I had the idea the other day about brewing at high altitudes where the boiling temperature will be less. My hypothesis is that the lower temperature boil could affect the quality of the beer. Any one else have thoughts about or looked into this before?
Higher elevation = good beer?
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Naked_Eskimo
Well-Known Member
Boiling temps will be less, but also oxygen concentration will be lower.
remilard
Well-Known Member
Because thermal loading in the kettle is lower? There are a million factors that affect that, elevation certainly being one of them. Breweries in colorado seem to make very similar beer to breweries in, say, San Francisco or San Diego (eg hoppy beers not displaying the effects of excess thermal loading). These are pretty much the brewing elevation extremes so I will say that we can observe that it is not a major factor.
iahebert
Well-Known Member
I moved to CO from WA a little over a year ago, and from experience, I can say my beers don't have any real change in flavor.
I think the difference in temp is minimal at best.
I think the difference in temp is minimal at best.
MickeyD
Well-Known Member
9,000 is high. I figured it wouldn't make much of a difference. I was just thinking that side reactions (like maillard) would have a slower reaction rate because of the lower temperatures. But I think its clear that it doesn't make much of a difference...if any.
Atmosphere is 21% oxygen at ALL elevations.
Lower pressure, fewer parts per volume...lower oxygen. Not that it has an impact on brewing. It probably has more impact a fermentation but still negligible.
Lower pressure, fewer parts per volume...lower oxygen. Not that it has an impact on brewing. It probably has more impact a fermentation but still negligible.
People upstream do get the better water.
He said O2 concentration will be lower. That is wrong. The partial pressure of O2 is lower, but the concentration is the same.
Whatever. It still dosent change the fact that the mass-volume percentage is lower. There is less O2.
Depends on how you define concentration. The mole fraction and mg/kg will be the same but the mg/L will be lower. What counts, ultimately, is the activity of oxygen and that's given by the fugacity which is essentially the partial pressure. It's lower at altitude.
More to the point, chemical reactions are strongly dependent on temperature. In Denver (the "mile high city") water will boil at around 94.6 °C. That appreciably less than 100 °C and we can certainly expect that many kettle reactions such as isomerization, color development and associated melanoidin production would be slowed. Can one get back to sea level performance simply by boiling longer? I'd expect so but I do believe that some breweries at altitude boil under pressure. Some at sea level have done this too in the hopes of being able to get by with a shorter boil.
Actually, the biggest change because of elevation I have found is with the CO2 pressure needed to carbonate beer. I have not found any changes in boiling (except a few degrees) or fermentation.
I think I have a link in my sig discussing how to adjust a kegerator at elevation.
I think I have a link in my sig discussing how to adjust a kegerator at elevation.
As with oxygen, what happens depends on the partial pressure of CO2. 30 psia will give you the same volumes of carbonation in Denver as it does in New York. The difference is that 30 psia is about 15 psig in New York but 17.5 psig in Denver. A rough value (probably more accurate than the level to which you can read those cheapie gauges we all use) can be obtained by adding 0.5 psig for each 1000 ft increase in altitude.
That sounds remarkably similar to the 1psi increase for every 2000ft elevation increase I have found through practice.
Although I agree that the gauges can be limiting as well, but adding 2psi has made quite a big difference in my beers.
That sounds remarkably similar to the 1psi increase for every 2000ft elevation increase I have found through practice.
Although I agree that the gauges can be limiting as well, but adding 2psi has made quite a big difference in my beers.
The general rule we use that works close enough is 1" Hg per 1000ft, which works out to about .5psi per 1000'.
fishwish
New Member
I am at 9200 ft. and have had serious trouble with high sugar content beers. Followed the recipes exactly (Clone Brews Abbey Tripel and Chimay Red) but have never gotten fermentation started. On the first one I repitched the yeast with no results, and on this second one I am about to repitch. The wierd thing about this Chimay is the OG is 1.132 when the recipe says it should be 1.068-1.071. I can't find my notes on the older attempt. I am about to give up on higher sugar brews, does anyone know if altitude could be the problem?
It sounds like you used half as much water as you should have to top up since your beer is twice as powerful.
A beer that big requires, among other things, a lot of yeast. Just dropping a packet in there (or even 2) is severely underpitching. Do a search for yeast starters and I think you will find what you need.
manoaction
Well-Known Member
My local homebrew club packed brewing gear up to the peak of Mt. Bierstadt and brewed a batch. That's 14,000 feet. I'm going to have to ask them if they noticed anything weird.
Has NASA developed a brewing in space program? I'd like to see tax dollars go to that.
Has NASA developed a brewing in space program? I'd like to see tax dollars go to that.
