Belgian Tripel Concerns

[thomasgorff]

Hey everybody. This is going to be my first attempt with the style and was wondering if anybody had any input. The following is what I came up with.....
14lbs Weyermann bohemial pilsner
1lb weyermann's light munich
1/2lb rice hulls
3lbs belgian soft candi sugar- blond

2oz Czech Saaz @ 60 mins
.5oz German Magnum @60 mins
.5oz Hallertau @ 60 mins
.5oz Hallertau @ 30 mins
2oz US Saaz @ 30 mins

Wyeast Trappist High Gravity (3787)

I used beercalculus to formulate and gives me an OG of 1.088, a FG of 1.021 and 39 IBU's.
I want to lower the FG to around 1.014 or lower. Also, I am worried about the Hop bill, specifically the magnum hops. I have read something about using champagne yeast in these beers to get that fg down. If anyone has any suggestions or experience with that technique or ideas about timing (end of fermentation or before bottling, etc) Thanks in advance!

 

[Pie_Man]

Looks pretty good, here's a few suggestions/comments:

1. Most Tripels use sugar for about 20% of the fermentables. I've heard plain old white table sugar works just fine, but that's up to you. This increases your OG, but since the sugars all fully fermentable, decreases the FG giving you a dryer finish. I've not used beer calculus, but I wonder if that program is calculating this correctly.
2. 39 IBUs should be fine, just be careful with using the high alpha acid Magnum hops. You could use more of the Saaz and/or Hallertau in place of the magnum.
3. The Munich malt should be fine. Wheat and Vienna would also work, about 10% of the grain bill.
4. For the yeast, you're going to have to make a decent starter. I'd use a pitching rate calculator like mrmalty.com. I'd start the fermentation on the cooler side for a day or so to avoid fusel alcohols and then let the temperature rise over the next few days. Definitely don't rush the fermentation on this one, you'll want to give the yeast enough time to ferment the sugars and clean up the flavors.
5. Mash for fermentability, if you're doing a single infusion, probably a mash temp of 148-150 for 60 minutes.
6. Probably don't need the rice hulls, but they won't hurt anything.
7. I'd do a 90 minute boil due to the Pilsner malt to boil off DMS precursor stuff.

Anyway, I hope this helps. I don't claim to be an expert on brewing Tripels, but I thought I'd try to help. BYO magazine actually just had a good article on Tripels in the last issue which I recently read, and used as a reference here. Good luck, I love the Belgian beers!

 

[ChessRockwell]

Hopville's beer calculus does NOT calculate FG correctly when you've included any simple sugars, it treats them just like malt extract. You should end up a lot lower than 1.021 with 3lbs sugar. Probably lower than 1.014 with 3lbs, but I didn't do the math... To get a more accurate estimate just delete the 3lbs sugar from beer calculus and see what the FG estimate is then, should be about right.

edit: My tripel I did recently went from 1.089 to 1.013 with only two pounds of sugar, which comes out to 10.1% abv (a little more than I had expected). With 3lbs sugar in yours, it's likely to go even drier than 1.013 which puts you kind of more in "quad" territory as far as abv. Of course yours is all grain and mine was extract so you have more variables, most importantly mash temp. If you're mashing low, you might not need quite as much simple sugar or you risk ending up with a much higher abv than you planned for (which might be fine, just high for the style like I said). Just something to think about!

 

[beergolf]

Looks pretty good.

You IBU's are just a little high. Get the BU:GU ratio to about .37.

One trick to get a Tripel to finish a little lower is to add the sugar after fermentation slows. Mix the sugar with some water to make a syrup, boil it up, cool and add to the fermenter after fermentation slows. The theory of this is that the yeast can eat the more complex sugars of the wort then work on the simple sugar after the main part of fermentation is over. I find I get a few extra points of attenuation doing this.

I like to pitch the yeast on the low side (mid 60's) and then hold it there for a couple of days and then let it ramp up. Give the yeast plenty of time to work. Belgian yeasts can take their time getting the last few points of attenuation. I usually let them ferment for about 6 weeks.

Here is a good quote from Brew like a Monk. " let the fermentation finish, perhaps at a higher temperature. It can take as long to get the last few points of attenuation as it did for the first 80%."

Lastly, after you bottle, set some aside to age. You will be amazed at just how much they wuill change with some age.

 

[thomasgorff]

thanks beergolf for the suggestions about IBU's I knew it was approaching to high for style (as is OG). Also, you believe it would help my attenuation to add the candi syrup towards the end of fermentation? If its a syrup would it be necessary to even add more water or could I just dump it in? Pie Man, I know the rice hulls arent necessary but I find they help my worst flow so I always keep a little in. Good looks on the lower mash temp. If any body has any more tips, maybe on how long to keep in secondary or bottle conditioning im open to hear it. Thanks guys!

 

[Denny]

First, ignore any prediction of FG made by any software. There are a lot of variables that software can't take into account. For maximum fermentability, mash at 146-148 for 90 min.

 

[chuckstout]

Make a good size starter and that should help bring the gravity down, mine ended up fermenting lower then i thought it would from 1.088 to 1.009 5G batch 1L starter at 1.070

I now wish i would have mashed at 153 instead of 151. I used WLP500 which i think is sumwhat similar

Good luck

 

[thomasgorff]

any problems with bottle carbing this big of a beer?

 

[Denny]

any problems with bottle carbing this big of a beer?

Couldn't hurt to add a little yeast at bottling.

 

[mojo_wire]

No problems with bottle carbing except it will take longer than usual. figure on at least 2 months, probably 3. But that's a style that ages really well, so letting it sit 6 months is a good idea anyway.

I did a tripel last summer that I accidentally overcarbed. I now realize I was shooting for the higher range cabonation of the style, but overestimated my yield (out of a 5 gallon batch I probably got 4.5 gallons, but carbed for 5). After 3 weeks the beer was awesome but after 6 weeks started foaming severely every time a bottle was opened.

So dont overdo the sugar and have patience. But many great Belgians are battle conditioned. Go with the flow.

 

[thomasgorff]

this is all great information thank you guys so much. One more question about fermentation.... What is the length of time for primary fermentation? Secondary? Is it worth it to take the beer of the trub from primary and use a secondary?

 

[beergolf]

this is all great information thank you guys so much. One more question about fermentation.... What is the length of time for primary fermentation? Secondary? Is it worth it to take the beer of the trub from primary and use a secondary?

I usually go about 6 weeks in the primary. I very rarely use a secondary, but others do, so there is no one way to do things. Just make sure it is finished, Belgian yeast can fool you and keep working for a lot longer than you think. 3787 is a great yeast and it will make a great tripel.

Be sure to let some age. Belgians really do change with time. I am drinking one that has been bottled for 9 months. It was very good at 2, but it is really good now..... I may just have another, even though it it almost 10%