Growing Out of BIAB: Reasons to Consider An MLT

[raiderrob67]

I just want to say this article is complete hog wash. none of the myths this guy write's about BIAB are true and I agree with all my fellow BIAB'ers. If I ever want to up my game it will be to a larger BIAB system.

 

[BeerIsAwesome]

+1 on what Gavin said. The actual limitations I see with BIAB-
-Fitting/lifting large grain bills due to bigger batch sizes or higher gravity brews.
-Handling of hot grains, including squeezing grains if not dunk sparging.
-For some set-ups, pre-Boil wort clarity and potential for increased fine sediment in fermenter due to no vorlauf. Note that this does not equate to an inability to have excellent clarity in your final beer, so does it matter?
None of the above are issues when I BIAB (5-ish gallon batches of medium gravity brews).

 

[jimdkc]

The number one reason I see for moving to multiple vessel brewing: You really , REALLY like cleaning stuff!

 

[Spruceman]

This article reminds me of articles I read 6,8 or 10 years ago. I moved up and into BIAB. We don't need the same old, same old stuff.

 

[eatmorefrogs]

I want more photos of that sparge arm! (if you please)

 

[akthor]

It doesn't matter what system you use to brew on. If your recipes and processes are spot on you will have the same beer whether it comes from a BIAB, a BIAB with a HLT or a 3 vessel system. This article seems to insinuate that beer made with a BIAB can't be as good.
I moved from a 3 vessel system to BIAB. I had a lot of reasons for this but a big one was cost. I wanted to move from a 10 gal system to a 1bbl one. No way was I affording a 3 vessel 1bbl system or have the room. A few percentage points in efficiency was the least of my concerns.

 

[Iseneye]

I have a number of quibbles with the article but the main one is the title. It comes across as if BIAB is a stepping stone to a supposed superior method. There was also one bit that says you can make good beer with BIAB but to make great beer you need old school 3v. Codswallop.
Efficiency is wrong.
BIAB can do water chemistry as well.
You state to 3v resu

 

[Iseneye]

Whoops. 3v results in clearer beer. No it results in clearer wort into the kettle.
Mash temperature. Number of ways BIAB can maintain temp.

 

[angrybits]

Seriously, was he just trying to write the most misleading article in HBT history? The table comparing BIAB with RIMS, as if they are somehow mutually exclusive, is the chief indicator of the complete and utter ineptitude of the author. Total garbage.

 

[h22lude]

The maintain mash temp section makes me laugh. "Heat mash on low or insulated the crap out of the boil kettle" lol It is like all BIAB systems are archaic. Most systems being sold have a pump that recirculates the mash water to keep the mash right on temp without any kind of insulation.

 

[crusader1612]

"Growing Out of BIAB" - buy a bigger Bag.....
The system you use is irrelevant, you use what your comforatable and used to using. simple, complicated, or automated. because at the end of the day..... Brewers make Wort - Yeast makes Beer.

 

[ch19]

This!
Although I enjoy many of the articles published here, I've started to notice some apparent confusion between single vessel, full volume (aka no sparge) and BIAB brewing. They are not different terms for the same thing but they seem to be used interchangeably in some articles.

 

[beerlover77]

I used to BIAB but hated dealing with the hot and heavy bag of malt. My efficiency also was less.
I like the efficiency and clear Wort that occurs with my fly sparge system and false bottom.

 

[fatherdan]

are there any articles available as to why plastic is better than glass???

 

[barnaclebob]

I graduated from 2 vessel brewing to BIAB a couple years ago and haven't looked back. Efficiency went up because i could crush very fine. BIAB and my own grain mill put my efficiency from ~60% up to the high 70's. Where i used to buy 15lbs of grain, I now buy 10 or 11.
Unless you are doing multi step or decoction mashes I don't see a need for anything but BIAB. Even so you can still add water to do various steps.

 

[Siberian]

I brew 10-15 gallon BIAB batches, lifting 40lb grain bills certainly requires a hoist of some kind, but it's not that big of a deal at all. I've done 15 gallon batches of 1.10+ OG Beers without an issue in my system, I see no reason to add a dedicated mash tun.
I never squeeze the grain bag, just not worth it, hang it, let it drip into the kettle.

 

[h22lude]

http://brulosophy.com/2016/05/16/fermentor-type-pt-2-plastic-pet-vs-glass-carboy-exbeeriment-results/
How's this? This exbeeriment blog actually has accurate info too...
(I know you were being sarcastic)

 

[fatherdan]

Sorry. It was low hanging fruit. Lol

 

[Iseneye]

I don't understand your last paragraph. All of my brews are multi step mashes on BIAB and decoctions are no problem either.

 

[BrewinBromanite]

Technically, I suppose it is 2 vessel, since it requires more than one vessel, but I don't know if its a "typical" 2 vessel setup, at least compared to a lot of setups I've seen. It is very low tech, indeed (no pumps, valves, etc.). I mash in a cooler with a typical mash ratio like many do. I then pull the bag, drain and squeeze the bag. I then empty that wort over to the kettle or separate spare pot, then do the batch sparge back in the same cooler with new water with enough water needed for pre-poil volume, combine the two volumes, and commence boil. So - yes, I pull the bag of grains out, rather than transferring via a valve.
As stated previously, I usually have to subtract a little grain from most recipes with my process, as I hit ~ 80-85% efficiency.

 

[Onerow]

It takes a lot of effort to compose and submit an article. Whither due to editing or lack of research this one is not factual. This belongs in a forum discussion not Titled as it is and put on front page. I have done BiaB over two years after a few extract brews and continue to improve with each batch - usually. But the article could have left me thinking I was misplacing my efforts and money. Thanks for the effective rebuttals in the replies.
I am happy to continue to tweak my BiaB system. Now, if i can just duplicate that awesome Kolsch I brewed in Feb!

 

[sslater]

It was surprising to see an article with this many "factual" issues...
I use full volume BIAB, 16 gallon pot with propane burner. 90 minute mash and 90 min boil normally. No need for a separate sparge since doing a full volume mash with adequate time for water to grain contact. I don't think much is different from how I do it today compared to the way Pat Hollingsdale and the other Australian pioneers popularized the method a decade or so ago.
19 batches over past 18 months. Efficiency Into Boil ranges from 80-90% normally...and have been in the low 90s a couple times. Would have to review paperwork but may have had one batch as low as 78%. Normal is 83 to 86 percent or so...reliably!
eBIAB and more elaborate systems seem cool... If BIAB didn't exist I would probably be making beer with another method, but efficiencies and more importantly beer quality are both very high with traditional Full Volume BIAB. I don't hear any higher efficiency #s with any of the other methods. Much simpler and don't see a reason to have more equipment to clean.
Writing an article you do have to put yourself out there...and that's a little scary. But like most everyone has pointed out, the article is full of factual holes. The author does not understand BIAB, and his information presented about BIAB does not correspond to anything I've experienced.

 

[Ztup]

"I regretfully have only done a few BIAB batches in my time"
Whelp, then you shouldn't be writing an article with incorrect facts on it and inferring that it is inferior to multi-vessel.
I brew with a Grainfather, which is basically BIAB, with a basket/malt tube instead of the bag. I get over 90% mash efficiency regularly. It maintains my mash temperature more precisely than a cooler based system would.
You talk about water chemistry like it's different with BIAB. It's the same water. You can control the chemistry the same ways.
You can Sparge in BIAB the same way you can in multi-vessel.
BIAB/Single Vessel is just as good or better than multi-vessel in nearly all ways. The only reason I would see it not being as good is in large commercial breweries where the Vessel sizes are so large it would be impractical to hoist or strain the grains out of the mash vessel in some way to use the same vessel as the boil vessel. You get the same beer out of it.
All articles like this do is confuse people new to the hobby that are looking to get into All-Grain brewing into thinking if they want to go all grain they need a lot more expensive equipment than they really need. It implies that the quality of the beer will be lower, which is simply not true. This should have never made it to the front page.

 

[BarleyStanding]

My traditional 3-vessel system sits on the shelf a lot more lately while I run a quick BIAB batch on a Saturday afternoon, so I guess I would have to pile-on and disagree with the premise of this article. For reasons of time and ease of set-up/clean-up, I have moved from brewing on a traditional system to BIAB for most of my lower-gravity beers. I had gotten the sense over time, mainly from forums, that BIAB was inferior to traditional all-grain brewing, but due to time constraints (young kids, their sports, and all that) and ease of use, I started experimenting with BIAB about a year ago; and you know what, my recipes taste the same in BIAB as traditional 3-vessel brewing. It took a few batches to dial-in the process, but to my surprise, efficiency is consistently higher than the software I use predicts for BIAB (still scratching my head on this), and the beer is coming out really good. I still break out the liquor tank and mash tun and run a fly sparge from time to time, but I'm all in for BIAB at this point as a great alternative to the traditional 3 vessel system. I'm also advocating BIAB to newcomers as an easier way into all-grain if they don't want to spend all the dough on a traditional system right away. Just my 2 cents.

 

[JPHussey]

I'm certainly not that high doing BIAB, though I do not sparge at all, just squeeze that sucker out. I like to do one simple water addition at the start and leave it be. Certainly makes the day easier, but hurts on efficiency no doubt...

 

[Xlimey]

That which I consistently read in this blog site is that BIAB benefits from using a finer grind of the grain mix than for 3 vessel setups. I buy my grains from our local brew shop who also provide the grain mill. When I asked whether I could have their mill set to a finer crush I got an emphatic NO. They couldn't even tell me what it was preset to. As I also make my own craft breads I already own a grain mill for grinding wheat berries. There are many berries that should never go through such a bakers mill because they leave an oily residue which clogs up the internal abrasion wheels. Also the mill does not have any precific milling sizes, just variations from fine to coarse. I use "fine" for my wheat flour. So I have two decisions to make. Whether or not to risk using (ruining) it and the trial and error of what setting to use. With that said, even on the coarse setting my wheat flour is much finer that the barley mix provided by the shop's equipment. So to ramp up my BIAB technique should my next purchase be for a Brewers grain mill rather than a RIMS pump?