Belgian Trappist Tripple Fermentation temp?

[jhbarc]

I brewed this Belgian Trappist Tripple on 01/10 my OG was 1.074. I pitched the yeast at 70 deg F and had a very vigorous fermentation with in 4 hrs of pitching. The high krausen was approximately 20 hrs after pitching and fermentation has been tappering off since. I have not yet checked the gravity because there is still a full 1" of krausen. The airlock is bubbling at a 10 per minute rate. My temperrature has been consistently in the mid 60's. The yeast I used is WYEAST 3787 the package suggest 64-78 deg F temp. range. I have been at the low temp end of that range through out fermentation. I plan on keeping this brew in the primary till it is ready to bottle. Should I raise the fermintation temp?

INGREDIENTS:
2 lbs. Old Bavarian Munich Blend
6 lbs. light malt extract
1/2 lb. Cara-pils malt
2 lbs. Belgian pilsner malt
1 oz. Hallertauer Tradition hops (bittering)
1 oz. Fuggles hops (flavoring)
1/2 oz. Czech Saaz hops (finishing)
1-1/4 lb. white (or light candy) sugar (end of boil)
1 Smack Pac (WYEAST 3787 Yeast)
1 pkg. Bru-Vigor (yeast food)
2/3 cup white sugar

 

[sjbeerman]

In general, I would pitch at the low end then allow the temperature to gradually increase to help with attenuation. Around 68-72 F shoud produce a good balance. Did you pitch a starter and aerate the wort well?

 

[jhbarc]

I did not pitch a starter (LHBS suggested with the 3787 I would not need a starter) but did aerate the wort very well. In my op I miss typed the OG it was 1.074 not 1.084

 

[maida7]

Always make a starter when using liquid yeast. Check the calculator on mrmalty.com to figure what size starter to make.

3787 is the Westmalle strain of yeast. with this yeast and most Belgians I like to start in the mid 60's and raise the temp slowly to the low 70's over the course of a week. Then hold it in the low to mid 70's until I reach the final gravity and the yeast has fully flocculated.

Starting cool keeps the hot, harsh alcohols at bay. Ending warm allows the yeast to keep working to clean up off flavors and fully attenuate the beer. Belgians need to be fully attenuated, dry, refreshing and drinkable.

PS: That is a whole lot of Munich malt for a triple

 

[jhbarc]

Always make a starter when using liquid yeast. Check the calculator on mrmalty.com to figure what size starter to make.

3787 is the Westmalle strain of yeast. with this yeast and most Belgians I like to start in the mid 60's and raise the temp slowly to the low 70's over the course of a week. Then hold it in the low to mid 70's until I reach the final gravity and the yeast has fully flocculated.

Starting cool keeps the hot, harsh alcohols at bay. Ending warm allows the yeast to keep working to clean up off flavors and fully attenuate the beer. Belgians need to be fully attenuated, dry, refreshing and drinkable.

PS: That is a whole lot of Munich malt for a triple

Being that time travel is not an option and I cant go back and make a starter. What should I do to get the best beer possible? I can slowly raise the temp to the low to mid 70's. will that get the yeast back to work?

 

[maida7]

Being that time travel is not an option and I cant go back and make a starter. What should I do to get the best beer possible? I can slowly raise the temp to the low to mid 70's. will that get the yeast back to work?

Yes absolutely. Raise the temp and swirl the fermenter a bit to get the yeast back into suspension. I'd raise it to 75F. Slowly, like 3-4 degrees each day.

After a week in the mid 70's, you should also take a gravity reading. If it's still too high and your not seeing much airlock activity you should consider pitching a second yeast to finish the job. The second yeast does not need to be a Belgian strain but it does need to be alcohol tolerant, less flocculant and hard working. I find the WLP001 does a good job. Perhaps WLP099 would also work well. You will need to make a starter from liquid yeast and pitch that at high krausen. Pitching non active yeast into half fermented beer usually doesn't work.

 

[jhbarc]

I will get the temp up to the mid 70's over the next few days and chec the gravity a week later. Hopefuly I will not need to re-pitch but will do if needed. Thanks for the advise all.

 

[sjbeerman]

I did not pitch a starter (LHBS suggested with the 3787 I would not need a starter) but did aerate the wort very well. In my op I miss typed the OG it was 1.074 not 1.084

Yes, I know that some LHBS say you don't need a starter but I think most are full of BS. Plus, whether you need a starter or not doesn't really depend on the yeast strain, it depends on the yeast viability and the OG. Higher gravity brews need more cells and require more growth. I have gotten many, many underattenuated brews and I couldn't figure out what was going on. I looked at nearly everything under the sun: temperature, aeration, wort fermentability (extract brews..). BUT then, I finally started making yeast starters and problem solved! Fermentation started in <6 h compared to 12-24 h and attenuation was excellent!!

So, what to do now. Personally, I wouldn't recommend using WLP099 to restart a stuck fermentation, if that happens. I used it recently and while it worked and kept working and working and working, I didn't like the final results. It was drinkable, but that's about it. Plus, I believe 3787 is a high alcohol tolerant yeast. I could be wrong, but I would think pitching a starter with 3787 at high krausen should work. Right now, I would just wait it out and see what happens.

 

[jhbarc]

sjbeerman thank you for your help. Even though I did not pitch a starter I did get a very vigorous fermentation going in about 4 hrs. In the future I will be using starters for all my brews.
I am planning to bring the fermentation temp up to low to mid 70's. I am hopeful that I will get the fermentation going again. Does the fact that I still have a thick krausen mean that tha yeast are still working just impaired by the low temp?

 

[maida7]

sjbeerman thank you for your help. Even though I did not pitch a starter I did get a very vigorous fermentation going in about 4 hrs. In the future I will be using starters for all my brews.
I am planning to bring the fermentation temp up to low to mid 70's. I am hopeful that I will get the fermentation going again. Does the fact that I still have a thick krausen mean that tha yeast are still working just impaired by the low temp?

yeah krausen means you still have lots of co2 being produced from yeast activity. Sounds like your yeast are still in good shape and just boosting the temp may get you to the finish line.

 

[jhbarc]

Update: I swirled the Carboy and started raising the temp and I am seeing more bubbling in the airlock and the krausen has thickened. as of this mornining 06:00 the temp was about 68 deg F. I will continue slowly raising the temperature untill I reach 74. Once at 74 I will let it work for a week and then check the gravity.

 

[jhbarc]

Temp is now holding at 74 deg. F The air lock activity is steady. I took a gravity reading saturday it was 1.033. I will chec the gravity again tonight hopefuly it has started dropping. If gravity is not dropping should I repitch and if so what yeast should I use.

 

[swampdonkeybrew]

i did a rochefort 10 clone, og was 1.09 and the recipe called for 1.11, think my boil taking forever to start caused that. pitched white labs trappist ale yeast and let it go, probably stayed at 66-68 ambient temp, but it hit the target og of 1.021 perfect. sure your beer will be fine.

 

[maida7]

Temp is now holding at 74 deg. F The air lock activity is steady. I took a gravity reading saturday it was 1.033. I will chec the gravity again tonight hopefuly it has started dropping. If gravity is not dropping should I repitch and if so what yeast should I use.

How long has it been in the primary? And do you have a previous reading to compare?

 

[maida7]

i did a rochefort 10 clone, og was 1.09 and the recipe called for 1.11, think my boil taking forever to start caused that. pitched white labs trappist ale yeast and let it go, probably stayed at 66-68 ambient temp, but it hit the target og of 1.021 perfect. sure your beer will be fine.

IMHO finishing at 1.021 is too high for this style. Ideally you get 80-85% attenuation. Starting at 1.090 would have you finishing between 1.018 and 1.013.

 

[swampdonkeybrew]

yeah, i thought so too. but i couldn't taste sweetness when i took the final reading so i'm just gonna roll with it.

 

[jhbarc]

This beer was brewed on 01/10 OG was 1.074. Checked the gravity 01/29 it was 1.033. I will check it tomorrow again to see where it is at.

 

[smokinghole]

I left mine go for a week to get whatever temp it got up around. Then I stuck it in a water bath with an aquarium heater to raise it up to 72ish and held it there for another week or so. Right now it's sitting in my warm closet next to my water heater cleaning out a bit and finishing up a bit more. Last I checked my gravity was close to 1.033. After it's done I'm going to stick it in my garage which is a balmy 30ish degrees for about two weeks.

 

[maida7]

This beer was brewed on 01/10 OG was 1.074. Checked the gravity 01/29 it was 1.033. I will check it tomorrow again to see where it is at.

19 Days and your still at 1.033! I think you have a stuck beer. I'd suggest growing some liquid yeast in a starter and pitching that at high krausen. I'd use wlp001. It's very dependable and attenuates well.

 

[jhbarc]

thanks for the input maida7 I will get the WLP001 and give it a try.

 

[jhbarc]

Well I never got around to repitching a starter of WLP001 and I am glad I waited. I checked the gravity on Wednesday 02/02 and the gravity was down to 1.023. When I checked it this afternoon 02/05 it was right on the Target FG of 1.016. Much to my surprise the sample tasted great! I am glad I was patient and gave the beer a chance to finish. Thanks to maida7 for the advise to raise the temp and swirl the carboy as this seems to have done the trick. The only remaining issue is that the beer still has a lot of suspended yeast and is very cloudy. I am hoping that cold crashing the beer for a few days will remedy this.