Lager Yeast Experiment: S-23 vs. Wyeast 2124

[passedpawn]

To close the loop, I've settled on Wyeast Munich Pilsner as my best lager yeast. Wyeast 2308.

Well, haha.

I pretty clearly remember going to the local brew store and picking up a couple of these 2308's that were nearly expired. I smacked them, they did NOTHING, pitched them into my new lager wort, again no activity. That's when I decided to find a dry yeast that worked well. And thus S-189.

 

[odie]

doing a Czech pils right now. I have S-23....actually it's all I have for lager yeast...I'm out of 34/70 which I've used with good results on numerous lagers...

will see what comes of it

 

[rtstrider]

doing a Czech pils right now. I have S-23....actually it's all I have for lager yeast...I'm out of 34/70 which I've used with good results on numerous lagers...

will see what comes of it

I was able to compare these two yeasts side by side a few weeks ago. S-23 was fermented around 55F at a microbrewery and w34/70 was fermented by me around 64F. No off flavors from the warm ferment. What we noted is S-23 brought out the malt a good bit more than w34/70. That's about it. So if you're brewing a lager where you want the malt to come out a bit more I'd say try S-23! Other thing they noticed is there was a bit of diacetyl (VERY minimal and barely detectable) with S-23 so pay attention and get a good D rest in. They rose the temp when the fermentation was already done.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Other thing they noticed is there was a bit of diacetyl (VERY minimal and barely detectable) with S-23 so pay attention and get a good D rest in. They rose the temp when the fermentation was already done.

Given that the origins of S-23 seems to lie in Urquell, a bit of diacetyl would be "authentic"...

 

[odie]

good to know on the S-23....I do like Urquell. The recipe is actually a clone that I found. But there seem to be several clone recipes of that beer.

 

[EarlyAmateurZymurgist]

Given that the origins of S-23 seems to lie in Urquell, a bit of diacetyl would be "authentic"...

I have used a lot of yeast cultures over the last 28 years and nothing has ever come close to the signature yeast character found in Pilsner Urquell (PU) as S-23. I am not even fan of dry yeast. I maintained my own yeast bank that I plated and kept on slants for most of the time that I have been brewing, but my most recent batch of Bo Pils that on which I decided to give S-23 a shot is about as close to PU as I have ever gotten. When used correctly, S-23 allows subtle flavors to shine through that are stripped out pr masked by most other lager cultures. The beer has that slighty fruity, herbal, freshly mown hay aroma and taste that PU has when it is fresh. S-23 may not be neutral enough to use a general purpose lager culture, but it excels when used to make Bo Pils. I would even use it on a Pre-Pro Pils.

 

[passedpawn]

I have used a lot of yeast cultures over the last 28 years and nothing has ever come close to the signature yeast character found in Pilsner Urquell (PU) as S-23. I am not even fan of dry yeast. I maintained my own yeast bank that I plated and kept on slants for most of the time that I have been brewing, but my most recent batch of Bo Pils that on which I decided to give S-23 a shot is about as close to PU as I have ever gotten. When used correctly, S-23 allows subtle flavors to shine through that are stripped out pr masked by most other lager cultures. The beer has that slighty fruity, herbal, freshly mown hay aroma and taste that PU has when it is fresh. S-23 may not be neutral enough to use a general purpose lager culture, but it excels when used to make Bo Pils. I would even use it on a Pre-Pro Pils.

Might be right for a bo pils. I haven't made one it a while.

Glad to see this thread bumped. I needed to come in here and update that my new "goto" german pilsner yeast is now S-189.

 

[Protos]

Let me share my dry Lager yeasts preferences too.
I use S-23 in historical Austro-Hungarian styles, like Bohemian and Wiener Lagers. I believe the slightly fruity and lower-attenuating S-23 is the closest dry strain to the yeasts they used locally.
M84, said to be similar to S-23, I tried only once. It gave a weird soapy off-flavour. Most probably it was my fault, not yeast's. Haven't brewed with it since.
For crisper low-to-midstrength German, Dutch and Danish Lagers I used to employ W34/70 but then dropped it and now I use M76. I've had no problems or off-flavours with W34, just felt it didn't fit the style. W34 Lagers just tasted "fake" and "non-Lagery" to me, whatever's the grist and the process. I'm totally satisfied now with how M76 works.
I tried brewing light Lagers with S-189 as well but wasn't impressed too much: it looked to me like the yeast was overattenuating and producing too watery Lagers. I use it now in my strong Lagers, where I prefer it over all other dry strains. To me, it works superior in all my Bockbiers, strong Bieres de Garde and Malt Liquors in the wein of Carlsberg Elefant. Now I'm fermenting a Samichlaus with it, hoping to coax it into fermenting up to 14% ABV.

 

[friarsmith]

For almost 20 years:
*34/70 has been my go-to for Schwarzbier & Dunkel. Never had the clove etc issues noted above, but I generally discard after 3-4 generations.
*IO Harvest & other Munich strains for Bock/Helles
*WLP 802 for all things Czech
*WLP 840 & 940 for Amercian & Mexican Lagers (they’re almost interchangeable IMO)

Haven’t strayed much from this for lagers because they make me feel warm & fuzzy. Will have to try S-23. I guess I’ve shied away from it after reading all the “fruity” reports.

 

[thefigure5]

I have used a lot of yeast cultures over the last 28 years and nothing has ever come close to the signature yeast character found in Pilsner Urquell (PU) as S-23. I am not even fan of dry yeast. I maintained my own yeast bank that I plated and kept on slants for most of the time that I have been brewing, but my most recent batch of Bo Pils that on which I decided to give S-23 a shot is about as close to PU as I have ever gotten. When used correctly, S-23 allows subtle flavors to shine through that are stripped out pr masked by most other lager cultures. The beer has that slighty fruity, herbal, freshly mown hay aroma and taste that PU has when it is fresh. S-23 may not be neutral enough to use a general purpose lager culture, but it excels when used to make Bo Pils. I would even use it on a Pre-Pro Pils.

I have a packet of S-23 and want to make a Bohemian Pilsner next. @EarlyAmateurZymurgist ... Could you share your BoPils/S-23 recipe?

 

[EarlyAmateurZymurgist]

It is nothing fancy. I used 91% Avanguard Pilsner malt and 9% Weyerman CaraHell in the grist. I bittered to 38 IBUs using all Czech Saaz. Bo Pils is a simple beer ingredients-wise. The yeast signature is part of the flavor. Ferment S-23 @54F/12C for five days before performing a diacetyl rest. With a beer this simple any fermentation off-flavors are going to show through like a sore thumb.

 

[thefigure5]

It is nothing fancy. I used 91% Avanguard Pilsner malt and 9% Weyerman CaraHell in the grist. I bittered to 38 IBUs using all Czech Saaz. Bo Pils is a simple beer ingredients-wise. The yeast signature is part of the flavor. Ferment S-23 @54F/12C for five days before performing a diacetyl rest. With a beer this simple any fermentation off-flavors are going to show through like a sore thumb.

Thanks for posting this. I'll keep it in mind. I'm thinking to try 95% Pilsner malt and 5% carapils, all Czech Saaz possibly at a higher IBU level, and S-23 yeast.

 

[jerrylotto]

A friend of mine who makes some wonderful pilsner's recommended White Labs WLP800 as his go to Czech lager yeast.