Safbrew WB-06 for a Belgian Golden Strong ale

[Mark yeah]

So according to all conventional wisdom, this yeast is a close relative of Wyeast 1388/WLP-570 (the Duvel yeast strain), yet Fermentis advertises it as a Hefeweizen strain. One thing's for sure, it certainly garners its fair share of divided opinions. Detractors site its high attenuation, phenol/ester profile and insipid mouthfeel as completely unsuited to the style. Supporters (all 2 of them) site its convenience and the fact that supposedly "more commercial breweries that you realise" use it.

Despite all this, no one seems to have bothered brewing a Duvel clone with it to see if we can find a home in our hearts for this poor, unloved yeast. Recently, a homebrew store was offering this for $2.95 in my local currency (about a buck fiddy in USD), so I decided to blast out a dirty Belgian in the Golden Strong style.

It's a pretty simple grist, and closely follows the Duvel model. 85% Pilsner malt, 15% dextrose, 30IBUs and some Saaz for aroma and flavour. Ferment from 17C to 27C (62F to 80F) until terminal gravity, lager at 0C (32F) for 3 weeks, carbonate to 4.3 volumes at 24C (75F) for 2 weeks, then condition at 4-5C (40F) for 6 weeks.

I'm getting near the end of primary fermentation, and will post updates as they come in.

EDIT: Here's the full recipe:


Up Front Belgian Can't
Belgian Golden Strong Ale

8.5% / 16.7 °P
All Grain

Batch Volume: 22 L
Boil Time: 60 min
Original Gravity: 1.069
Final Gravity: 1.006
IBU (Tinseth): 31
Color: 6.9 EBC


Mash
High-Yield Mash — 63 °C — 30 min
Mid Mash — 67 °C — 15 min
Final Mash — 70 °C — 15 min
Mash Out — 76 °C — 15 min


Malts (5 kg)
5 kg (83.3%) — Gladfield Malt Gladfield German Pilsener Malt — Grain — 4 EBC
Other (1 kg)
1 kg (16.7%) — NZ Starch Limited Gladfield - Dextrose Sugar — Sugar — 0 EBC

Hops (45 g)
20 g (30 IBU) — Sticklebract 13.5% — Boil — 60 min
25 g (2 IBU) — Saaz 4.5% — Aroma — 20 min hopstand
Hopstand at 80 °C


Yeast
1 pkg — Fermentis WB-06 Safbrew Wheat 86%
Fermentation
Primary — 17-27 °C — 10 days


Carbonation: 4 CO2-vol
Water Profile
Ca2+ 61 Mg2+ 13 Na+ 34 Cl- 76 SO42- 76 HCO3- 120

 

[chthon]

Feedback from the Flemish, Dutch and UK homebrew forums all indicate that one indeed should not use WB-06 for hefeweizen.

And it is not according to conventional wisdom, but people have done real DNA analyses of all three yeasts:

 

[Miraculix]

To me, it's a witt yeast.

 

[dmtaylor]

To me, it's a witt yeast.

You're not wrong, it's probably very good for witbier.

 

[thehaze]

I've used WB-06 a few times, and I don't dislike it as an yeast. The issues come up when used for styles that do not match its profile. High attenuation, diastaticus, which is fine, but it's got a bit of weird tartness, which I'm not fond of. It's not a Hefe yeast. Could work for a Wit, but due to its attenuation and tartness, beer can turn up weird. I've co-pitched it with other yeast and it works much better. T-58, Lallemand Abbaye work fine with it - my experience is limited to light coloured beers. I wouldn't use it in anything red, brown, quad/dark strong, etc.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

It's also worth noting that the one time I used WB-06, in a beer with something like 6g/l of Chinook with a bit of Amarillo, it completely trashed the hop flavour. Not just a bit of interesting complexity from biotransformation like you get with T-58, no it was completely trashed. Maybe it doesn't do that with other hops, but it's something to bear in mind.

I kinda take the view that there's plenty of better dry yeasts out there for almost every style, so why use it for anything other than Duvel-alikes?

 

[CascadesBrewer]

I'm getting near the end of primary fermentation, and will post updates as they come in.

I am curious how this will turn out. Your fermentation schedule looks very close to what is listed for Duvel in "Brew like a Monk."

I only used WB-06 one time in a Belgian Blond that was split with Lallemand Abbaye. The Abbey batch was very good. The WB-06 one had a tart apple character that I did not care for. Maybe it was something with my process or fermentation, but it did not make me excited to try it again.

 

[thehaze]

I am curious how this will turn out. Your fermentation schedule looks very close to what is listed for Duvel in "Brew like a Monk."

I only used WB-06 one time in a Belgian Blond that was split with Lallemand Abbaye. The Abbey batch was very good. The WB-06 one had a tart apple character that I did not care for. Maybe it was something with my process or fermentation, but it did not make me excited to try it again.

The tartness is a staple for WB-06... You can't really avoid it, as it is one of this yeasts' particular traits.

 

[Protos]

Subscribed to the thread.
Reading all those bad reviews and genetics researches I didn't even bother to try this yeast (although I'm aiming to try each and every dry beer yeast available to me). The only style I'd use WB-06 for is a Duvel clone but I fail to find any reports in the interwebz on cloning Duvel with it. Now there's a hope.

 

[GoodTruble]

Feedback from the Flemish, Dutch and UK homebrew forums all indicate that one indeed should not use WB-06 for hefeweizen.

And it is not according to conventional wisdom, but people have done real DNA analyses of all three yeasts:

View attachment 791946

What is the source for that graphic/image?

 

[Mark yeah]

I am curious how this will turn out. Your fermentation schedule looks very close to what is listed for Duvel in "Brew like a Monk."

I only used WB-06 one time in a Belgian Blond that was split with Lallemand Abbaye. The Abbey batch was very good. The WB-06 one had a tart apple character that I did not care for. Maybe it was something with my process or fermentation, but it did not make me excited to try it again.

I watched your video review on yt, it's actually partly what inspired me to try this.
Wyeast 1388 is described as having "a well attenuated dry, tart finish" according to their website, so perhaps there's hope for wb06.

 

[Mark yeah]

Subscribed to the thread.
Reading all those bad reviews and genetics researches I didn't even bother to try this yeast (although I'm aiming to try each and every dry beer yeast available to me). The only style I'd use WB-06 for is a Duvel clone but I fail to find any reports in the interwebz on cloning Duvel with it. Now there's a hope.

It seems no one's bothered to try it, but the yeast was so cheap I couldn't resist giving it a go.

 

[Protos]

That's a great experiment, actually. A practical research on whether this yeast is really a dry Duvel strain, as the geneticists suggested.
If it is, I'm buying the yeast immediately to make a Duvel. Please keep us informed!

I've tried to clone this beer 2 or 3 times already, all with M41, all turned out very good beers, though far from identical to the original.

(I don't label my clones "Duvel" however, using instead the first original name of the brand, Victory Ale, as I try to avoid keeping any satanic-themed things in my house )

 

[dmtaylor]

What is the source for that graphic/image?

https://beer.suregork.com/?p=4112

 

[chthon]

What is the source for that graphic/image?

https://beer.suregork.com/?p=4112

 

[chthon]

That's a great experiment, actually. A practical research on whether this yeast is really a dry Duvel strain, as the geneticists suggested.
If it is, I'm buying the yeast immediately to make a Duvel. Please keep us informed!

I've tried to clone this beer 2 or 3 times already, all with M41, all turned out very good beers, though far from identical to the original.

(I don't label my clones "Duvel" however, using instead the first original name of the brand, Victory Ale, as I try to avoid keeping any satanic-themed things in my house )

I called mine "Highway to Hell" (also with M41), with part of the cover of the album of the same title as label.

 

[Mark yeah]

It's been 5 days in primary and the temp is up to 27C (80F), so I've taken a hydro sample. It's certainly slowed down a lot, although there's clearly activity going on. Ideally I'd like it to chew through another 10 gravity points, hopefully the yeast is up to the task! Fermentis lists its alcohol tolerance at only 9-11%, so my biggest concern is it stalling leaving an overly sweet beer. I've always found 1388 a slow finisher, so maybe it's just behaving to type.

 

[Franktalk]

Subscribed!

 

[thehaze]

It's been 5 days in primary and the temp is up to 27C (80F), so I've taken a hydro sample. It's certainly slowed down a lot, although there's clearly activity going on. Ideally I'd like it to chew through another 10 gravity points, hopefully the yeast is up to the task! Fermentis lists its alcohol tolerance at only 9-11%, so my biggest concern is it stalling leaving an overly sweet beer. I've always found 1388 a slow finisher, so maybe it's just behaving to type.

Is that 1.016? I can't really tell from the colour scheme on your hydrometer. Anyway, WB-06 will go way under 1.010 with ease in any recipe. Yours is base malt and 15% dextrose, which means it will probably go as low as 1.002-1.003. Cheers!

 

[Mark yeah]

Is that 1.016? I can't really tell from the colour scheme on your hydrometer. Anyway, WB-06 will go way under 1.010 with ease in any recipe. Yours is base malt and 15% dextrose, which means it will probably go as low as 1.002-1.003. Cheers!

Yep, 1.016. In the hours since that photo was taken it's come down 2-3 grav points so it's still very much working. The only thing I'm really worried about is the stated alcohol tolerance of the yeast, but who knows how accurate Fermentis's stats are?

 

[thehaze]

Yep, 1.016. In the hours since that photo was taken it's come down 2-3 grav points so it's still very much working. The only thing I'm really worried about is the stated alcohol tolerance of the yeast, but who knows how accurate Fermentis's stats are?

I think WB-06 will easily hit 10% and also carbonate in bottles without any additional yeast. It's a real hardy yeast, and I think 10-11% will not be a problem for it. I'm not able to find out what's the OG the beer you're currently fermenting?

 

[VikeMan]

Is that 1.016? I can't really tell from the colour scheme on your hydrometer. Anyway, WB-06 will go way under 1.010 with ease in any recipe. Yours is base malt and 15% dextrose, which means it will probably go as low as 1.002-1.003. Cheers!

I'm puzzled by these statements, particularly about "any recipe." For any given wort's fermentability, WB-06 should attenuate to a fairly predictable percentage. Let's say, just for the sake of illustration, that with a 100% pilsner grain bill, mashed at 150F for one hour, that we can expect about 85% apparent attenuation with WB-06. (I completely made up those numbers, but the concept is valid and proven. See Greg Doss' and Kai Troester's experiments.)

Let's also say that we have two batches of this 100% pilsner wort, one with an OG of 1.090 and one with an OG of 1.040:

1.090 with apparent attenuation of 85% ---> 1.014
1.040 with apparent attenution of 85% ---> 1.006

My point is that we can't really say that any yeast strain always goes lower than some particular FG, because OG matters.

TLDR: We have to consider OG when predicting FG.

 

[Drewch]

I've never used WB-06 in anything that high gravity, but I can second the report of tartness ... almost made more of a pseudo-gose when I used it.

It's also STA+ ... so be sure it's really done before you try to bottle condition with it.

 

[Mark yeah]

OG was 1.070, I'll edit the original post sometime with more details.
Grav sample is down to 1.009 now and still working, so no matter what happens from here I'll have something drinkable.

 

[Zambezi Special]

Following
Wouldn't mind a nice duvel right now

 

[HM-2]

I reckon WB-06 would work nicely as a co-pitch with Brett Brux, where the tartness can play nice with the funk.

 

[Mark yeah]

I reckon WB-06 would work nicely as a co-pitch with Brett Brux, where the tartness can play nice with the funk.

Well if this beer sucks I might try something like that

 

[Pie11]

Wb-06 is wit yeast, but is far from great.
It not has the right aroma balance, between clover and banana, needed for wit bier.
Lallemand wit is a very good yeast for wit.

Wb-06 It's not fitted at all for a duvel clone that need an fruity profile with pepper note.
I never found a dry yeast adapted for this type of beer.
Wb 06 is also not enought dry.
Wlp 545 is probably the original yeast. Wyeast ardenne (achouffe) is also ok.
A fruity dry scotch yeast can fit for a duvel clone, but it will be less spicy.
you can also breed form a fresh duvel bottle.

 

[Mark yeah]

Wb-06 is wit yeast, but is far from great.
It not has the right aroma balance, between clover and banana, needed for wit bier.
Lallemand wit is a very good yeast for wit.

Wb-06 It's not fitted at all for a duvel clone that need an fruity profile with pepper note.
I never found a dry yeast adapted for this type of beer.
Wb 06 is also not enought dry.
Wlp 545 is probably the original yeast. Wyeast ardenne (achouffe) is also ok.
A fruity dry scotch yeast can fit for a duvel clone, but it will be less spicy.
you can also breed form a fresh duvel bottle.

WB-06 is actually a highly attenuative yeast, so no issues there I hope. I have no idea what sort of esters and phenols it will throw out in a higher grav beer using the Duvel fermentation schedule, so wait and see I suppose. Its tartness does seem to match up with the Duvel strain, so that's one thing in its favour.

According to internet wisdom, the Duvel strain is not WLP-545, but WLP-570 (or Wyeast 1388). There seems to be a strong genetic similarity between these yeasts and WB-06, hence this experiment.

 

[Pie11]

Sorry, wlp 545 is still achouffe, the duvel strain is wlp570.
I never noticed tartness with wb06. For me is too clean for wit beer.
The duvel strain was selectionated and breeded form an mcewan's bottle. It's a scottish yeast. This fruity characters it's common in wee heavy and other british beer (and also some belgian beer that use british yeast as achel). If it's cousin with wb06, I unterstand why the second is not fitted at all for wit beer.

For my experience, wb06 is a lot more sweet than duvel or achouffe strain, that are really dry.

 

[VikeMan]

Wb-06 is wit yeast, but is far from great.
It not has the right aroma balance, between clover and banana, needed for wit bier.

I think you'll find that most people on this forum (and in this thread), when they say "wit" they mean Belgian Witbier. Clove and banana are characteristics of German Hefeweizen, but are not really typical in a Belgian Wit.

 

[Pie11]

The original document not listed yeast origins. I'm not sure that alla are well decoded.
We known by duvel history that duvel strain is a son of mcewan's (wlp028) that exactly in the opposite side of the graf

 

[Pie11]

I think you'll find that most people on this forum (and in this thread), when they say "wit" they mean Belgian Witbier. Clove and banana are characteristics of German Hefeweizen, but are not really typical in a Belgian Wit.

Witbier (hoegarden) is base on an subtle balance aroma beetween clover, orange, coriander, english hop... all based on a fermented wheat acid flavour.
Hefeweizen have a more bold clover aroma.
You can't do a decent wit without the right yeast profile, that include a gentle clover and banana.

 

[dwhite60]

Thinking I had an S-04 in the fridge I proceeded to brew a stout. Pulled out that packet, and surprise surprise, it was WB-06. Had no choice but to use it.

I keep meaning to make it again. Was real interesting in a good way.

 

[dmtaylor]

I don't like my witbiers tasting like banana.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

The original document not listed yeast origins. I'm not sure that alla are well decoded.
We known by duvel history that duvel strain is a son of mcewan's (wlp028) that exactly in the opposite side of the graf

Don't think like that.

WLP028 may have come from McEwans, or maybe not, we don't know. But even if it did, then WLP028 is a great, great, great.......grandchild of one of the 10-20 strains in the original McEwan yeast, and if you believe the origin story for Duvel, then the two yeasts used by Duvel are also descendants of two of the 10-20 strains in the original McEwan yeast - but mathematics alone would suggest that they're unlikely to be the same ones. And basic knowledge of the character of WLP028 would tell you that it's very different to Duvel's yeast.

When you're talking about traditional British yeasts, you have to remember that they are complex blends of 10+ strains that have evolved together over decades. Don't think one strain "is" "the yeast" from a particular brewery, you need the blend to get the full character in many cases. And don't think that yeasts stay the same from one generation to the next, let alone over a period of years. The Edinburgh breweries (which include McEwan's) were particularly active in exchanging yeast, so that instead of a "brewery" strain you had more like an "Edinburgh blend" of yeasts.

If you're wanting a fairly authentic source of British yeasts then Brewlab is a much better choice than the US companies. Their Borders yeast allegedly came from McEwan's Fountain brewery in Edinburgh, and sounds far more Duvel-ish than WLP028 :
This Scottish ale yeast has moderate fermentation abilities, prefers low mineral wort and can produce a sulphur flavoured beer. Good ester flavours and phenolic characters are produced. It flocculates moderately well producing a light head initially and cells sediment well at the end of fermentation.

 

[Mark yeah]

Well it's been 10 days, so I've taken a hydro sample and it's stabilised at 1.007, pretty much right where I wanted it. Now begins the 3 week lagering and clearing phase at -1C, then I'll tackle carbonation. So far, so good!
Apologies for the poor quality of the photo

 

[Protos]

10 days? Wow, that's pretty fast.
I leave all my Diastaticus brews in the primary for no less than 21 day, whatever's the fermentation dynamics. I do that after two or three bitter suprises involving "resurrections" in the warmed up bottles.

 

[Zambezi Special]

I didn't realise WB-06 was a diastaticus
Decided I better google it and found quite an interesting article SafAle™ WB-06: Give the character you want to your wheat beer styles (nothing about Belgian Strong though)

 

[Miraculix]

10 days? Wow, that's pretty fast.
I leave all my Diastaticus brews in the primary for no less than 21 day, whatever's the fermentation dynamics. I do that after two or three bitter suprises involving "resurrections" in the warmed up bottles.

Off topic:
Can you please point me to the thread where we discussed low hopped farmhouse Voss beers? You were recommending me one recipe with rye, I bought everything and want to brew it this weekend but forgot where the recipe was.... A bit unfortunate. It was a link to a page with multiple recipes and you were recommending a specific one for Voss, if I remember correctly.