sample at FG and prior to dry hopping a lot of galaxy. Honestly at the time, I was fearful that a large galaxy dry hop would overshadow the great ester profile I just achieved. On keg day, it was all galaxy - not really harsh but green for sure - but with conditioning and melowing, the peach ester really shined. No going back on this schedule now! lol.

 

[MrPowers]

Well, I finally took a stab at this recipe (or a variation of it). Shout out to @MrPowers as I took most of his ideas on grain bill, step mash approach, and hop bill for this beer.

Grain Bill:
~48% 2-row
~24% malted oats
~13% flaked oats
~13% white wheat
~3% Carahell
0.5lb of dextrose added to boil

Hops: Columbus (mostly all on hot side) and Galaxy (mostly all on cold side).
Yeast: A24 - this is the first time I really made an attempt to "under" pitch. Pitch rate ended up being 0.62 from brewers friend calcs. Pitched and held at 68 degrees for 24 hrs and then let er rip to 74-75 at the high end. I normally just did the standard 0.75 pitch rates at 72-73ish for A24 prior to this one.

FG finished at 1.013 (8% ABV) and this beer is fantastic! Plenty of tropical sweetness and not dry at all. I love the fuller body and mouthfeel of this and is dangerous because you cannot taste any of the alcohol at all. For the first time - I got a beautiful ester profile of peach! The hydro sample prior to dry hopping a lot of galaxy was easily the best hydro sample I ever had. Took about 2 full weeks for the beer to fully mature and condition due to the 6.75oz of galaxy in the dry hop. This is truly an awesomely smooth tropical/stone fruit extravaganza! One of my favorite beers to date.

View attachment 689696View attachment 689697

I'm glad the grain bill and hop schedule worked out well for you! That looks like a really delicious beer!

I just finally pulled the last two pints of mine last night and it held up really well until the last glass (I naturally carbed with CBC1). I really wouldn't change this grain bill at all for an Oat DIPA. It seems like it is a perfect grain bill to play around with different hops and yeasts!