Dry Yeast out there for Witbier?

[GPNewBrew]

Does anyone know of or has anyone used a dry yeast for a Witbier? Yeast plays a definite role in this style, but getting a liquid yeast delivered to me here in Houston Area is tricky with the hot temps we have. Dry ice doesn’t seem to do it. Thanks!

 

[day_trippr]

I don't know that there's a proper witbier yeast in dry form available, but Fermentis T-58 or maybe WB-06, either one run on the cool end of their range, can effect a passable wit...

Cheers!

 

[Zambezi Special]

Mangrove Jack has one, if I am not mistaken.....

And I am not
It's M21

 

[hottpeper13]

This yeast (M21) from Mangrove is the best wit yeast I've used. I like the flavor better then 400 or 410. It seemed to stop at 1.020 after 7 days and I let it go 21 days and it was down to 1.010, kegged and forced carbed and put on tap and was gone in 2 weeks. Subsequent batches were just left alone for 21 days and they all finished at 1.010.

 

[Gnomebrewer]

You could look at bottle harvesting some yeast. I think Allagash white is bottle conditioned with the primary yeast blend.

 

[Smellyglove]

WB-06. Ferment it at 24C. (Start at, and hold for a few days then let it sink if you want) Great dry option for Wit.

 

[Pkrd]

Have a Hoegaarden with M21 on tap right now. Pretty happy with it.

 

[Franktalk]

WB-06. Ferment it at 24C. (Start at, and hold for a few days then let it sink if you want) Great dry option for Wit.

Do you get banana with WB-06? That's the only thing that would break the deal for me. Banana is okay for a hefe, but not good in a wit.

 

[Smellyglove]

Do you get banana with WB-06? That's the only thing that would break the deal for me. Banana is okay for a hefe, but not good in a wit.

Nope. It's peppery and citrusy at those temperatures. But don't rehydrate the yeast, or else you'll not get the flavors. Less yeast (within limits) works best to get this pepper/citrus thing out of it. WB-06 has nothing to do with Hefeweizen, although some people still think so since it's a yeast for "wheat beer".

You can also dump some crushed pepper and coriander-seeds into the boil to emphasize a bit on those fronts. I've used about 0.18g/l of both I think and it works. Refreshing beer. The WB-06 will take it down to 1.008-ish.

 

[tellyho]

I love t58, but I think you'd be unhappy with it for a wit.

 

[Miraculix]

Nope. It's peppery and citrusy at those temperatures. But don't rehydrate the yeast, or else you'll not get the flavors. Less yeast (within limits) works best to get this pepper/citrus thing out of it. WB-06 has nothing to do with Hefeweizen, although some people still think so since it's a yeast for "wheat beer".

You can also dump some crushed pepper and coriander-seeds into the boil to emphasize a bit on those fronts. I've used about 0.18g/l of both I think and it works. Refreshing beer. The WB-06 will take it down to 1.008-ish.

OK, you got me when you said peppery. How is it at room temperature with no temperature control, maybe pitched at the hot side about 26c?

In another thread it was said that peppery is actually often accentuated at lower temperature and fruity at higher.

Would it make sense to keep this one as low as possible to get more pepper out of it?

 

[Smellyglove]

OK, you got me when you said peppery. How is it at room temperature with no temperature control, maybe pitched at the hot side about 26c?

In another thread it was said that peppery is actually often accentuated at lower temperature and fruity at higher.

Would it make sense to keep this one as low as possible to get more pepper out of it?

That's not my experience. I've gotten pepper at 24C (Haven't tried like 22, or 26, only 24 since it worked" from the start). At 20C it's pretty boring to be honest. I can recognize a 20C WB-06 beer at proper pitchrates after one sip (actually confirmed, haha) and at 18C-ish I'd rather brew something else..

Here's how I found out. I tasted a store bought beer which had this "spicy" flavor to it. I mailed the brewery, and asked what did you add to it? The brewer said "nothing".. Huh! Well how did you ferment it? The brewer said four days at 24C then let temperature drop.

Did the same, same spicy flavor. However. I always rehydrate my yeast, the first time I didn't because I was lazy. The second time I did, and did not get the same flavor at all. Same recipe.
So I did some testing, and found out that don't rehydrate it. A forum-friend of mine did the same recipe, but almost twice the batch size, he got even more of the spicyness on his second attempt, after I told him to not rehydrate.

Peppery (Phenolic, clove-ish) at lower and fruity at higher sounds like a saison or hefeweizen yeast.

 

[Miraculix]

That's not my experience. I've gotten pepper at 24C (Haven't tried like 22, or 26, only 24 since it worked" from the start). At 20C it's pretty boring to be honest. I can recognize a 20C WB-06 beer at proper pitchrates after one sip (actually confirmed, haha) and at 18C-ish I'd rather brew something else..

Here's how I found out. I tasted a store bought beer which had this "spicy" flavor to it. I mailed the brewery, and asked what did you add to it? The brewer said "nothing".. Huh! Well how did you ferment it? The brewer said four days at 24C then let temperature drop.

Did the same, same spicy flavor. However. I always rehydrate my yeast, the first time I didn't because I was lazy. The second time I did, and did not get the same flavor at all. Same recipe.
So I did some testing, and found out that don't rehydrate it. A forum-friend of mine did the same recipe, but almost twice the batch size, he got even more of the spicyness on his second attempt, after I told him to not rehydrate.

Peppery (Phenolic, clove-ish) at lower and fruity at higher sounds like a saison or hefeweizen yeast.

Technically wb06 is a saison yeast, that's why I was asking. I have no means to keep the temperature at 24c, maybe I just pitch at 30 and let it go on its own from then on. Should stay above 24c for at least one day, maybe yeast activity can keep it warm a day longer. Will be a cheap brew anyway, half the grain bill being wheat flour and only bittering hops, got the yeast since years lying around in my room... Nothing to loose.

Have you personally tried brewing it lower than 20c?

 

[Smellyglove]

Try it. Like you said, nothing to loose. Godspeed. I believe that WB-06 is one of the most boring yeasts in the world until you push it. pitchwise and temperaturewise.

 

[rtstrider]

I've used wb-06 and it was awful! Ruined my first ever brew with it and had nightmares. After gaining quite a bit of experience and better equipment I tried again. Wanted to rule out a potential bad batch of yeast, my brewing techniques, etc. Verdict is it sucks. Make sure you absolutely use spices in that brew to cover up the tartness! If you use that yeast, and are dead set, then I'd recommend an ounce of Corriander at 10 min and 1 oz dried SWEET orange peel at 5 minutes. The tartness is somewhat tolerable but still god awful. Tried Belle Saison and wasn't a fan of that either. It was a bugger and ruined a bucket fermenter (every batch over attenuated after that so it's a bugger to get rid of). Made a not so good belgian wit at that. Best yeast I've found was Wyeast 3944. I've heard murmurs of people trying t-58 and having success with that but once I found my preferred yeast things were left alone.

 

[GPNewBrew]

Thanks a lot for the replies! Wit is one of my favorite styles, but it’s one I haven’t made yet. It’s on the “brewboard” to make; just have to make some final decisions around hops (EK Golding vs Saaz, or maybe both). Sounds like M21 is a viable yeast.

 

[rtstrider]

Thanks a lot for the replies! Wit is one of my favorite styles, but it’s one I haven’t made yet. It’s on the “brewboard” to make; just have to make some final decisions around hops (EK Golding vs Saaz, or maybe both). Sounds like M21 is a viable yeast.

Stick with a noble hop variety. Use a 60 minute addition and that's it. Shoot for 15-20 IBU's. You only need hops for bittering. The spices are for the aroma/flavors

 

[dmtaylor]

Mangrove Jack has one, if I am not mistaken.....

And I am not
It's M21

Right you are. And I am not sure which yet, but either BE-134 or BE-256 is equivalent, as MJ just repacks yeasts from other companies.

 

[Miraculix]

Right you are. And I am not sure which yet, but either BE-134 or BE-256 is equivalent, as MJ just repacks yeasts from other companies.

I don't think that fermentis sells to resellers. It is more likely a Lallemand strain or from another company.

 

[Schlenkerla]

From Brewer's Friend.

https://www.brewersfriend.com/styles/witbier/yeasts/