Can you intentionally under attenuate a beer?

[MPBeer]

I'm trying to come out of a recipe, a 5~6% stout with huge mouthfeel. I want my beer's FG to be 1.030, but if I do, my ABV go up to 8~9% at least.

I don't have many yeast selection, so I'm going with S-04. I want my attenuation to be 60% rather than 70%, can I do that?

I know low-pitching might help, but heard that makes some ester and I don't want any fruity ester in my stout.

Thanks!



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Also, what is "attenuation"?. I mean, how is that possible for the yeast to just eat 65~90% of the sugar in the beer? Is it like they can't do their work anymore if there are more alcohol than sugar, and the limit for each yeast strains are different? I know pitching yeast more than enough doesn't over-attenuate the beer so.. just wondering

 

[thehaze]

You want an yeast that attenuates low by default. Something like SafAle S-33, Danstar ESB and Danstar Windsor. Mash high at 154.4F/68C and you will get very low attenuation with these yeast, so it's very possible. OG should be 1.075-1.080, but it's kind of weird to build such a high gravity wort to only get 5% worth of alcohol.

! I for one embrace fruity esters, so I don't understand the general concern regarding fruity esters.

 

[Miraculix]

I'm trying to come out of a recipe, a 5~6% stout with huge mouthfeel. I want my beer's FG to be 1.030, but if I do, my ABV go up to 8~9% at least.

I don't have many yeast selection, so I'm going with S-04. I want my attenuation to be 60% rather than 70%, can I do that?

I know low-pitching might help, but heard that makes some ester and I don't want any fruity ester in my stout.

Thanks!



+

Also, what is "attenuation"?. I mean, how is that possible for the yeast to just eat 65~90% of the sugar in the beer? Is it like they can't do their work anymore if there are more alcohol than sugar, and the limit for each yeast strains are different? I know pitching yeast more than enough doesn't over-attenuate the beer so.. just wondering

There are multiple types of sugar in the wort. The longer the sugar, the harder for the yeast to metabolize it. Some yeasts are better in eating longer sugars, some cannot metabolize them at all.

You want one of the later ones, if you look for them to finish fairly quickly and leave some sugar behind.

There are a lot of English strains that cannot utilize maltotriose, you want to look for those. One example, usually easy to get, is lallemand London esb.

 

[RM-MN]

Use the high mash temperature along with malts that are mostly unfermentable sugars. Carapils is one that adds little flavor while adding unfermentalbe sugars.

 

[Miraculix]

Use the high mash temperature along with malts that are mostly unfermentable sugars. Carapils is one that adds little flavor while adding unfermentalbe sugars.

I agree on the mash temperature, but Crystal malt does not give you more unfermentables when mashed together with diastetic malt. The enzymes just chop those Crystal malt sugars into pieces, same way they interact with starch.

You have to steep the Crystal separately to maintain the unfermentability of its sugars, but then some starch will be introduced to the beer, as almost no Crystal is fully converted into sugars.

 

[Lefou]

Aha, someone wants a beer with a heavier, sweet perception
It can be done but the ingredients, mashing, and yeast must be chosen wisely.

Select less diastatic base malt (pale ale), light or dark crystals and Caramunich, and add caramelized dark sugar. Mash in the higher temperature range for a slightly extended time, and use a yeast with lower attenuation levels. Bittering should be done with low alpha hops and the bitterness ratio should be around .4 to .5 (hops to malt, perceived bitterness level).
Robust porters, sweet stouts, and holiday ales, or Belgian tripels or strongs done without using higher attenuating yeasts would be good examples of style ... but if you want lower ABV beers around 6%, it can be done as well by choosing the right ingredients.

 

[Lefou]

I for one embrace fruity esters, so I don't understand the general concern regarding fruity esters.

I like heavy, fragrant tasty ales as much as light, dry, well-carbed Pils or blondes. It just depends on the style and personal taste.

 

[Miraculix]

Or one very easy way would be adding lactose, as most brewers yeast cannot metabolize this sugar.

 

[MPBeer]

Thanks for the tips everybody! Was just thinking of using lots of oats, flaked barley, mash at 69", boil long but will definitely try using lactose and other malts. Also, never knew steeping malts causes difference from just mashing them. That's very interesting...

 

[Lefou]

Your steeping malts should not be added to the mash.
Miraculix is right, do them apart and add after mashing to the boil kettle. This way enzymes will not convert most of the complex sugars.

 

[deepbluegroove]

be careful if you are bottling since if the yeast are not done with the beer and you have a high gravity that isn't "done" the yeast will continue to chomp on it after bottling and you thus risk bottle bombs. So make sure the yeast you choose have lower attenuation.

 

[Miraculix]

Thanks for the tips everybody! Was just thinking of using lots of oats, flaked barley, mash at 69", boil long but will definitely try using lactose and other malts. Also, never knew steeping malts causes difference from just mashing them. That's very interesting...

I just ran some experiments on the effect of flaked barley and flaked oats on the beer. I did a smash with a very pale malt 1.045 OG and a bit of centennial hop to get about 20 IBUs.

I then made two similar batches but replaced 30% of the base malt with oats and the other one with flaked barley.

The impact was really not huge. Almost no change in flavour, the oats gave the beer a LITTLE bit of thicker mouthfeel and the flaked barley actually seems to do nothing at all compared to the pure basemalt version. What both adjunct beers have in common is the hazyness, I didn't do a beta glucan rest.

One thing noticable, the oat version was much quicker to ferment and stronger. Oats boost yeast health! But the head retention suffered a bit...

 

[Iseneye]

Your other option, if you are kegging, is to crash cool at your target gravity and then transfer to keg. Then keep it at serving temperature for the life of the keg. FG of 1.03 sounds awful though.

 

[MPBeer]

I just ran some experiments on the effect of flaked barley and flaked oats on the beer. I did a smash with a very pale malt 1.045 OG and a bit of centennial hop to get about 20 IBUs.

I then made two similar batches but replaced 30% of the base malt with oats and the other one with flaked barley.

The impact was really not huge. Almost no change in flavour, the oats gave the beer a LITTLE bit of thicker mouthfeel and the flaked barley actually seems to do nothing at all compared to the pure basemalt version. What both adjunct beers have in common is the hazyness, I didn't do a beta glucan rest.

One thing noticable, the oat version was much quicker to ferment and stronger. Oats boost yeast health! But the head retention suffered a bit...

That's interesting... I don't really care about head retention since most of the beers these days seems to not care it either. I will use some oat then! How did you use your oat? Did you put it with the main mash? Or at the end of the mash?

 

[Miraculix]

That's interesting... I don't really care about head retention since most of the beers these days seems to not care it either. I will use some oat then! How did you use your oat? Did you put it with the main mash? Or at the end of the mash?

You have to make sure that you have flaked oats and not the steel cut oat version. Minute oats or quick porridge oats are the ones you want to use. And than just throw them in the mash with all the rest of the grains. I intentionally went very high with the amount of oats to see what happens. In a normal beer I would use something between 10 and 20 percent.

I would also up your planned mash temperature to 72 c, as this is the optimum temperature for alpha Amylase activity. Also beta Amylase is denatured at this temperature really quickly which is basically what you want. Lots of alpha activity and very little beta activity.