KVEIK: worthy of being a house strain?

[Djangotet]

As laid out in the title, I am living in an apartment and I have been using my fridge with temp control for brewing. I basically eat foods that need light or no refrigeration but I love the hobby so this is what I do lol. My question is, is there a Kveik strain actually good enough to make competition grade beers? If so what is the best type in your opinion? Would I be missing something if I brew with only Kveik? Thank you!

 

[AlexKay]

I'm not sure I see the point. There are other yeasts that behave pretty well without temperature control: Nottingham, say, or W34/70. What kind of beers are you hoping to make?

 

[Djangotet]

I'm not sure I see the point. There are other yeasts that behave pretty well without temperature control: Nottingham, say, or W34/70. What kind of beers are you hoping to make?

Well I’ve heard that temp control really makes a difference in quality. The steady temp prevents off flavors. I guess my question would be, is it possible to create great beer at room temp? I live in southern California so it’s normally between 70-80. I always see temperature control as one of the top things new brewers can do to improve their beer. Thanks!

 

[Djangotet]

I'm not sure I see the point. There are other yeasts that behave pretty well without temperature control: Nottingham, say, or W34/70. What kind of beers are you hoping to make?

All kinds of beer btw. I like making Scottish ales, English ales, NEIPAs, and I want to make stouts. Mostly I prefer ales so I’m not worried about lagers.

 

[seatazzz]

For your lighter ales (not hoppy), Omega Lutra is a good choice. Ferments clean, does best at 75-85°, and doesn't usually contribute esters. I make a fantastic blonde ale with it that turns out crisp and clean every time. For IPAs, particularly NEIPA, Imperial Loki throws a LOT of pineapple/stone fruit esters at high temperatures that contribute well to the fruity hops usually used. Lallemand also has a dry Kveik that is pretty much the same thing as Voss, if you don't like using liquid yeast. I don't make many dark beers, and have not used a kveik strain in one; but if I were to try one with a kveik strain I would go with the Lutra. I think the lack of esters would give the darker malts more room to shine.

 

[Djangotet]

For your lighter ales (not hoppy), Omega Lutra is a good choice. Ferments clean, does best at 75-85°, and doesn't usually contribute esters. I make a fantastic blonde ale with it that turns out crisp and clean every time. For IPAs, particularly NEIPA, Imperial Loki throws a LOT of pineapple/stone fruit esters at high temperatures that contribute well to the fruity hops usually used. Lallemand also has a dry Kveik that is pretty much the same thing as Voss, if you don't like using liquid yeast. I don't make many dark beers, and have not used a kveik strain in one; but if I were to try one with a kveik strain I would go with the Lutra. I think the lack of esters would give the darker malts more room to shine.

So my house temp is already usually about 70. It would be really easy for me to buy a heat mat and just keep them at the higher end. I want to build a signature flavor for all my beers so that my friends will see my brewing as unique and trademark. I think a good place to start would be the yeast. My question is, does Kveik yeast leave telltale flavors that are generally undesired? I’ve heard that it can leave weird mouthfeels or that it might cause some rough flavors. I would almost rather use an ale yeast that ferments between 50-60 degrees because my fridge would turn on and I can use my freezer as a fridge. Do you have a suggestion for a flavorful yeast that can be used for many styles but mostly APA, IPA, and like maybe blondes at that lower temp range? I know I have a weird situation but luckily as long as I can trigger my fridge by having it 10 below 70 degrees, my freezer ends up around 38-40 degrees.

 

[seatazzz]

Most ale yeasts do best between 60-66°. For a good all-around ale yeast, either Safale S-05 or Lallemand Nottingham are both clean-fermenting yeasts that do well in that range, and leave almost no esters. Nottingham can even do well in the lower range, producing an almost lager-like beer. I like to suggest kveik strains for new brewers who don't have reliable temperature control; kveik yeast, to me, is the equivalent of that guy who says 'don't worry, I got this' and proceeds to completely renovate your house with nothing but a screwdriver and some WD-40. It is the most forgiving of all the yeasts out there, and new strains are coming out all the time.

If you plan on fermenting at room temperature (keeping in mind that ALL yeasts will raise the temperature of your beer with the heat generated by the yeast itself) I would suggest starting with Lallemand Kveik (Voss). For example; let's say your ambient room temperature is 70°. You chill your wort to 70°, and pitch your yeast. Once it gets going, that temperature can get up to 78° or higher, depending on factors such as yeast viability, starting gravity, changing room temperature, stage of the moon, etc (just kidding with the moon). This is where you can get into trouble with yeasts that have a tighter temperature range; too high, and you'll get weird esters. Too low, and the yeast may stall out. In my experience, kveik doesn't do great at the lower end of the range; it was bred specifically to handle higher temperatures. So once again, let's say that you pitch your yeast at 70°, using a kveik strain; it will usually take off fast and furious, raising the temperature to 78° or higher, and it's basically in yeast heaven. The bonus here, is that your beer will be done FAST; krausen will form quickly, and drop within 3-4 days. Kveik needs to clean up after the massive party it just threw, just like most other yeasts; but it almost always drops clean.

As you can tell from this TL;DR, I am a BIG fan of kveik; if I'd had access to it when I started brewing 6 years ago I would have had a LOT more good beers under my belt.

 

[Djangotet]

Most ale yeasts do best between 60-66°. For a good all-around ale yeast, either Safale S-05 or Lallemand Nottingham are both clean-fermenting yeasts that do well in that range, and leave almost no esters. Nottingham can even do well in the lower range, producing an almost lager-like beer. I like to suggest kveik strains for new brewers who don't have reliable temperature control; kveik yeast, to me, is the equivalent of that guy who says 'don't worry, I got this' and proceeds to completely renovate your house with nothing but a screwdriver and some WD-40. It is the most forgiving of all the yeasts out there, and new strains are coming out all the time.

If you plan on fermenting at room temperature (keeping in mind that ALL yeasts will raise the temperature of your beer with the heat generated by the yeast itself) I would suggest starting with Lallemand Kveik (Voss). For example; let's say your ambient room temperature is 70°. You chill your wort to 70°, and pitch your yeast. Once it gets going, that temperature can get up to 78° or higher, depending on factors such as yeast viability, starting gravity, changing room temperature, stage of the moon, etc (just kidding with the moon). This is where you can get into trouble with yeasts that have a tighter temperature range; too high, and you'll get weird esters. Too low, and the yeast may stall out. In my experience, kveik doesn't do great at the lower end of the range; it was bred specifically to handle higher temperatures. So once again, let's say that you pitch your yeast at 70°, using a kveik strain; it will usually take off fast and furious, raising the temperature to 78° or higher, and it's basically in yeast heaven. The bonus here, is that your beer will be done FAST; krausen will form quickly, and drop within 3-4 days. Kveik needs to clean up after the massive party it just threw, just like most other yeasts; but it almost always drops clean.

As you can tell from this TL;DR, I am a BIG fan of kveik; if I'd had access to it when I started brewing 6 years ago I would have had a LOT more good beers under my belt.

Thank you for your advice, I really appreciate it!

 

[Protos]

Would I be missing something if I brew with only Kveik?

You'll be missing every style that isn't Norwegian Farmhouse. People try Kveik yeasts in many styles (I did too). Many get decent brews with it - decent brews which are completely out of any style because Kveik yeasts are characterful, they add their unique Kveiky twang to each beer making your Porter, IPA, Bitter etc. just another version of the same Norwegian Farmhouse ale. In the beginning, it's fun then you get bored with the monotony and grow to hate the twang. I did.

Don't limit yourself to just a single yeast. And if you're absolutely pressed to, choose the least characterful strains, like Nottingham or Chico. With them, you can get into the flavour ballpark of much more beer styles than with Kveiks.

 

[Djangotet]

You'll be missing every style that isn't Norwegian Farmhouse. People try Kveik yeasts in many styles (I did too). Many get decent brews with it - decent brews which are completely out of any style because Kveik yeasts are characterful, they add their unique Kveiky twang to each beer making your Porter, IPA, Bitter etc. just another version of the same Norwegian Farmhouse ale. In the beginning, it's fun then you get bored with the monotony and grow to hate the twang. I did.

Don't limit yourself to just a single yeast. And if you're absolutely pressed to, choose the least characterful strains, like Nottingham or Chico. With them, you can get into the flavour ballpark of much more beer styles than with Kveiks.

To be honest I’m actually thinking of starting my own stock of London Fog Ale because it works great in all of the styles I like. Also I think it’s a unique flavor that I can hopefully develop over time by keeping and maintaining a large sanitary starter that I will continuously repopulate with DME. The idea of making a bunch of small beers is exciting to me and it just gives me a chance to do what I love more. Over time I may develop something truly unique!

 

[wepeeler]

To be honest I’m actually thinking of starting my own stock of London Fog Ale because it works great in all of the styles I like. Also I think it’s a unique flavor that I can hopefully develop over time by keeping and maintaining a large sanitary starter that I will continuously repopulate with DME. The idea of making a bunch of small beers is exciting to me and it just gives me a chance to do what I love more. Over time I may develop something truly unique!

I would stick with London Fog and skip Kviek altogether.

 

[Miraculix]

You'll be missing every style that isn't Norwegian Farmhouse. People try Kveik yeasts in many styles (I did too). Many get decent brews with it - decent brews which are completely out of any style because Kveik yeasts are characterful, they add their unique Kveiky twang to each beer making your Porter, IPA, Bitter etc. just another version of the same Norwegian Farmhouse ale. In the beginning, it's fun then you get bored with the monotony and grow to hate the twang. I did.

Don't limit yourself to just a single yeast. And if you're absolutely pressed to, choose the least characterful strains, like Nottingham or Chico. With them, you can get into the flavour ballpark of much more beer styles than with Kveiks.

This!

Try lutra, and try Nottingham, then decide for yourself.

 

[Djangotet]

I would stick with London Fog and skip Kviek altogether.

Yeah I’m gonna keep 2 Erlenmeyer flasks. I’ll make a double sized starter and I’ll pitch half into my first beer. Then I will pitch the other half into a second flask filled with wort and nutrients making a new starter.

Every time I brew, I will essentially be transferring healthy yeast into a brand new sanitized flask. I’ll just leave the fermented starter wort on top and decant when I brew next so that the alcohol can protect it. I think spraying the foam top with starsan once in a while will protect from infection.

The end goal isn’t just saving money but I hope the yeast will change over time into something unique.

 

[Zambezi Special]

I think you are putting too many limitations on this hobby.
I would make as many different beers as possible, with different yeasts and different hops and only then decide on a specific style (although I don't understand why you want to brew only one style)

 

[Ninoid]

LalBrew Belle Saison worked well for me. In both winter and summer, without temperature regulation, I made a lot of good beers with it. If you use only malt and hops, without spices, it gives quite clean flavors. Not as lager yeast or US-05, but I was happy with all the beers. Even my stout with it was better than US-05. I used it at ambient temperatures from 20'C to 32'C and got good beer every time. I've tried Voss Kveik several times (I can't get other types of Kveik easily in my country) and I don't like its strong citrus character. It was only good for APA/IPA and that when it ferments above 30'C, which means only a few summer months and only for one style of beer, while I work with Belle Saison all year round.

Try the Belle Saison. M29 is not bad either, but it has a stronger clove character and a much smaller temperature range.

 

[Beermeister32]

I’ve used Hornindal on IPA’s with good results. The esters it produces goes right along with IPAs.

 

[hottpeper13]

I like the "C" hopped beers with an Amarillo whirlpool and the Voss Kveik gives me a outstanding IPA of 6%-7% in 3 weeks. 1 week in primary at 86*,kegged then 2 weeks in the lagerator at 33* on CO2. I just get citrus and some pithiness I quite enjoy. Others enjoyed it at Teach a Buddy to Brew day Nov 5th as only 4 pints remained.
When the IPA kicked I put on the RIS I made on 11/20/20 that sat in a whisky barrel for 8 months (my Black Friday release). This one had an OG of 1.102 and finished at 1.016 with a repitch of Voss at 1/3 the yeast cake in each fermenter,was a 16 gal brew day with my high gravity procedure. I thought if I got some of the orange everybody claims it would mesh with the chocolate,but no orange.
Voss is my goto IPA yeast and is 1 of 5 strains I bank.

 

[jcfontario]

I have had good results when using Kveik Voss in an APA. To complement the citrus flavors that the yeast gives at higher temperatures, I use it with Citra hops and it makes a very drinkable beer - probably one of my more consistent brews. I pitch the yeast at 95 F, so I don't cool the wort down too much after the boil , and then let the temperature drift down after fermentation is complete. The yeast goes like a firecracker and is usually done in about 2 days, but I leave it in the primary for 10 to 14 days and that seems to take any rough edges off it. Two more weeks for bottle conditioning and then it is ready to drink. In fact, I am just having one right now.

 

[Bobby_M]

I've experimented with several Kviek strains and tasted at least a dozen other Kviek fermented beers from brewers I know to be very successful and I'm not in love with the flavors. It's not exactly the same across all strains but it varies from a grainy, sulfur, and black pepper thing.

 

[Djangotet]

I've experimented with several Kviek strains and tasted at least a dozen other Kviek fermented beers from brewers I know to be very successful and I'm not in love with the flavors. It's not exactly the same across all strains but it varies from a grainy, sulfur, and black pepper thing.

I’ve heard this too, I think it’s a nice backup for when you run out of space but I’m gonna stick with London Fog Ale

 

[JoeSpartaNJ]

I have only used the Lalbrew Voss Kveik in a handful of beers, either pale ale or IPA. All the beers came out decent, but all had that signature over bearing citrus note. I now only use that yeast in the dead of summer.

Although I have been wanting to try it on a darker non hop forward beer.

 

[Djangotet]

I have only used the Lalbrew Voss Kveik in a handful of beers, either pale ale or IPA. All the beers came out decent, but all had that signature over bearing citrus note. I now only use that yeast in the dead of summer.

Although I have been wanting to try it on a darker non hop forward beer.

If I were to use this I would get a heat mat or like you said, wait till summer

 

[chthon]

Some yeasts I had good results with on high temperatures (summer, well, hot spring) are MJ M29 Belgian Ale (saison, but also usable for other Belgian styles) and MJ M20 Bavarian wheat yeast. And you can not only brew simple weizen with M20, but also dunkelweizen, weizenbock and if you have to time to let it drop clear before bottling, a nice Leffe clone.

 

[Protos]

Although I have been wanting to try it on a darker non hop forward beer.

That's actually THE kind of beer all Kveik yeasts have been originally selected for. Specifically for this one and for nothing else.
Typical Norwegian Farmhouse Ales are exactly like that: darker shade and low-hopped. Also, they're full-bodied and strong. Brew one, you'll love it.

After having experimented with Kveiks in many various styles, I settled on using them exclusively in Nordic and Baltic Farmhouse beers where they produce excellent beers for the style.
Any other style I tried to brew with Kveik yeasts, just tasted fake to me.
Why should I brew an Ersatz Kveik Bitter or whatever other style if I can perfectly brew a real one with an arrray of better fitting yeasts?

 

[HM-2]

I've played with a few Kveiks but never had a result better than "good". They'll make a passable to decent 80-90% dialled in beer very quickly but IME they often come up a bit thin and lacking in body and mouthfeel. Actually the best Kveik fermented beer I've done was a copitch due to a stall-out, which kept all of the character of the London ESB it was pitched with and tempered the worst of the Kveikiness.

 

[leedspointbrew]

LalBrew Belle Saison worked well for me. In both winter and summer, without temperature regulation, I made a lot of good beers with it. If you use only malt and hops, without spices, it gives quite clean flavors. Not as lager yeast or US-05, but I was happy with all the beers. Even my stout with it was better than US-05. I used it at ambient temperatures from 20'C to 32'C and got good beer every time. I've tried Voss Kveik several times (I can't get other types of Kveik easily in my country) and I don't like its strong citrus character. It was only good for APA/IPA and that when it ferments above 30'C, which means only a few summer months and only for one style of beer, while I work with Belle Saison all year round.

Try the Belle Saison. M29 is not bad either, but it has a stronger clove character and a much smaller temperature range.

Might give it a shot for a late-summer BPA that I'm going to be brewing in the next couple of weeks.

 

[Ninoid]

Might give it a shot for a late-summer BPA that I'm going to be brewing in the next couple of weeks.

This yeast is a good choice if you are fermenting without temperature control. I use it all year round.

 

[leedspointbrew]

This yeast is a good choice if you are fermenting without temperature control. I use it all year round.

What is your turnaround time, fermenting with the Belle Saison? From what I've read, it seems to ferment quickly, similar to a Kveik. Which is neither here nor there; since you seem experienced with his yeast, what's your practice?

 

[Ninoid]

What is your turnaround time, fermenting with the Belle Saison? From what I've read, it seems to ferment quickly, similar to a Kveik. Which is neither here nor there; since you seem experienced with his yeast, what's your practice?

Two weeks.

 

[CascadesBrewer]

What is your turnaround time, fermenting with the Belle Saison? From what I've read, it seems to ferment quickly, similar to a Kveik. Which is neither here nor there; since you seem experienced with his yeast, what's your practice?

In my experience, Kveik yeasts fermented hot are ready to package in 3-4 days. Belle Saison, being a diastaticus strain (one that can break down complex starches into fermentable sugars) tends to have a bit of a drawn out fermentation cycle where it will continue to ferment. I can usually get to a stable gravity in 2 weeks, but some report longer times. Also, while I get fairly standard attenuation levels with the Kveiks I have used, Belle Saison typically drops those batches down to 1.000 to 1.002.

Belle Saison does have a very flexible fermentation temperature range. Due to a heating control malfunction, I had a recent batch of Saison get to 104F during active fermentation. That batch actually tastes pretty decent and won a bronze in a fairly competitive competition...though 75F to 85F might be my recommended range.

 

[Albionwood]

Wait... Kveiks are too characterful, so use Belle Saison instead??!
This thread is giving off some odd messages.
You can certainly make beers other than Norwegian farmhouse styles with kveiks. And there are certainly some beer styles you can't make with kveiks.
If you want to win competitions, you have to follow the guidelines for the styles. If you want to make good, drinkable beer that you like, you have a lot more flexibility. I make a Porter that I absolutely love with Tormodgarden. I have no idea how it would do in competitions, nor do I care. It tastes fantastic, better than any commercial Porter I have had in years. So there.
Now, if you love the results you get with London Fog, you probably can't replicate that with a kveik, so keep using LF and figure out how to keep it happy. Lots of old-school tricks to keep fermenters cool without a fridge.

 

[Ninoid]

I agree that veik and Belle saison are not the same yeast and that if one really wants to make a Norwegian farmhouse beer, they cannot interchange the two yeasts. However, most people (myself included) use Kveik yeast because of its wide temperature range and fast fermentation in an effort to get the beer they are used to drinking, usually using US-05 or even lager yeasts.
Wouldn't it be great to get a beer with the same characteristics as a lager, but in a much shorter time, without the low temperature for fermentation and lagering?

 

[kingmatt]

I find kveik very inconsistent as far as the finished product goes. I've brewed some amazing beer with various strains of kveik and some very mediocre to bad beer using those same strains and recipes.

Some of it could be attributed to user error I guess but I have my process pretty dialed in at this point and I never get that kind of variance from the other established sacch strains I use.

 

[hiphoppotamuss]

Get yourself a pressure fermenter. At 20-25* C you can use just about any yeast strain. Thank you David Heath for this pressure fermenting database:



As others have commented above, I’m just not a fan of the Kveik strains. There always seems to be a difficult to place “off” flavor to just about all my batches I’ve brewed with Kveik strains. That being said, I made a strong saison copitched with Belle Saison and Voss last winter and it was dangerously good. Definitely competition grade. Not sure if you want to risk a Diastaticus contamination in your apartment brewery though…

 

[rawlus]

ive used Lutra kveik held at 85°F many times for hard seltzers and basic ales.

i also live in a small condo but i have a used wine fridge i’ve adapted to temp probe control and can ferment at almost any temp with the probe inside a thermocouple in the fermenter.

used wine fridges are pretty easy to find for cheap money. look for a compressor type not the thermoelectric type. if it’s big enough to fit fermenter snd either airlock or blowoff hose you’re good.

i use mostly dry yeasts now. but experimented a lot with liquid earlier in my journey.