New England IPA "Northeast" style IPA

[BongoYodeler]

Hoping I’m not coming off condescending at all with my next statement as I don’t mean to at all. But if you use one of those 2 grain bills with proper yeast health for a fermentation and can limit o2 post ferm, you will make a great beer. If theres an issue and the beer doesn’t come out great, we can then begin to dig deeper into yourl process to see what other variables could be an issue.

I’ve made the final table of NHC in 22 & 23 with that exact grainbill (just can’t seem to get any hardware lol ) so I know it works

Making anything better than so-so IPA's have been a tough nut to crack for me, so I'm looking for suggestions on a neipa I'd like to brew next.
@Dgallo and anyone else interested that would like to comment or critique I'm all ears....Here's what I'm thinking.

5 gallon batch neipa, 60 min. mash, 60 min. boil
S/W - Beersmith 3
Mash: 156f
Est OG: 1.070
Est FG: 1.020-ish depending on yeast
Est ibu's: 43.6
Est SRM: 4.4
Est abv: 6.5 - 7.0% depending on yeast

72.22% Pale Malt, 2-Row (Rahr)
16.6% Bestmalz Spelt Malt
5.56% Oats, Flaked
5.56% Oats, Malted (Thomas Fawcett)

Hot side hops: 20 ibu's Citra T90

Whirlpool/Hopstand:
1.5oz Nectaron
1.5oz Superdelic or Bru-1
3.0oz Citra lupomax

Dry Hop:
2.5oz Nectaron
2.5oz Superdelic or Bru-1
5.0oz Citra T90

Yeast options:
Dry - Verdant, CS Hazy, Ponoma
Wet - 1318 (maybe)

Water profile (distilled):
Calcium 97ppm
Sodium 67ppm
Chloride 207ppm
Magnesium 3ppm
Sulfate 107ppm

A couple things I'm unsure of....

For the grain bill in addition to spelt, flaked oats or better to go with oat malt + flaked oats? Would it matter?

For the 20 minute hop addition is a single hop ok, or would it be better to combine a couple different hops for better depth of flavor?

Hop amounts look ok?
Water profile look ok?
Anything else?

 

[beervoid]

Making anything better than so-so IPA's have been a tough nut to crack for me, so I'm looking for suggestions on a neipa I'd like to brew next.
@Dgallo and anyone else interested that would like to comment or critique I'm all ears....Here's what I'm thinking.

5 gallon batch neipa, 60 min. mash, 60 min. boil
S/W - Beersmith 3
Mash: 156f
Est OG: 1.070
Est FG: 1.020-ish depending on yeast
Est ibu's: 43.6
Est SRM: 4.4
Est abv: 6.5 - 7.0% depending on yeast

72.22% Pale Malt, 2-Row (Rahr)
16.6% Bestmalz Spelt Malt
5.56% Oats, Flaked
5.56% Oats, Malted (Thomas Fawcett)

Hot side hops: 20 ibu's Citra T90

Whirlpool/Hopstand:
1.5oz Nectaron
1.5oz Superdelic or Bru-1
3.0oz Citra lupomax

Dry Hop:
2.5oz Nectaron
2.5oz Superdelic or Bru-1
5.0oz Citra T90

Yeast options:
Dry - Verdant, CS Hazy, Ponoma
Wet - 1318 (maybe)

Water profile (distilled):
Calcium 97ppm
Sodium 67ppm
Chloride 207ppm
Magnesium 3ppm
Sulfate 107ppm

A couple things I'm unsure of....

For the grain bill in addition to spelt, flaked oats or better to go with oat malt + flaked oats? Would it matter?

For the 20 minute hop addition is a single hop ok, or would it be better to combine a couple different hops for better depth of flavor?

Hop amounts look ok?
Water profile look ok?
Anything else?

Go for 8% see how much more hop saturation you get. Im not a fan of nectaron it can bring diesel which clashes in a hazy.
Pomona will override your hops with it's strong esters ime.

 

[BongoYodeler]

Go for 8% see how much more hop saturation you get. Im not a fan of nectaron it can bring diesel which clashes in a hazy.
Pomona will override your hops with it's strong esters ime.

Well I’m not a big fan of diesel flavor. I’ve seen some folks mention it but others don’t. Not sure if I should use it now, but I have a half pound of it that I’d like to use somehow, somewhere.

 

[DevilsCups]

Well I’m not a big fan of diesel flavor. I’ve seen some folks mention it but others don’t. Not sure if I should use it now, but I have a half pound of it that I’d like to use somehow, somewhere.

I've had some excellent Nectaron beers, but I do tend to like the dank/diesel notes. Other Half recently did a run of Mosaic+Nectaron and it was pretty stinky, but I appreciate it.

I've brewed with Nectaron at the brewery in the past, and in some collabs with Marlowe as well. Not sure where those hops were sourced (we used that and Pink, I believe), but it was nowhere near diesel. Very tropical forward. YMMV, is what I'm trying to say I guess lol.

 

[Dgallo]

Making anything better than so-so IPA's have been a tough nut to crack for me, so I'm looking for suggestions on a neipa I'd like to brew next.
@Dgallo and anyone else interested that would like to comment or critique I'm all ears....Here's what I'm thinking.

5 gallon batch neipa, 60 min. mash, 60 min. boil
S/W - Beersmith 3
Mash: 156f
Est OG: 1.070
Est FG: 1.020-ish depending on yeast
Est ibu's: 43.6
Est SRM: 4.4
Est abv: 6.5 - 7.0% depending on yeast

72.22% Pale Malt, 2-Row (Rahr)
16.6% Bestmalz Spelt Malt
5.56% Oats, Flaked
5.56% Oats, Malted (Thomas Fawcett)

Hot side hops: 20 ibu's Citra T90

Whirlpool/Hopstand:
1.5oz Nectaron
1.5oz Superdelic or Bru-1
3.0oz Citra lupomax

Dry Hop:
2.5oz Nectaron
2.5oz Superdelic or Bru-1
5.0oz Citra T90

Yeast options:
Dry - Verdant, CS Hazy, Ponoma
Wet - 1318 (maybe)

Water profile (distilled):
Calcium 97ppm
Sodium 67ppm
Chloride 207ppm
Magnesium 3ppm
Sulfate 107ppm

A couple things I'm unsure of....

For the grain bill in addition to spelt, flaked oats or better to go with oat malt + flaked oats? Would it matter?

For the 20 minute hop addition is a single hop ok, or would it be better to combine a couple different hops for better depth of flavor?

Hop amounts look ok?
Water profile look ok?
Anything else?

Everything looks fine to me personally. As mentioned, nectaron has been quite diesel forward the past few years but I do like it.

If diesel notes aren’t your thing, I would just remove it from the dryhop and split the dryhop Superdelic/citra

For yeast choice, I’d stick with London ale III. If you’re trying to really nail the style it’s the best choice for targeting the style guidelines . Once your neipas improve to where you’re really happy with them, then start switching some variable until you get the beer that you love

 

[BongoYodeler]

I've had some excellent Nectaron beers, but I do tend to like the dank/diesel notes. Other Half recently did a run of Mosaic+Nectaron and it was pretty stinky, but I appreciate it.

I've brewed with Nectaron at the brewery in the past, and in some collabs with Marlowe as well. Not sure where those hops were sourced (we used that and Pink, I believe), but it was nowhere near diesel. Very tropical forward. YMMV, is what I'm trying to say I guess lol.

Thanks. I’ll have to rethink this.

 

[Ulisses4677]

Well I’m not a big fan of diesel flavor. I’ve seen some folks mention it but others don’t. Not sure if I should use it now, but I have a half pound of it that I’d like to use somehow, somewhere.

Use it in the whirlpool it’s awesome. If you wish to use it in the dry hop keep it under 20% and no more than 2/3 days of contact time.

 

[BongoYodeler]

Everything looks fine to me personally. As mentioned, nectaron has been quite diesel forward the past few years but I do like it.

If diesel notes aren’t your thing, I would just remove it from the dryhop and split the dryhop Superdelic/citra

For yeast choice, I’d stick with London ale III. If you’re trying to really nail the style it’s the best choice for targeting the style guidelines . Once your neipas improve to where you’re really happy with them, then start switching some variable until you get the beer that you love

Thanks man. Do you think the Nectaron would throw less diesel in the hop stand? If so I can leave it in there and just remove it from the dry hop. But I’ll remove it entirely if it gives diesel even in the hop stand.

I also have a half pound of Bru-1, as well as some Bru-1 Spectrum I have available. So I can also go with any combination of Citra, Superdelic, or Bru-1.

1318 would definitely be my first choice if my LHBS decides to reorder liquid yeast. For the past 3 weeks 25 of the 30 liquid yeasts he normally stocks are showing sold out. I may bite the bullet and order online from Williams. If I time the order right I can usually have delivery in 3-4 days. Not ideal but might work this time of year.

 

[Dgallo]

Thanks man. Do you think the Nectaron would throw less diesel in the hop stand? If so I can leave it in there and just remove it from the dry hop. But I’ll remove it entirely if it gives diesel even in the hop stand.

I also have a half pound of Bru-1, as well as some Bru-1 Spectrum I have available. So I can also go with any combination of Citra, Superdelic, or Bru-1.

1318 would definitely be my first choice if my LHBS decides to reorder liquid yeast. For the past 3 weeks 25 of the 30 liquid yeasts he normally stocks are showing sold out. I may bite the bullet and order online from Williams. If I time the order right I can usually have delivery in 3-4 days. Not ideal but might work this time of year.

I’ve never had diesel make it through fermentation and have only picked it out after a dryhop. I wouldn’t worry about it but if switching it out makes you more comfortable, go that route

 

[BongoYodeler]

I’ve never had diesel make it through fermentation and have only picked it out after a dryhop. I wouldn’t worry about it but if switching it out makes you more comfortable, go that route

Thanks.

 

[tracer bullet]

Hmm! My next brew was going to have Mosaic, Superdelic and Nectaron. At the time it sounded like a fun combination. I would not like any diesel in this beer however (I'm good with it in some beers, but not this one). What would be a good sub? I wondered about Idaho 7 perhaps, or of course there's always Citra.

 

[anteater8]

What's the consensus on the most exciting new hops these days? Here's a few that I've been hearing more about but don't know a ton about.

• Superdelic
• Bru-1
• Anchovy
• Nectaron

 

[Dgallo]

What's the consensus on the most exciting new hops these days? Here's a few that I've been hearing more about but don't know a ton about.

• Superdelic
• Bru-1
• Anchovy
• Nectaron

Id only really consider anchovy and superdelic new hops. Both of those are really cool. I haven’t used either personally yet but have had some beers from breweries and high quality homebrewers that have use them and they were really cool.

I like nectaron more in west coast IPAs and it plays very well there but it can also be used well in hazies but I prefer it more restrained and as a supportive hop

I can’t get lucky with bru1, all I ever get from hit is earthy/dirt. Some people have had great success so I just might be unlucky

 

[anteater8]

Id only really consider anchovy and superdelic new hops. Both of those are really cool. I haven’t used either personally yet but have had some beers from breweries and high quality homebrewers that have use them and they were really cool.

I like nectaron more in west coast IPAs and it plays very well there but it can also be used well in hazies but I prefer it more restrained and as a supportive hop

I can’t get lucky with bru1, all I ever get from hit is earthy/dirt. Some people have had great success so I just might be unlucky

Good to know. I'm pretty excited about Anchovy. I've had it in hazies from Brujos (Anchovy/Citra/Mosaic) and Other Half (Citra/Nelson/Anchovy/Motueka) and both were really great.

 

[Adam Zerwick]

Any recommendations on ratios for whirlpool and dry hop for a 7% NEIPA for the following combos:

Citra/Nelson
Citra/Nelson/Nectaron

I also have Riwaka, Strata, Mosaic, Galaxy, HBC386 I can throw in the mix.

 

[Dgallo]

Any recommendations on ratios for whirlpool and dry hop for a 7% NEIPA for the following combos:

Citra/Nelson
Citra/Nelson/Nectaron

I also have Riwaka, Strata, Mosaic, Galaxy, HBC386 I can throw in the mix.

Citra Nelson and riwaka is probably my favorite hop combo.

I’d whirlpool riwaka and citra 1:1

Dryhop ratio is all about what you want. I like a bit more citra so I’d do 2:1:1 citra, Nelson, riwaka but any ratio will work so accentuate the character you like most

 

[DevilsCups]

Good to know. I'm pretty excited about Anchovy.

Me too! John Segal actually lives in my town and I've been wanting to chat with him about it next time I see him around.

 

[LumberZach]

Has anyone ever used Krush (HBC 586) in the WP? Looking at the Hop Survivable Chart, Krush is the 4th highest. If you have, what did it bring to the table? I got a half pound of it from YVH and was planning on using it in the WP and in DH.

 

[beervoid]

Has anyone ever used Krush (HBC 586) in the WP? Looking at the Hop Survivable Chart, Krush is the 4th highest. If you have, what did it bring to the table? I got a half pound of it from YVH and was planning on using it in the WP and in DH.

Not a fan, tastes kind of artificial candy to me, would use it as a supporter

 

[Dgallo]

Has anyone ever used Krush (HBC 586) in the WP? Looking at the Hop Survivable Chart, Krush is the 4th highest. If you have, what did it bring to the table? I got a half pound of it from YVH and was planning on using it in the WP and in DH.

I haven’t used it personally since the name change but had a lot of beers with it. I like it a lot. Like every hop, it will pair well with citra. I actually had a beer recently that was 1019, citra, and krush and it was dynamite. Big citrus and berry with the lime and coconut cream.

 

[anteater8]

I thought a survey about hazy IPA brewing practices and preferences might be interesting for this passionate group of brewers. If you'd like to take it, I will share the results in a week or so! There is no personal information collected.

Hazy IPA brewing survey:
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1...NpC_BjwWp8n0ePWljEQwiyTrA/viewform?usp=dialog

 

[BongoYodeler]

I have some Krush in the freezer but yet to use any. Pretty sure I didn't use it as 586 either. I'll probably brew a basic pale ale and combine it with Citra as a way to check it out.

 

[DrGMG]

I thought a survey about hazy IPA brewing practices and preferences might be interesting for this passionate group of brewers. If you'd like to take it, I will share the results in a week or so! There is no personal information collected.

Hazy IPA brewing survey:
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1...NpC_BjwWp8n0ePWljEQwiyTrA/viewform?usp=dialog

Cool survey.

 

[LCBA]

I thought a survey about hazy IPA brewing practices and preferences might be interesting for this passionate group of brewers. If you'd like to take it, I will share the results in a week or so! There is no personal information collected.

Hazy IPA brewing survey:
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1...NpC_BjwWp8n0ePWljEQwiyTrA/viewform?usp=dialog

Filled it out

 

[anteater8]

Cool survey.

16 responses so far and really interesting data, I'm excited to share!

 

[tracer bullet]

I'm really interested in the results but haven't made enough of them to participate. Please do share them afterwards, of course.

 

[anteater8]

It’s all preference. But the warmer the temperature, the more active the yeast. This will increase your hopburn risk due to the hop creep that will occur to some extent at room temp. You also could experience muted hop character by adding dryhops with the yeast still present.

If I were going to dryhop in a serving keg my process would be the following;
1) after fermentation is complete and FG is stable, I would crash down to 50*f for 48hr (fulll 2 days once 50*f is met)
2) liquid purge serving keg that has a floating diptube installed.
3) load hops while running co2 down the liquid post of keg.
4) close up keg and do 1 or 2 purge cycles (for insurance) and then pressurize the keg to make sure it holds.
5) once beer is crashed in the fv, close transfer it into the preloaded and purged serving keg.
6) keep that keg around 50*f for 36 hours, inverting the keg every 8 hours or so.
7) then pit keg in the kegerator hooked up to gas to crash and carb up

Do you serve out of your dry hop keg, or do a second jump to a serving keg?

 

[Dgallo]

Do you serve out of your dry hop keg, or do a second jump to a serving keg?

I transfer to a serving keg. I actually don’t dryhop in a keg, I use a modified fermonster but same principle. I just can’t stand the loss in kegs and I want to yield a full keg into the kegerator

 

[anteater8]

I transfer to a serving keg. I actually don’t dryhop in a keg, I use a modified fermonster but same principle. I just can’t stand the loss in kegs and I want to yield a full keg into the kegerator

Makes a lot of sense, thanks. I'm still going back and forth on a dedicated dry hop vessel and this gives me more to consider.

 

[anteater8]

The results are in! Thanks to the 26 people who took my survey. This has been a lot of fun for me, and I hope it ends up being useful or at least interesting to others.

Some initial thoughts...

• Imperial Juice/wy1318 reigns supreme
• Citra reigns supreme (honorable mention to Nelson)
• Our whirlpool/dry hop amounts, O.G., F.G. & ABV vary quite a bit (makes sense according to preference)
• Almost everyone is soft crashing before dry hopping
• Almost everyone is dry hopping below 60 degrees for 3 days or less

I also did a little bit of analysis with the raw data (I had to average the ranges)...

There is obviously a correlation between more total hops when F.G., O.G. and ABV are higher, but not quite as strong as I would have expected.

The last thing I noticed is about those who use a separate vessel for their dry hop. In general they use more total WP +DH hops (17 oz vs. 13.8 oz), higher O.G. (1.075 vs. 1.067), higher F.G. (1.020 vs. 1.014), and higher ABV (7.7% vs. 7.1%). They also almost exclusively use Pilsner as the base malt. I interpret this as putting more effort into trying to chase the top tier, more extreme beers like Brujos & Fidens.