American Pale Ale from Brewing Classic Styles?

[rhys333]

Hey everyone,
I'm thinking about brewing JZ and JPs recipe, the one with victory malt and no caramel (recipe below). I always use 5% or so caramel in my pale ales, so this is a bit of a departure for me. Those of you that have brewed this or somethig similar, can I expect it to be very dry with no sweetness? Thanks in advance.

AMERICAN PALE ALE
11.3 lb 2 Row (I'm using maris otter)
0.75 lb Munich
0.5 lb Wheat
0.75 lb Victory
0.66 oz Horizon @ 60; 0.5 oz Centennial & Cascade @ 10 & 0
WY 1056 ( I'm using 1469 with a little sugar to raise attenuation to 75%)

 

[twistyboy]

the wheat is gonna help for body.munich and victory is gonna give you malty flavor. if you want more attenuation , mash lower at 148-152.i would use simcoe or mosaic as dry hop for the APA.

 

[rhys333]

the wheat is gonna help for sweetness.munich and victory is gonna give you body. if you want more attenuation , mash lower at 148-152.i would use simcoe or mosaic as dry hop for the APA.

Yeah, I'm going with magnum bittering and mosaic flavor, aroma and dry-hop. Should be tasty. I'd be okay with the lower 69% attenuation 1469 brings, but I figured I'd dry it out a bit to match the recipe. Perhaps I drop the sugar. Recipe calls for 152F mash.

 

[wardens355]

the wheat is gonna help for sweetness.munich and victory is gonna give you body. if you want more attenuation , mash lower at 148-152.i would use simcoe or mosaic as dry hop for the APA.

Hmm... I usually consider a small wheat addition as a technique for getting a little more body, Munich for getting more malty flavor (maybe a touch of sweetness), and Victory for a slightly toasted nutty/biscuit flavor. I don't really see Munich or Victory as body contributors.

 

[wardens355]

Yeah, I'm going with magnum bittering and mosaic flavor, aroma and dry-hop. Should be tasty. I'd be okay with the lower 69% attenuation 1469 brings, but I figured I'd dry it out a bit to match the recipe. Perhaps I drop the sugar. Recipe calls for 152F mash.

I would drop the sugar and see how it turns out. If you are used to adding Crystal malt, maybe the lower attenuation will keep it from being too dry for your tastes?

 

[rhys333]

I would drop the sugar and see how it turns out. If you are used to adding Crystal malt, maybe the lower attenuation will keep it from being too dry for your tastes?

I think you might be right there. I'm wondering if I should sub carapils for the wheat as well. I find even at low levels with a high flocc-er like 1469, wheat tends to contribute a lot of haze.

 

[wardens355]

I think you might be right there. I'm wondering if I should sub carapils for the wheat as well. I find even at low levels with a high flocc-er like 1469, wheat tends to contribute a lot of haze.

Carapils sounds like a fine sub to me.

 

[Hoosierbrewer]

Marris is going to change the character some. My beers have a bread taste when it use it

 

[twistyboy]

Hmm... I usually consider a small wheat addition as a technique for getting a little more body, Munich for getting more malty flavor (maybe a touch of sweetness), and Victory for a slightly toasted nutty/biscuit flavor. I don't really see Munich or Victory as body contributors.

Dortmund and Munich malts are first kilned at low temperatures before the malt has dried, then the temperature is slowly raised to 210 to 244 °F for Munich malt. This process creates flavor and body-building melanoidins from amino acids and malt sugars.

http://www.bjcp.org/course/Class7Lesson3Malting.php

 

[wardens355]

Dortmund and Munich malts are first kilned at low temperatures before the malt has dried, then the temperature is slowly raised to 210 to 244 °F for Munich malt. This process creates flavor and body-building melanoidins from amino acids and malt sugars.

http://www.bjcp.org/course/Class7Lesson3Malting.php

I brewed a Dunkel with 80% Munich and did not get unusually high body. I would imagine raising mash temp would be much more effective than adding a small addition of Munich. Like a lot of things in brewing, there is conflicting info.

Munich Malt

 

[Yooper]

The recipe, as written, as really good. Especially if you want to see what a good APA without crystal malt is like- it's good!

Wheat helps with head retention (not sweetness), and victory is nice and toasty (to replace crystal malt), and Munich malt has this lovely malty flavor character. It's not particularly full bodied, and in fact many 100% Munich malt beers are low to medium bodied. The Munich malt has malty flavor but not increased body.

There isn't anything sweet in there, however it's not highly bittered so the beer still has a real 'pale ale' flavor without a distinct dryness.

 

[sky4meplease]

The BJCP style guidelines list caramel as being restrained or absent in American Pale Ale for what it's worth.

 

[rhys333]

Thanks for the feedback everyone. I'm going to go ahead with this then. I made invert syrup a couple days ago (fun experiment btw), so I think I'm going to add 1/2 lb of it to raise my attenuation slightly. It'll keep me in the 75% range called for in the recipe and hopefully show me what invert brings to the mix.

 

[ram5ey]

Yeah this was the first pale ale I brewed and it was great. I've since tweaked it a bit by cutting the base with Maris Otter and using more late hooping with Citra and a dry hop. My variation also has done very well in competition,but I really jus brew it because I like it.

 

[twistyboy]

I brewed a Dunkel with 80% Munich and did not get unusually high body. I would imagine raising mash temp would be much more effective than adding a small addition of Munich. Like a lot of things in brewing, there is conflicting info.

Munich Malt

i have to agree with you.We tend to mix body and complexity.

http://www.howtobrew.com/section4/chapter20-1.html
http://www.bjcp.org/course/Class3Lesson1BodyandMouthfeel.php