Clone Beer Dog Fish Head - Midas Touch

[Beens_Baxter]

and a note on saffron, as ya'll have figured, it is very expensive because well here.. wiki can explain it better..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saffron#Trade_and_use

 

[nbspindel]

so i'm finally brewing this. 'next weekend' turned into 'next month', but the time has come. i'm getting ready to add the saffron and decided to taste it first, just a thread, right on the tongue. I don't really find it to be that strong of a flavor. recipe calls for only 10 threads. the 0.06 oz i bought probably has about 100 threads in it. So, for those considering this, just buy the smallest container of saffron you can find. Or, just skip it. I haven't tried the beer yet, but i would bet in 5 gallons only 10 tiny threads aren't going to affect it too much. BTW, i bought spanish saffron.

good luck brewing! this is really simple with the small amount of hops to be added, then just waiting.

 

[Walker]

In cooking, saffron is often added just to color something, and not for flavor.

example: If you make a yellow cake from scratch, it will contain saffron just to make it yellow instead of white.

 

[cercueil]

I don't really find it to be that strong of a flavor. recipe calls for only 10 threads.

After putting 10 threads out on the counter it seemed like a small amount so I think I put in about 30 or so and you really coudn't taste it in there. The muscat and honey yes but not the saffron.

 

[nbspindel]

After putting 10 threads out on the counter it seemed like a small amount so I think I put in about 30 or so and you really coudn't taste it in there. The muscat and honey yet but not the saffron.

i just read your reply and i swear i had typed that. That's exactly what i did. I took a solid pinch (probably about 30), but doubt I'll taste any of it. Well, at least I can bake a yellow cake now

 

[orangeandblue302]

so is the general consensus that we can skip the saffron? I am finding it difficult to find and have all of the other ingredients.

 

[nbspindel]

IMHO, i'd skip it. although i haven't had the original, haven't tried mine (with a hint more than what the recipe calls for), nor have i tried it without. So, i can't compare the outcome. Doesn't seem like it does much though.

 

[khiddy]

Wow, all of this talk about "skip the saffron" and "I threw in 30 threads because I didn't think I'd taste it" kind of miss the point of brewing a clone, don't they? It seems strange to me to hear someone say, "I don't like this beer" when they didn't really even brew the beer in question, but their own version with changes that make it a different beer!

 

[nbspindel]

i dont think you're referring to me, cause i didnt say i liked or didnt like the beer, like others may have. as far as brewing a different beer altogether, you have a point. however, after it's been brewed i'll be comparing the real thing with my clone and will be able to comment on whether i am able to taste a difference with more saffron. maybe if someone does a brew without saffron, he/she can compare and comment on what the difference is there. This could help eliminate some unnecessary costs in the recipe if it doesn't affect the beer that much. DFH really was sticking to what the scientists found in the tomb in order to make the beer authentic. If it doesnt make a difference, i won't be using such an expensive ingredient in the future. just my thoughts on the brew.

 

[khiddy]

I certainly wasn't attacking, just pointing out that the whole appeal of DFH's Midas Touch originally was that they were using an ancient recipe. Now, here some homebrewers come along and take Sam & Crew's version of the recipe, tweak it by tripling (or, alternately, completely eliminating) the primary spice, and what they have now is no longer Midas Touch, but a completely different recipe.

I had the same thing happen to me when I made my version of EdWort's Haus Pale Ale. I used a different yeast than called for, and a different hop, and got jumped on (by EdWort himself, no less!) because I was told I wasn't making EdWort's recipe but something different because my version wasn't the recipe as published. I heard the point then, and I am just making sure to spread the "beat-down wealth" now.

 

[nbspindel]

its funny how the written word can be so easily misunderstood. i wasnt' being defensive, just stating that i didnt think you meant me.

the benefit of what we do is that we can be creative. altering recipes is something we should all do to (hopefully) improve a brew. Like i said, if the saffron doesnt seem necessary, it can be left out, by choice of the brewer. i don't think i'll be doing multiple batches of this stuff due to cost, but it would be nice to know if the saffron does make a difference or not. I agree with you again, khiddy, as i mentioned in #39, DFH's purpose was to recreate an original, ancient recipe for some presumingly good beer. It worked (depending on who you ask). I'll find out if mine turned out well soon enough, then change my handle to 'midas' instead of 'nbspindel'. ha.

 

[nbspindel]

i'm having issues with my attenuation and i'm not sure if the yeast is done or just taking a while. I brewed on the 16th, that makes it 11 days, and the OG is down from 1.081 to 1.051. It's been fermenting at 60* F, so i know it will be slower, but i expected it to have done more converting than that. What's suggested here? I'll be checking the gravity again in a few days to see if it's still moving downwards. If not, what should be done?

-moving the wort around so as to re-suspend anything that's flocculated out?
-repitch? this wouldnt work properly due to the different phases yeast goes through, right? the original yeast would have eaten all the glucose already and absorbed all the oxygen. am i right?

right now it tastes like honey, but i think i can actually taste the saffron! will have to comment on this more later though when its done.

 

[bknifefight]

If you can, you should heat it up. I think the temperature range for WLP001 is 68 - 74. 60 is probably too low.

I am excited for this recipe. I have all the ingredients but am waiting for brew a session pale ale to pitch onto it's yeast cake.

 

[bknifefight]

Does anyone have some feedback about the FG of this beer? The recipe calls for 1.026 which seems high. I am at 1.022, running 74.4% Attenuation (yeast range is 70-75 but I have seen it hit 80) but don't want to end up with bottle bombs like someone else in this thread did.

 

[nbspindel]

i got down to 1.017. i haven't bottled it (its kegged), so i can't tell you if it's fully done or not, but i imagine it is. i also repitched at some point due to stuck fermentation, which may have helped lower the FG.

 

[cercueil]

but don't want to end up with bottle bombs like someone else in this thread did.

That would be me..lol..Don't worry about the bottle bombs..I found out that the beer had gotten some wild bacteria in it (noob mistake) and kept fermenting the beer lower and lower. Once I put them in the refrigerator it was ok. The beer was super over carbed but believe it or not the taste was good.

 

[bknifefight]

I was planning on bottling but it dropped to 1.020 so I will give it another week. This Muscat Grape Concentrate is just taking forever to ferment out all the way.

 

[bknifefight]

I bottled this almost 3 weeks ago at 1.018. I was nervous that it may slowly lose a few more points and that my carbonation would be way too much. Curious, I cracked one open last night to give it a try. The carbonation was low (as I opened it too early) and it was good. It has been months since I had a real Midas Touch so I cannot compare, but I liked mine quite a bit. I will give it another month or two to mellow before I share any or start drinking it regularly though.

 

[lurch]

I picked up a 4 pack of the Midas Touch and fell in love with it. But being the adventurous sort I’m thinking of tinkering with the recipe.

1. I am ordering a can of gewürztraminer concentrate this varietal is a spicier grape and think it would do very well to give the beer stronger back end.

2. For the honey addition, I have access to a wonderful blackberry honey, It has a strong blackberry flavor and combined with the spice from the grapes should be wonderful.

3. For the bettering hops I will say I wish the original was a tad hoppier, having said that I am going with 3/4 an oz of Chinook hops.

4. I am also touying with the Idea of using Wyeast 3538-PC Leuven Pale Ale Yeast to also enhance the spicyness as well

So waiting for payday to place my order and I have a friend picking me up a packet of Baby brand Kashmir saffron its graded as 1a and hope it will impart the wonderful straw color.
:fro:

 

[Ouroboros]

I bought this beer awhile ago and really enjoyed it - definitely unique, if not a bit sweet. I should have aged a bottle, but patience is not one of my virtues. I caught a hint of saffron, but there's no way 10 strands in 5 gallons could account for that. Once I get the knack of brewing down, I think I'm going to try to clone/modify it with a bit more saffron.

 

[tmanlua]

Any updates on this thread? Is it a good clone recipe? Any new thoughts on the necessity of the saffron?

 

[bknifefight]

Any updates? There are 6 pages of updates. Anyways, the saffron is up to you, I don't think it did anything for my batch and I added more than what the recipe called for. It is a beer that will do better with age as mine is now almost 3 months in bottles and still has a bit of a bite to it.

 

[Idlehanz]

The wort for this clone is boiling right now. The girlfriend loves this beer, and she wanted to start brewing with me, so it's a perfect oppurtunity to get her involved. We got all the ingredients at our LHBS ( Stienbarts, here in Portland ) except for the Saffron ( glad she paid for this batch! ) We're following the Extreme Brewing recipe exactly. I'll post our SG later.

 

[Idlehanz]

She ( we ) hit the OG right on target. 1.086

 

[bknifefight]

She ( we ) hit the OG right on target. 1.086

Remember, the muscat concentrate will up the gravity but it is hard to say how much. I just assume my batch of this runs about 9% because of how I feel after a bottle

 

[craniumcramps]

brewing this weekend...will be doing an all-grain mash, should be interesting and fun. Also using the brx 68 grape concentrate, and will probably add 30 threads of saffron. everything else will be the same...

 

[sensibull]

Newbie brewer here, hoping to tackle this recipe sometime soon (not least because my wife is an archaeologist who has worked for over a decade in Turkey, but also because we both dig the commercial version). However, I am a bit thrown by the 6.5 gallon batch size. What do people use to ferment 6.5 gallons?

 

[bknifefight]

Brewing software like Beer Smith can scale it for you. Or you could just use the ingredients shown for a 5 gallon batch and have it a bit stronger.

 

[chrismcnally]

Craig, thanks for that formula.

My recipe is a little different, an all grain from BYO magazine. I adjusted it down to about 4 gallons. It's been fermenting for two weeks and it's at 1.022. I'll come back here with notes later when I've tasted it:

http://hopville.com/recipe/362422/home-brew/midas-touch-w-muscat-grape-45-gal

When figuring out your expected FG on this beer it is pretty safe to just use the malt. The sugars in the grape juice and honey will completely ferment so they don't contribute to the FG.

The muscat juice concentrate is 68 Brix, which translates to 68% sugar. You can estimate the SG it adds by using the weight of the juice times 0.68 and treat it as sugar.

Craig

 

[millaj92]

I love this DFH brew. I found a recipe and modified it slightly and it turned out effing amazing. BETTER than the original I think. Right at 9% ABV. I can taste the saffron but then again I'm a foodie and I love saffron. Don't use the cheap stuff. Also, the grape I got was pasteurized. Here's what I used.

Trappist Ale Yeast-
I did my usual Activator starter. Pop the pouch, give it 8 hrs, boil 1 lb light DME with 1 qt water, chill, pitch. Give it a few days.

Mash- (Technically just a steep, not a full-on mash)
2 lbs. 2-row pale malt
3 quarts @ 150F
30 minutes

Sparge-
1.5 quarts @ 170F

In brew kettle-
Add water to get 2.5 gal
Add 31.25oz light LME
Add 27.78 grams of 4.5% Willamette pellets
Boil for 60 minutes

Last 15 minutes of boil-
Add 52.8oz light LME
Add 18.89 grams of 4.5% Willamette pellets
Add 1 tsp of saffron threads, about 40
I put in 1 tsp irish moss and 1 tbs yeast nutrient, but these are optional I guess

Turn off the heat, add 3 lbs good quality clover honey, and let stand for 5 minutes. Chill, dilude to 5 gal, add 2 lbs muscat grape concentrate, pitch. 10 days in primary, 10 days in secondary, and 21 days in the bottle with 3/4 cup corn sugar for priming.

I got these numbers:
OG=1.079
FG=1.010
ABV=9.0