English Ales - What's your favorite recipe?

[ExpatPete]

Thanks for the feedback! I will go with Crisp 19 Maris Otter as it is one of the only ones I can locate. The three closest LBS have gone under so it is either a three + hour drive or on line.

 

[oakbarn]

I always try to buy at a LBS. The $ you save today will cost you later.

Support your local business!

 

[Shenanigans]

BTW I kegged the below beer on Sunday and it's already tasting good.
It was based on post #4 from this thread.
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/threads/anyone-brewed-an-ipa-with-ekg.140192/

I just changed EKG with Pilgrim.
The only strange thing is that is ended up around 1.005 instead of 1.010.
It wasn't hop creep because it was already at this SG before dry hopping.
I also mashed for 60 mins at 66oC and my thermometer is reading correctly.
It was also a new pack of yeast so first generation and should not have mutated unless that happend when stepping up the starter.
It also tastes fine and is not as thin as I was expecting so all good but maybe some slight contamination got in there to drive up the attenuation.
I want to do a Bass Ale clone next using the same yeast so I hope it behaves differently, but just in case I might mash around 68 or 69oC to hopefully lower the attenuation a bit.


View attachment 873332

Just started my weekend with a pint of this, dangerously drinkable at about 7.5%

 

[HighlandTap]

Just started my weekend with a pint of this, dangerously drinkable at about 7.5%
View attachment 874111

I have had two of my most recent batches, where my FG was lower than the software predicted. In one instance I was using Bell’s Yeast from Imperial. That is the most aggressive yeast I have ever used. The other one I was using was White labs WLP 007. I was surprised at how low that went, at least five points farther than Beersmith predicted. The English dry yeast lived up to its name.

 

[Shenanigans]

I have had two of my most recent batches, where my FG was lower than the software predicted. In one instance I was using Bell’s Yeast from Imperial. That is the most aggressive yeast I have ever used. The other one I was using was White labs WLP 007. I was surprised at how low that went, at least five points farther than Beersmith predicted. The English dry yeast lived up to its name.

Until now I have only experienced this after repitching but this time the 1275 was a first generation pitch with a 1 litre starter.
Like I said above maybe something got into the starter. However, higher attenuation than expected can be attributed to many things.
I saved some 1275 for a Bass clone and I'm half afraid to use it but I'll give it one more chance.

WLP005 was the biggest over-attunuator after a few generations I saw until now.
It's happend the 3 times I have bought a new pack and used it multiple times.
For me WLP007 is pretty stable, I have often reused it more than 5 times witout noticing much changes.
London Ale III too.

 

[Colindo]

I got 90% EVG attenuation on the second usage of a WLP007 once.

 

[Shenanigans]

I got 90% EVG on the second usage of a WLP007 once.

I think EVG is German
But yeah for me around 80% is normal even on the 1st pitch but I do tent to use it for AIPAs with a not a too complex malt bill.

 

[Colindo]

Yeah, you're right. Sorry for getting used to speaking to some German folks. Some are picking up on how to brew British ales. Very confusing that

 

[Miraculix]

Yeah, you're right. Sorry for getting used to speaking to some German folks. Some are picking up on how to brew British ales. Very confusing that

Where about in the German interwebs?

 

[Colindo]

Where about in the German interwebs?

Most people write to me directly via Facebook, but there is also a Discord channel where British beers are sometimes mentioned https://discord.gg/ZjCudkDa

 

[monkeymath]

I think EVG is German

Half the terminology in brewing is, isn't it? Trub, Kraeusen, lautering, ...
Time to just get on with it and embrace the full Germanization. Fick ja!

 

[An Ankoù]

Half the terminology in brewing is, isn't it? Trub, Kraeusen, lautering, ...
Time to just get on with it and embrace the full Germanization. Fick ja!

Not at all. Why, when there are perfectly good English words? Ive never heard of EVG in 50+ years of brewing and beer reading. Using "foreign" words just to be cool or trendy is a pain in the neck. The French language is disappearing because the French, for some reason, want to replace everything with an English equivalent- no matter how inaccurately.
Krausen seems to me acceptable since it is a German word for a uniquely German process. In England, we don't traditionally use new wort to prime older beer. Although there is a tradition of blending gyles this is not to restart fermentation. If we add new yeast to a bottled beer this is "reseeding".
Krausen is rocky head in English
Trub, I think, comes from a common root with other languages to denote "cloudy" because of sediment. We say "trouble" in French. Is this coincidence? It;s possiby the same root that gives us "turbid" in english.
Lautering is sparging.
Vorlauf is recirculate

These words are coming over into English via the USA, where the brewing tradition was very much in the hands of German immigrants. So it's not surprising these technical words have been adopted in American English. In the earlier English brewing books and recipes, none of these words appear.

And there's the brigade of beer-alchemists , who want brewing to be shrouded in mystery and magic, who like to use arcane language to further their dark ends. I can fully sympathise with them, I love Harry Potter.

 

[DuncB]

The rocky yeast head is known as Barm.
@Northern_Brewer I think agrees.

 

[An Ankoù]

The rocky yeast head is known as Barm.
@Northern_Brewer I think agrees.

I agree, too. I had forgotten.

In retrospect, isn't barm what we pitch, ie yeast in general.

 

[DuncB]

The rocky yeast head is known as Barm.
@Northern_Brewer I think agrees.

I agree, too. I had forgotten.

In retrospect, isn't barm what we pitch, ie yeast in general.

If in retrospect wouldn't it be " pitched "

 

[An Ankoù]

The rocky yeast head is known as Barm.
@Northern_Brewer I think agrees.

If in retrospect wouldn't it be " pitched "

Sorry, Dunc, I dont get it. You've lost me.
I must need the "parts" refreshing.

A heinneken and pep.

 

[HighlandTap]

An interesting experience using White Labs WLP037 Yorkshire Square yeast. They’d recently released this year’s batch, I’d never used before so jumped on the chance. Mostly I’ve used Wyeast’s 1469, and genuinely love it. But 037 is impressive. I had slated a FG around 1.015. I reached that 4 days ago, but have let it sit in the fermenter to settle out. It has lowered down to 1.010-1.012 in that time (the Tilt hydrometer waffling back and forth). It was a Landlord-ish clone but is now starting to look like a Landlord strong bitter!

 

[Colindo]

@HighlandTap Same for me, I also recently used it for the first time. Did a parti-gyle with a NEIPA and an Ordinary Bitter. It fermented quick and dropped very clear, lovely behaviour. I had 82% attenuation in both beers.

I only tasted the NEIPA so far but it gave a very pleasing fruity complexity and reduced any harsh components from dry-hopping to none. It is now recommended by White Labs for very hoppy beers because of its capability to release thiols.

 

[Miraculix]

@HighlandTap Same for me, I also recently used it for the first time. Did a parti-gyle with a NEIPA and an Ordinary Bitter. It fermented quick and dropped very clear, lovely behaviour. I had 82% attenuation in both beers.

I only tasted the NEIPA so far but it gave a very pleasing fruity complexity and reduced any harsh components from dry-hopping to none. It is now recommended by White Labs for very hoppy beers because of its capability to release thiols.

Looking forward to hearing your opinion regarding the bitter!

 

[Erik the Anglophile]

I aswell!

 

[Cheshire Cat]

Balm is a
Bread roll
Or it’s Myrrh

 

[An Ankoù]

Balm is a
Bread roll
Or it’s Myrrh

Barm is a bread roll, or at least a barm cake is.
Balm is something soothing. Myrhh would probably be an example.

Every time I look at Boak & Bailey's book "Balmy Nectar" I shake my head in despair.

When you describe someone as barmy is because their head's fizzy.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

Any Myrhh reference reminds me of Terry Jones as Brian’s mother in the Life of Brian.

 

[An Ankoù]

Blessed are the cheese-makers, I say. They shall inherit the curd.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

If anyone has used Whitbread Goldings, how different from East Kent are they?

They're not true Goldings, although they do have some Goldings heritage - they were named that way because Goldings came to be used as a generic identifier of quality in the same way that a lot of sparkling wine in the New World came to be called "champagne", even Fuggle was originally sold as Fuggle's Golding and Styrian Golding is a more recent example.

And East Kent is just a geographical identifier, so you could get East Kent WGV if they were grown east of the M20 motorway, although they would have a very different profile to true East Kent Goldings (which is a legally protected designation for certain Goldings clones grown east of the motorway, and that official list does not include WGV).

WGV really came to prominence during the big panic over verticillium wilt after WWII, as it is somewhat tolerant of wilt and has a reasonably English flavour (and was the pet hop of Whitbread, one of the biggest brewery groups at the time). So you find it in a lot of commercial recipes at that time, but it's maybe not what you would choose if you were prepared to pay the small premium for true Goldings.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

The rocky yeast head is known as Barm.
@Northern_Brewer I think agrees.

Too right - there's proper English words for pretty much every brewing term, the problem is that the US didn't just put Germans in charge of their national cuisine (I mean - why?) but their brewing as well, hence oddities like Plato rather than gravity. There's also odd bits of borrowing from the Belgians as well, using foeder instead of vat and things like that.

Barm is an interesting one - if you look at some of Lars Garshol's research, he's found that the word kveik is only used for farmhouse yeast in the southwest of Norway. In the southeast it's called gong, in the north it's called gjest(er) which is obviously the cognate of "yeast" in English - and in the Sognefjord it was known as barm. Which is the same word that's used for yeast floating on top of the beer in traditional northern English breweries at least. Barm cakes were traditionally made with that yeast, as opposed to soda bread or unleavened bread. (as an aside, one of my favourite Frenchisms is baking powder being "levure chimique" = "chemical yeast" ).

 

[An Ankoù]

Barm cakes were traditionally made with that yeast, as opposed to soda bread or unleavened bread. (as an aside, one of my favourite Frenchisms is baking powder being "levure chimique" = "chemical yeast" ).

Indeed, levure chimique always makes me giggle every time I use it.

And I use WGV in a bitter. I treat them as an unrelated hop variety and don't really think of them as a Goldings substitute.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

What is this cask heartland of which you speak? First I've heard of it, and I've been drinking cask since the 70s. I don't get around the country so much now but I do get into Lancashire and Yorkshire where cask still seems to be going strong.

I should perhaps have said the heartland of traditional cask - what might loosely be described as the hinterland of Burton, between the M1 & M6 and say Tamworth and Ashbourne. It's got a beer culture that's very distinct from neighbouring areas, it's still pretty common to find pubs with only one trad bitter on cask - either Bass or Pedigree. Now there's historical and commercial reasons why that's the case, but it's very different from the beer culture of Sheffield and Manchester, where bars have a lot more choice and the historical preference for pale bitter beers made it much easier for tastes to evolve towards beers with New World hops.

 

[Fr_Marc]

I am currently in England for a few days and have the following (maybe stupid) question:

Is it possible to use good quality cask ale to start a yeast culture?

I am prepared to bring home 100mil of cask ale in sanitized and sterilized containers, originally intended for shampoo etc.

I have no access to the yeast depot in the actual cask, obviously.

Are there enough active yeast cells in well managed cask ales to give it a try or am I plain stupid?

Thanks for your input!

Marc

PS: It‘s the Harvey‘s yeast I am after…

 

[DuncB]

Really you want a pint of Harvey's at the end of the barrel, that will have more cells.
Let it stand and then transfer the settled to your transport vessel.

Some of Harvey's bottled beer has their yeast in as well.
This is the easiest way to transfer it.

You could also get a polyp in of Sussex ale. Drink the beer and take the sediment home in the polyp in.