Dry yeasts identified - your opinions please!

[Kold Brygg]

"Yorkshire" with crazy attenuation.

Would be interesting to se reports of the attenuation as most seems way to high. Is this theoretical or actual attenuation.

@Erik the Anglophile have given positive reports of the Whitbread strain in Brewly branding. Which must be produced at the same Swedish factory.

From looking at the Doemens literature, Diamond appears to be the Doemens 308 strain. Doemens describes their 375 as "the most frequently used bottom fermenting yeast strain in Germany."

Assuming the 375 is the "Weihenstephaner lager" strain, I don't think AEB's "Weihenstephaner lager" is Diamond.

FWIW, Andreas Krennmair also claims that Diamond is WY2308.

If interested there is an interesting comparison between the Swedish 34/70 and Diamond. Written in Norwegian, Google translate will most likely help .
https://forum.norbrygg.no/threads/lallemand-diamond-vs-brewly-34-70.44612/

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Would be interesting to se reports of the attenuation as most seems way to high. Is this theoretical or actual attenuation.

All we have is :
"Produces esters with citrus character
Timeless taste and balance and usable in a wide variety of beer styles
Yorkshire - Regional Ale, originally from the United Kingdom, is a Saccharomyces cerevisiae type top-fermenting strain used for the production of specialty beers.
Yeast strain: Saccharomyces Cerevisiae
Origin: Tetleys Brewery
Brewing parameters
- Beer styles: all type of British Ales and modern ciders
- Fermentation kinetics: fast. 8 days at 22°C, 16 days at 12°C for 12°P
- Fermentation temperature range: 12-25°C
- Apparent attenuation: 87%
- Flocculation and sedimentation ability: good"

That seems quite plausible - a lot of the yeasts used in Yorkshire Squares are diastatic saison-type strains, perhaps the most famous is the one used by Boddingtons in the 1970s which regularly saw apparent attenuations >90% and which originated in Tadcaster, the main brewing town of Yorkshire. One of Ron's recipes for Tetley bitter in 1945 has apparent attenuation of 93.75%, so it's consistent with what's reported for the AEB yeast.

Not all British yeasts are as lazy as Windsor!!!!!

 

[Kold Brygg]

All we have is :
"Produces esters with citrus character
Timeless taste and balance and usable in a wide variety of beer styles
Yorkshire - Regional Ale, originally from the United Kingdom, is a Saccharomyces cerevisiae type top-fermenting strain used for the production of specialty beers.
Yeast strain: Saccharomyces Cerevisiae
Origin: Tetleys Brewery
Brewing parameters
- Beer styles: all type of British Ales and modern ciders
- Fermentation kinetics: fast. 8 days at 22°C, 16 days at 12°C for 12°P
- Fermentation temperature range: 12-25°C
- Apparent attenuation: 87%
- Flocculation and sedimentation ability: good"

That seems quite plausible - a lot of the yeasts used in Yorkshire Squares are diastatic saison-type strains, perhaps the most famous is the one used by Boddingtons in the 1970s which regularly saw apparent attenuations >90% and which originated in Tadcaster, the main brewing town of Yorkshire. One of Ron's recipes for Tetley bitter in 1945 has apparent attenuation of 93.75%, so it's consistent with what's reported for the AEB yeast.

Not all British yeasts are as lazy as Windsor!!!!!

You might surely be correct, but to me the attenutation of most of AEB yeasts seems high.

Sierra Nevada Yeast
Origin: Sierra Nevada
- Apparent attenuation: 89%

Fermentis US-05 78-82%

Big Bold - British Ale Yeast
Origin: Whitbread Brewery
- Apparent attenuation: 87%

Fermentis S-04 74-82%

Classic Lager Yeast
Origin: Weihenstephan 34/70
- Apparent attenuation: 87%

Fermentis W‑34/70 80-84%

German Lager Yeast
Origin: VLB
- Apparent attenuation: 87%

Fermentis S-23 80-84%

The Brewly version of w34/70 have most reports of 82%+ attenuation. What I've read about the Brewly Whitbread version it seem to be 75%+ (very few reports). We don't know for sure if the AEB and Brewly are the same yeasts, but as both are produced in Sweden, it seems likely.

That's why I wonder, is the AEB numbers for attenuation theoretical or actual. It would be interesting to see user experience.

And good old Nottingham surely ain't slough like Windsor

 

[kjelljorner]

Check the specs, don't you think M66 looks closer to M44 than M42? not sure what you are disagreeing with. I am not claiming it is one or the other.

M42:

View attachment 724589
M44:

View attachment 724591

M66:

View attachment 724590



Since they didn't either deny or confirm, I wouldn't use it as evidence of the yeast being the same (or not being the same) as M42.

In any case, I think what is most important here (for me at least) is knowing that M66 is not Verdant.

To follow up on this quite old discussion , I think that M66 is simply M36 Liberty Bell + Aromazyme. Supporting "evidence":

1. M36 is most likely composed of M42 (Nottingham) + M15 (Windsor) and it matches roughly the attenuation (M66: 74-82, M36: 74-78), flocculation (M66: 4/5, M36: 4/5) and sedimentation (M66: 3/5, M36: 4/5) of M66.
2. Attenuation is likely is too low (74-82) to be pure New England (78-83), BRY-97 (78-84) or Nottingham (78-84).
3. Flocculation and sedimentation (4/5 and 3/5) is too low to be pure Nottingham (5/5).
4. A number of users have reported significantly different fermentation as compared to Verdant [1] [2] [3], especially absence of high Kräusen.
5. Lallemand's Best Practices Guide to Biotransformation and IPA covers both Windsor and Nottingham. While Nottingham has good β-lyase activity, it and Windsor has only medium β-glucosidase. That can be fixed by adding β-glucosidase enzymes. On the other hand, BRY-97 has low β-lyase activity and high β-glucosidase activity. It doesn't make sense to add β-glucosidase enzymes to BRY-97 as there is no problem to fix.
6. M66 is described as "Relatively neutral, with the moderate, well-balanced ester profile adding subtle complexity." which doesn't fit pure Nottingham which is known as very neutral, or Verdant which is more estery and fruity. M36 fits better as it is described as having "light, delicate fruity esters."
7. Regarding attenuation/dryness/body, the descriptions for M66 ("Beers fermented with this yeast have a moderately dry finish but will retain a good level of mouthfeel to prevent them from being too thin") and M36 ("Clean, mostly neutral and smooth, finishes beers moderately dry but does not strip away body") are very similar, reflecting medium attenuation rather than the drier M42 or M44 (BRY-97).
8. MJ already has M36 in their portfolio and they only need to add the enzyme rather than bringing in a new yeast.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

additional recent discussion here (link).

 

[dmtaylor]

additional recent discussion here (link).

Indeed... to anyone who doesn't hang out in multiple forums... if you don't, you might be missing something that interests you. Or maybe not.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

@kjelljorner - with regard to yeast in a sachet having two different colors and perhaps being a blend, have you seen this thread from 2022?

​

 

[kjelljorner]

@kjelljorner - with regard to yeast in a sachet having two different colors and perhaps being a blend, have you seen this thread from 2022?

​

Thanks @BrewnWKopperKat hadn't seen that. Probably makes it difficult to compare between batches of the same yeast. However, I think it would be safe to assume that a single batch should have a homogenous color.

 

[IslandLizard]

However, I think it would be safe to assume that a single batch should have a homogenous color.

Not necessarily, the manufacturer may package a mix from different batches.
I also noticed (in the picture) the yeast granules are rod-shaped, not round pellets.

 

[kjelljorner]

Not necessarily, the manufacturer may package a mix from different batches.
I also noticed (in the picture) the yeast granules are rod-shaped, not round pellets.

Well spotted! It is consistent with what I saw from Nottingham W-34/70, but not from M54 here (more rounded granules). My tentative hypothesis is that this will depend on whether they use extrusion before the drying or not. Lallemand and Fermentis seem to make vermicelli from yeast paste that is then dried. Different factories/manufacturers could have different processes.