cider shine?

[theboot89]

Id like to try my hand at making cider shine but I've been reading and i don't understand the controversy with the methanol. Can i safely make it with out goin blind? If so what's the best method? Please help. Thanks

 

[petie]

Throw away the heads and tails and it should be fine.

 

[wooda2008]

Distilling is not home brewing, and the mods frown on it's being discussed here

 

[theboot89]

I meant to add i want to freeze distill. I don't have a still nor money to buy or make one

 

[theboot89]

Oh. Ok. Where can i be discussed?

 

[wooda2008]

freeze concentrating is a whole other animal. Applejack is the common name for it and a quick search will give you a lot of great threads to read through.

From my personal experience, Applejack is great to sip on, but overindulging gives you a much worse hangover than most anything else. This is the methanol problem. because there isn't a way to remove it, you're going to have to live with it.

For me, the flavor is totally worth it.

 

[theboot89]

Awesome! Thanks! My concern was that i read a thread and someone said you can go blind. Can't afford to go blind.

 

[Unferth]

because there isn't a way to remove it, you're going to have to live with it.

I wonder if there isn't a way. Methenol is easy to get out of shine because it comes off at a lower heating temp than ethanol. I wonder if it would drop out or stay in the solution at different freezing temps. If that was the case, you might be able to rig up a good deep freezer.

Some of you chemistry minded folk oughtta know this stuff.

 

[VincentVega]

I wonder if there isn't a way. Methenol is easy to get out of shine because it comes off at a lower heating temp than ethanol. I wonder if it would drop out or stay in the solution at different freezing temps. If that was the case, you might be able to rig up a good deep freezer.

Some of you chemistry minded folk oughtta know this stuff.

METHANOL:

Boiling point is 148F (64 C)
Melting point is -144F (-98 C)

ETHANOL:

Boiling point is 173F (78 C)
Melting point is -173F (-114 C)


So yeah, if you managed to freeze at about -200F, then your heads would be the ethanol you want, but you wouldnt get any of the apple flavors and leave just the water behind, but you'd be without methanol so it'd be cleaner.

 

[roadymi]

A good clean fermentation should produce minimal if any methanol. When I freeze concentrate I reduce the volume by 1/2. Distilling must reduce the volume by a much larger percentge

 

[LeBreton]

Methanol fears are overblown when it comes to freeze distillation. Like roadymi said, there is minimal methanol in a properly fermented cider. Since freezing only removes the water part of cider, the ratio of ethanol and methanol remains the same. If you drink a cider and it's applejack to the same level of inebriation you will have consumed the exact same amount of methanol.

Fermenting a corn mash at high temps with a turbo yeast will give you orders of magnitude more methanol than you could ever achieve with a cider.

 

[jeepinjeepin]

I see we are dancing a fine line here. Any opinions on how it would affect the applejack to heat it to 148-150 to boil off the methanol leaving the rest of the beverage intact? This should still be completely legal since we wouldn't be capturing the methanol.

 

[samuryan]

The cure for methanol poisoning is ethanol.....so....

 

[petie]

I see we are dancing a fine line here. Any opinions on how it would affect the applejack to heat it to 148-150 to boil off the methanol leaving the rest of the beverage intact? This should still be completely legal since we wouldn't be capturing the methanol.

That's why you throw away the heads and tails.

 

[jeepinjeepin]

That's why you throw away the heads and tails.

I've taken a tour of a distillery. I understand the concept. I'm more curious about how it might affect the flavor and whatnot to heat it just enough to blow off the heads without using a still and distilling down to a spirit.

 

[kaboom133]

Give it a go with a one gallon batch and see. Cider is cheap this time of year.

 

[jeepinjeepin]

Give it a go with a one gallon batch and see. Cider is cheap this time of year.

Well it just so happens that I have a few ounces left from a batch that I froze down. On the stove it goes.

 

[theboot89]

What exactly is heads and tails? Im new to this whole ciderin deal.

 

[jeepinjeepin]

What exactly is heads and tails? Im new to this whole ciderin deal.

Heads and tails have nothing to do with cider and everything to do with distilling. They are the bad alcohols and other chemicals that licensed distilleries removed from a quality spirit.

We are really toeing the line here so don't be surprised if this thread gets closed.

 

[Yooper]

We are really toeing the line here so don't be surprised if this thread gets closed.

Yep.

Our forum rules explicitly state "NO DISTILLATION TALK".

There are other forums for distillation conversations. This forum specifically prohibits it.