Heady Topper- Can you clone it?

[reddskinnfan]

Caramalt on most sub charts is comparable to C10. I like CaraRed flavor better, so used it.

 

[Bamsdealer]

Brewed bobrews recipe from a dozen or so pages back this morning. Only difference was I used c20 instead of caramalt, and upped the wheat to10% as I did not have white wheat on hand.

Also went with .75oz columbus FWH and a 10 ml hopshot instead of 13ml. Other than that, followed the recipe and used some 4th gen yeast from a can of heady. Wort tasted and smelled awesome. OG was 1.077.

Not used to a 5 hour brew day. I rarely go past 3.5 hours. The long hopstand, 90 minute boil and a long mash add a nice chunk of time to the brew day. Not to mention, I havent fly sparged in a while.

 

[bobbrews]

@kdw2pd

English Malts are very different from American malts. There are no equivalents. So your best bet is to go with an english malt that is similar in character.

 

[reddskinnfan]

@kdw2pd

English Malts are very different from American malts. There are no equivalents. So your best bet is to go with an english malt that is similar in character.

Respectfully, I don't agree with this; at least fully.

I agree Maris is a totally different beast than US Pale.

However, I bet you would find it difficult to tell a difference between Biscuit malt and Victory malt if given the two to munch on. Same goes with Roasted/Toasted malts, in general.

Here is a grain substitution chart I use:

www.kotmf.com/articles/maltnames.php

 

[lbond2]

As you can see there are 313 pages here...That being said, on a scale of 1-10 (10 being spot on) how close do you think you guys are to the real Heady? Point out what you think needs tweaked, why, and how you are going to execute next time. If we can find a patter between all of us here we may be able to figure out what the problem is and make a quality clone.

 

[fellatamas182]

Just kegged my first attempt at this using bobrews will update tomorrow once it's carbed and ready

 

[lbond2]

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1431887912.698477.jpg Vintage Alchemist ware...

 

[bobbrews]

Respectfully, I don't agree with this; at least fully.

I agree Maris is a totally different beast than US Pale.

However, I bet you would find it difficult to tell a difference between Biscuit malt and Victory malt if given the two to munch on. Same goes with Roasted/Toasted malts, in general.

We are talking about cara- / crystal malts here. Thomas Fawcett Caramalt is 25-30L. You could substitute this with American Crystal 20-30L in terms of being a similar Lovibond, but you won't get the same character.

US domestic crystal malt is made from 6 row, whereas the European versions are derived from 2 row. British Crystal is more fruity and toffee-like while American Crystal is more toasty and full of caramel.

But the same doesn't go for roasted malts in general. British versions are also vastly different in flavor. If you were comparing Lovibond rating alone, then you might be right. However, there is more to it than this.

 

[trimixdiver1]

Respectfully, I don't agree with this; at least fully.

I agree Maris is a totally different beast than US Pale.

However, I bet you would find it difficult to tell a difference between Biscuit malt and Victory malt if given the two to munch on. Same goes with Roasted/Toasted malts, in general.

Here is a grain substitution chart I use:

www.kotmf.com/articles/maltnames.php

Your comparing American to Belgian Malts there. They are close, but as others have stated, British stuff is a whole other animal. There are no subs for Caramalt, Pearl, optic, halcyon, MO and GP.

 

[reddskinnfan]

Agreed on the British base malts. That was my caveat.

As far as Crystals and Roasts go, not much difference once you do. The base grain (2- or 6-row will dictate some slight differences, but not juch to an untrained pallette.

 

[Bamsdealer]

Thomas Fawcett crystal is a far cry from American crystal. Much more so than American vs British pale malts.

 

[doomXsaloon]

I've been finding that beers I do with hopstands hit their peak at 4-6 weeks. That's pretty interesting to hear yours was so good at 12-18 days. The latest one I did was also 5.5%abv, but with a 5oz 30 min steep and a 3oz dry hop. It was NOT that good at 12-18 days, but at day 26 turned freaking amazing.

4-6 weeks/ 26 days from brew day or from tapping (after carbing)

 

[geoffey]

4-6 weeks/ 26 days from brew day or from tapping (after carbing)

From brew day

 

[g0dluvsugly]

Anyone know a sufficient substitute for Apollo hops? Every substitute chart I have seen doesn't even include Apollo.

 

[Adaman05]

Anyone know a sufficient substitute for Apollo hops? Every substitute chart I have seen doesn't even include Apollo.

Columbus or nugget

 

[fellatamas182]

I actually tried summit for Apollo just for the similar high aa. But the end result turned out pretty good color is practically spot on, flavor heady had more citrus to it than mine which have have been related to the inability to find Apollo. Overall pretty happy with this brew each day I let it sit in the keg it seems to get better.View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1432461835.222806.jpg

 

[Bamsdealer]

Just curious if people are noticing a difference in harvested yeast vs the commercial stuff? I have my first heady clone fermenting now but I did brew a few pales and ipas already and am loving the yeast I harvested. I've yet to try the commercial yeast.

 

[PackerfaninSanDiego]

Anyone know a sufficient substitute for Apollo hops? Every substitute chart I have seen doesn't even include Apollo.

http://www.hopsdirect.com/apollo-leaf-sold-out/

 

[ViperMan]

Boom...

HAH! I judged that competition! It's even possible I drank that beer. I believe the DIPA/IPA categories were split between two groups of judges however.

Congrats! My beers didn't do so well at AWOG.

 

[doomXsaloon]

That was not a direct Heady clone attempt. It was just a 5.5% pale ale I brewed, using a 7 ounce hop stand at the end of the boil. I used some comet in it (As it was a new suggested hop). No dry hop at all. Basically a really big, long (1-1.5 hour) hop stand. No dry hop. 10-12 day primary. Keg, carb and drink. That particular batch was so good that it was gone in less than a week from kegging - 18 days from brew day.

Thanks.
So what kind of quick carb method are you using??
I'm revising my old "3 week primary, 2 week carb" routine!!

 

[Braufessor]

Thanks.
So what kind of quick carb method are you using??
I'm revising my old "3 week primary, 2 week carb" routine!!

I generally hook it up to 22-25lbs for 1.5-2 days and then back it off to about 12lbs. I check it (ie. drink a glass) everyday ....... strictly for quality control purposes of course When it seems about right I back it off to serving pressure so it does not get overcarbed. It might still take 3-5 days to kind of settle in.... but it works pretty slick.

 

[Braufessor]

Anyone have anything new on this recipe? I am done with school...... so I am a full time (Well, between yardwork and my wife's list) brewer for the summer. Sitting here drinking a Heady right now...... and damn, I gotta get closer than I have.

I am thinking I will try bobbrews version - as posted - for my first trial run of summer.

I am also taking Conan yeast through a series of 5-6 beers to try it out as a "house yeast" - kicking off tomorrow with a Blonde and a porter. Using the blonde to cultivate a bunch of yeast to repitch into future beers. Besides the blonde, and porter I am going to use some jars of harvested yeast to brew an Amber, APA, IPA and perhaps a brown.

I have brewed about 15-20 beers off of some yeast I harvested from heady last November. All were basically APA's and IPA's though. Curious how it does in some other beers.

 

[reddskinnfan]

Needs a little more carb ( a couple more days), but this is an AMAZING beer. Never has Heady, but if anything like this, I will have to try it.

View attachment 1432858174606.jpg

 

[roncruiser]

I generally hook it up to 22-25lbs for 1.5-2 days and then back it off to about 12lbs. I check it (ie. drink a glass) everyday ....... strictly for quality control purposes of course When it seems about right I back it off to serving pressure so it does not get overcarbed. It might still take 3-5 days to kind of settle in.... but it works pretty slick.

Interesting. At 22-25lbs for 1.5-2 days, do you help it along by rolling or rocking the keg, or do you just let it sit for the 1.5-2 days?

 

[Braufessor]

Interesting. At 22-25lbs for 1.5-2 days, do you help it along by rolling or rocking the keg, or do you just let it sit for the 1.5-2 days?

just let it sit. just gives it a "head start" on carbing up a bit quicker.

 

[kaz4121]

just let it sit. just gives it a "head start" on carbing up a bit quicker.

I do the same, helps me carb by the end of the week.

 

[Braufessor]

I have done the 25-30lbs and roll it method. I have tried 25-30lbs for several days...... I have found both to be hit and miss. Sometimes it works out ok, sometimes i get overcarbed, foamy beer that ends up taking longer to get right than if I just would have used a little patience to start with.
I find that doing 22-25lbs for a couple days, then backing it off gets it to a "drinkable/sampling" level of carbonation in 2-3 days, and then really tends to fall in about perfect around 5-7 days.
I think it just takes some time to really get a smooth carbonation into your beer...but, it is possible to speed it up a bit.

 

[Braufessor]

Needs a little more carb ( a couple more days), but this is an AMAZING beer. Never has Heady, but if anything like this, I will have to try it.

Looks great Is this from your post #3118? I am gearing up to try another couple batches of this in the next couple weeks. Got some Heady yeast going in a Blonde Ale right now that I am going to harvest and use.

 

[reddskinnfan]

Looks great Is this from your post #3118? I am gearing up to try another couple batches of this in the next couple weeks. Got some Heady yeast going in a Blonde Ale right now that I am going to harvest and use.

Yup, from that recipe. Tastes like dank grapefruit with pine.

 

[reddskinnfan]

Fully carbed; before and after!

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