DIY glycol chilled plastic conical fermenters

[FreddyMar3]

Amazing thread. I am collecting parts to build a single conical version of this. It will be in an unheated detached garage year round so heating is definitely a big issue for me. Is there any reason the water in the cooler couldn't just be heated with some sort of heating element?

Apologies if this has been addressed already.

 

[TrickyDick]

Packet, Where did you say you got the thermometers from again (that fit into the thermowells)? Any other issues with those motorized ball valves? Planning to order those today. TD

And also, those valves are huge AC/DC 9-24V ?

 

[TrickyDick]

Packet, Where did you say you got the thermometers from again (that fit into the thermowells)? Any other issues with those motorized ball valves? Planning to order those today. TD

Again those are the ACDC9-24V ball valves?

 

[JohnnyBe]

I had stripped it out of the design due to the limitation of the number of outputs the BCS will allow you to associate to probes. There's apparently a workaround with process states that will let you emulate this functionality though. I bought the heat tape, but haven't had any time to tinker with it.

If you really wanted to heat as well you could use a BCS 462 instead and then be able to heat a cool since it has 8 temperature inputs and can control 18 outputs. Another option would be to use their Digi16 expansion card along with the 460 since it will add 12 additional outputs and 4 inputs.

 

[Patirck]

I have been reading and following this thread for a while now...

I have a conical fermenter on a wooden home made stand and I'm debating if I should make a cool box with a window a/c or add the stainless coil and run glycol/water.

It will be situated next to my giant serving keezer. I only plan on one fermenter at this time.

My question is: Do you think I can get away with sticking a bucket in the serving keezer with a pond pump to cool one conical?

I plan on insulating the fermenter with neoprene like you did and I also plan on building a box around the conical stand - with some insulation.

If I go with the stainless coil, I'd rather skip the air conditioner part of this if possible.....

Thanks!

 

[FreddyMar3]

My question is: Do you think I can get away with sticking a bucket in the serving keezer with a pond pump to cool one conical?
Thanks!

I'm pretty sure I read elsewhere that air to liquid temp transfer is very inefficient and that the keezer would be too slow to keep up with the heat in the conical. I had the same idea and was convinced otherwise.

 

[TrickyDick]

I'm pretty sure I read elsewhere that air to liquid temp transfer is very inefficient and that the keezer would be too slow to keep up with the heat in the conical. I had the same idea and was convinced otherwise.

Yeah I think that is correct. However, depending upon ambient temps, and the volume of coolant used, he might be able to manage adequate temp control for ales. I think lagers, especially 10 gallons worth, would be problematic. But then there is the issue of plumbing the lines through the collar, and taking up space for serving kegs,etc.

TD

 

[fpweeks]

I tried this with an apartment size refrigerator, a pond pump and a stainless coil inside my conical. Ambient was in the mid 70's, and i had a very difficult time maintaining 67.

So the easy answer is no it won't work. Now if it was a freezer and you were recirc'ing gyclol it certainly may work.

 

[Soapebrews]

sweet

 

[swanronson]

So I am in the process of mimicking your build. I would like to double it though. Which of the components, especially in the BCS portion need to be doubled up? I have already purchased the BCS-462 to allow me temp inputs for 6 conicals, just curious about what would actually require doubling the parts. Thanks!!

 

[JohnnyBe]

So I am in the process of mimicking your build. I would like to double it though. Which of the components, especially in the BCS portion need to be doubled up? I have already purchased the BCS-462 to allow me temp inputs for 6 conicals, just curious about what would actually require doubling the parts. Thanks!!

I am no expert on this topic and packet can probably answer this better but knowing what little I do about glycol systems you are going to possibly need a larger reservoir. However this is going to be dictated by your ambient temperature, lagers vs ales, AC unit BTU's, insulation, etc.

 

[packet]

Packet, Where did you say you got the thermometers from again (that fit into the thermowells)? Any other issues with those motorized ball valves? Planning to order those today. TD

And also, those valves are huge AC/DC 9-24V ?

Thermometers are directly from brewershardware:

http://www.brewershardware.com/BCS-460-Temperature-Sensors/

No real issues with the valves other than one being DOA. I'd order a spare or two since they're relatively cheap and take a while to get replacements though.

There are two different ones I ended up ordering. This one:
CWX series 1/2'' NPT SS304 valve,12VDC,CR04 normal closed type electric valve.

and this one:
http://www.tf-valvefittings.com/goods-125.html

The main difference is that the CWX doesn't have a position indicator.

 

[packet]

If you really wanted to heat as well you could use a BCS 462 instead and then be able to heat a cool since it has 8 temperature inputs and can control 18 outputs. Another option would be to use their Digi16 expansion card along with the 460 since it will add 12 additional outputs and 4 inputs.

Actually, the BCS-462 has the same limitation as the 460 with limiting probes associated to outputs. I raised the issue with the company that makes it but they didn't seem to think it was a problem (idiotic if you ask me). So, the only way around it is with some programming.

 

[packet]

So I am in the process of mimicking your build. I would like to double it though. Which of the components, especially in the BCS portion need to be doubled up? I have already purchased the BCS-462 to allow me temp inputs for 6 conicals, just curious about what would actually require doubling the parts. Thanks!!

For the BCS, you'd need extra outputs for the ball vales. Other than that, everything else should stay the same. You might want to consider a larger reservoir, but the AC unit should be able to handle the added load.

I'd doublecheck with the people that make the BCS about how many probes can associate with outputs though. There's a hard limit that may limit how many conicals you can have under a single BCS.

 

[TrickyDick]

Thanks for the help!

I have begun getting some parts in, but I need to wait now until the frame is completed, and I am told the welder is backed up with work. Once the frame is done, I'm going to order the bulk of the parts. For now just going to nab some of those valves from China.

TD

 

[TrickyDick]

Thanks for the info on the valves.

So you really need three valves, one for each of the conicals. Seems having an indicator would be handy, so I think I'm just going to get all three with indicator.
Some look like they work with a range of different voltages, but I think ill just pick the one that uses 12 V. I'll buy 1-2 extra just in case.

Thanks again.

TD

 

[packet]

Thanks for the info on the valves.

So you really need three valves, one for each of the conicals. Seems having an indicator would be handy, so I think I'm just going to get all three with indicator.
Some look like they work with a range of different voltages, but I think ill just pick the one that uses 12 V. I'll buy 1-2 extra just in case.

Thanks again.

TD

I'd buy the one that works on a voltage range. Believe me, the voltages can be over a rather large range and it's nice to not have to deal with an issue of a ball valve that won't work because you're supplying 10.5V instead of the 12V it wants.

 

[TrickyDick]

I'd buy the one that works on a voltage range. Believe me, the voltages can be over a rather large range and it's nice to not have to deal with an issue of a ball valve that won't work because you're supplying 10.5V instead of the 12V it wants.

How did you end up ordering on their website? The shipping and address options seems strange, unlike most domestic websites. It won't let me pick my city from the drop down menu, so I just put my entire address on the address field.
Just curious if you had any issues. Did you use DHL?

TD

 

[packet]

How did you end up ordering on their website? The shipping and address options seems strange, unlike most domestic websites. It won't let me pick my city from the drop down menu, so I just put my entire address on the address field.
Just curious if you had any issues. Did you use DHL?

TD

Yeah it's a bit of a weird process. I just put in my address info and sent them the payment via paypal. They contacted me the next day and the valves showed up a couple weeks later. The valves are made to order so it takes them a few days to make them.

 

[TrickyDick]

Yeah it's a bit of a weird process. I just put in my address info and sent them the payment via paypal. They contacted me the next day and the valves showed up a couple weeks later. The valves are made to order so it takes them a few days to make them.

Well they now have my money so I'll keep my fingers crossed..

TD

 

[packet]

I ordered from them twice and didn't have any issues. I'm sure you'll be fine.

 

[TrickyDick]

Thermometers are directly from brewershardware: http://www.brewershardware.com/BCS-460-Temperature-Sensors/ No real issues with the valves other than one being DOA. I'd order a spare or two since they're relatively cheap and take a while to get replacements though. There are two different ones I ended up ordering. This one: CWX series 1/2'' NPT SS304 valve,12VDC,CR04 normal closed type electric valve. and this one: http://www.tf-valvefittings.com/goods-125.html The main difference is that the CWX doesn't have a position indicator.

Ok the valves are en route.

The thermowells and thermometers from brewers hardware. Can you clarify which specific part numbers you used? I don't think I could find. It might be explained in the website write up for the conicals I suppose, but thought I ask. I think I read 12" thermowells?

Slowly but surely the parts are coming in, though I've yet to order the real expensive stuff. Hopefully the stand will be finished by end of the year. I'll need to buy the tanks for final cutting of the metal plate they will fit into. After the new year I will probably get into the expensive components and SS fittings. This is an expensive build for sure, but still far less expensive than glycol jackets SS fermenters. And if one tank goes bad, scratched, they only cost $60 each, plus the elbow grease needed to swap out all the fittings.

TD

 

[packet]

Ok the valves are en route.

The thermowells and thermometers from brewers hardware. Can you clarify which specific part numbers you used? I don't think I could find. It might be explained in the website write up for the conicals I suppose, but thought I ask. I think I read 12" thermowells?

Slowly but surely the parts are coming in, though I've yet to order the real expensive stuff. Hopefully the stand will be finished by end of the year. I'll need to buy the tanks for final cutting of the metal plate they will fit into. After the new year I will probably get into the expensive components and SS fittings. This is an expensive build for sure, but still far less expensive than glycol jackets SS fermenters. And if one tank goes bad, scratched, they only cost $60 each, plus the elbow grease needed to swap out all the fittings.

TD

I use 12" thermowell for the glycol reservoir (just drilled a hole in the lid and stuck the thermowell through). I had tried to go in through the side (below the water line) and it leaks. even with a weldless fitting, the side of the cooler bends too easily to get a decent seal.

These are the ones I used in the conicals:
http://www.brewershardware.com/6-Weldless-Thermowell.html

Parts numbers and links for all of that should be on the website.

 

[TrickyDick]

I use 12" thermowell for the glycol reservoir (just drilled a hole in the lid and stuck the thermowell through). I had tried to go in through the side (below the water line) and it leaks. even with a weldless fitting, the side of the cooler bends too easily to get a decent seal. These are the ones I used in the conicals: http://www.brewershardware.com/6-Weldless-Thermowell.html Parts numbers and links for all of that should be on the website.

Gotcha. Thanks. I assume you use the temp probes the same length as the thermocouples. The temp probes weren't on he here.

Thanks

 

[swanronson]

Packet, I have most everything built and put together, now just trying to figure out how the hell to rig up the control enclosure. Would you be able to provide me with a basic set of instructions as to how the components act together and/or how they should all be wired together? Didn't realize how complete my lack of electrical knowledge was until I tried to figure this all out. I greatly appreciate it.

P.s.- I am doing 6 total tanks and using the BCS 462 if that makes any difference. Thanks again

 

[wasitim]

I too have taken the plunge! Doing the ebrewery with 20 gallon Stout Kettles as well as this incredible temp control system. Kettles coming in next week, ebrew stuff all here, conicals here, temp control stuff ordered today. Sectioned off a section of the basement and the build has begun.

The one piece I haven't been able to order is the 8 channel driver board. Looks like it's out of stock quite often? Have you folks been able to order one and/or, is there something different that could be used?

 

[packet]

I too have taken the plunge! Doing the ebrewery with 20 gallon Stout Kettles as well as this incredible temp control system. Kettles coming in next week, ebrew stuff all here, conicals here, temp control stuff ordered today. Sectioned off a section of the basement and the build has begun.

The one piece I haven't been able to order is the 8 channel driver board. Looks like it's out of stock quite often? Have you folks been able to order one and/or, is there something different that could be used?

Send them an email and ask when it'll be back in stock. Same thing happened to me when I had to order a replacement board. Took about 2 weeks to come back in stock.

 

[wasitim]

I'll give them a shout today.

If I didn't get the board, I guess the option is additional ssr's for the ball valves, ey?

 

[packet]

I'll give them a shout today.

If I didn't get the board, I guess the option is additional ssr's for the ball valves, ey?

Pretty much. However, you'll need some pretty low powered SSRs. I had some spare 40A ones that I had lying around from a previous build and building out an electric brewery. Add too many of those and the BCS can't support the voltage required to switch the SSR on. Then nothing works. So, go with a 10A relay in that case.

 

[packet]

So it appears there are at least 5 or 6 of you currently building one of these judging by the wiring diagram requests I've received. I had some time today and have started to put a few of the diagrams up here:

http://plasticconical.com/controller-part-2