☕ Coffee ☕: Ingredients, Roasting, Grinding, Brewing, and Tasting

[HarborTownBrewing]

I've been in there a couple times and like it. I enjoyed redline for espresso at home, but not quite as much as some of the black cat blends from Intelligentsia. The greenline is reasonably priced, I might have to order that when i need some espresso blend.

Should anyone ever need such a thing, Metropolis will also do custom labeling of their coffee. My wife and I got married on international coffee day, so we decided to make our table favors freshly roasted coffee. We chose one of their standard coffee offerings and sent them a label design and they sent us 84 1/4lb bags of coffee with our custom label.

That is REALLY cool Metropolis would do that. Neat to see a popular place do something specialized like that.

My first coffee drink was Intelli Black Cat, this was about 4 years ago. The wife and I were shopping for apartments and both exhausted from walking 7 miles that day. Came up on Intelli on Broadway in Chicago's north side, and, out of desperation I suggested we get coffee.

Why out of desperation? Because I didn't drink coffee; couldn't even stand the smell of it.

We walk into the place, and it's a bumpin' cafe filled with metal and wood decor, and people wearing glasses without lenses in them. I order a small somethin-or-other, and they hand me a small glass...like, just a bit bigger than a shot glass. I laugh...hahaha, this can't be for me. Oh, but it is, the wife tells me (she's an aficionado of the specialized beverages).

Hoping to fall in love with it, I take a sip. Ugh. Horrible. Take another. Nope, can't do it. The wife tries it, she loves it. I liked her drink better, so we switched and it was okay. I didn't have another coffee until 8 months later when I got hooked (I picked up long-distance running, and need some caffeine to get through the rest of the days when I was running 16+ miles, so I slowly got turned onto coffee).

So that was my first experience with Black Cat, and I hated it and that place for some reason. A few months ago I reluctantly tried Intelli again for the first time since my first experience, and fell for it for the super acidic, citrus flavors they love to display in their beans. Now they and La Colombe are my favorites.

 

[whoaru99]

Ill probably order at least 2lbs of this. A good colombian is hard to come by, but almost always worth the wait

https://www.sweetmarias.com/store/c...lombia/colombia-timana-la-florida-vereda.html

I spied that stuff the other day and ordered 5lbs. Should be here any day now.

Good Columbian is hard to beat, although I have a soft spot for good Kenya too.

 

[roastquake]

Went to a roaster while I was on the road. They've got the roaster on site at the cafe. Selections were a black and tan malibar or a dark roast Mexican. I happened to stumble across the Malabar yesterday so I opted for the mex. Poor choice. It was only $1.50 for a cup but geez...

Travel.... It can make getting good coffee so difficult ; (

Have you had Monsooned Malabar before? Don't skip over that one next time you see it, one of my favorites. Also, it has an interesting history and process:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monsooned_Malabar

 

[HarborTownBrewing]

Have you had Monsooned Malabar before? Don't skip over that one next time you see it, one of my favorites. Also, it has an interesting history and process:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monsooned_Malabar

Actually I had the Monsooned Malabar a couple days before. Long story short, I figured out where this particular coffee shop gets their green beans (based on their list of coffees and descriptions - they matched perfectly with the supplier). Well I was picking up some coffee from said supplier the other day and he had some Malabar he was going to pitch, so he gave it to me. It was pretty good, although it had been made on a drip pot so it definitely wasn't at it's potential, but pretty good. I talked to the owner about it and he told me a bit about how they get it, and the process and all. Pretty cool stuff.

I'd consider ordering it sometime.

I had a good El Salvador from Intelli today. Very tea like in flavor, and easy to sip.

 

[BrewinHooligan]

Have you had Monsooned Malabar before? Don't skip over that one next time you see it, one of my favorites. Also, it has an interesting history and process:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monsooned_Malabar

Actually been eyeballing this varietal very hard recently at roastcoffeeandteacompany.com. Good price on it and dirt cheap shipping... Sounds like my next order.

 

[HarborTownBrewing]

My first batch of Nicaragua came out so bad I decided to move on and try it again.

Since I had a hard time identifying and slowing down at 1C, I pulled back the roast this time before 1C started, which allowed me to stretch it out (and actually identify it this time). It's definitely more of a subtle popping, not the normal cracking noise you'd hear; it doesn't last long either, on this bean at least (1C lasted about 70 secs on an 8oz batch).

Tried this morning and it's...still young, but much better. Veeeery nice sweetness, and a very curious Caramel flavor unlike any I've had before. Fortunately, it's in the description of the bean so I'm going to assume it's an intentional byproduct of the bean.

It's still short on citrus type flavors, but has a nice level of acidity. I'm hoping in a few days the other flavors will come out, since this roast was only about 12 hrs old.

 

[Chuginator]

Question- for one pound batches, my Behmor reaches 1C between 13 and 16 minutes, depending on the bean and conditions. Is this time typical for a high quality roast, or is it too long? Or can I even ask this question considering that the pros have much larger batch sizes?

 

[HarborTownBrewing]

Question- for one pound batches, my Behmor reaches 1C between 13 and 16 minutes, depending on the bean and conditions. Is this time typical for a high quality roast, or is it too long? Or can I even ask this question considering that the pros have much larger batch sizes?

I've never done a 1lb roast in mine (did 3/4 a few times), but 15 or 16 mins seems like a long time to me. Is that with a preheat?

I preheat until my chamber wall temp reads 150F (about 2 mins), and I get to 1C in about 10:30 - 11:00 with 1/2 lb batches.

For what it's worth, I like how the 1/2 lb batches respond when using the Behmor in manual mode. I had a hard time getting the 3/4 lb batches to act as I wanted them to. Hope some of this helps.

 

[TallDan]

What do you guys use for roast logs? My little booklet from Sweet Maria's is full. Thinking about just using a notebook, keeping it on my computer, looking into software, or getting another booklet from SM.

 

[Chuginator]

I've never done a 1lb roast in mine (did 3/4 a few times), but 15 or 16 mins seems like a long time to me. Is that with a preheat?

I preheat until my chamber wall temp reads 150F (about 2 mins), and I get to 1C in about 10:30 - 11:00 with 1/2 lb batches.

For what it's worth, I like how the 1/2 lb batches respond when using the Behmor in manual mode. I had a hard time getting the 3/4 lb batches to act as I wanted them to. Hope some of this helps.

Thanks. If it's cool (maybe less than 60F) I'll do a preheat for a minute and a half or so, otherwise I don't worry about it. I just didn't know if that kind of time was WAY off (and considered "baked" instead of roasted).

In the back of my mind I'm thinking that I should be getting some larger differences between beans; perhaps it's a mental funk that I'm in, but I've been eyeballing the roast times as a potential candidate for this. Maybe I'll back down to 1/2lb batches and see what happens, or better yet - a 1/2lb batch and a 1lb batch of the same coffee roasted to the same level to see if there's a big enough difference to worry about.

TallDan, for a roast log, I use a spreadsheet; maybe not the best tool, but it works for me. Date, bean, description from vendor, Behmor settings, time to 1C, 2C, and when I hit the "Cool" button, roast level, tasting notes and roasting notes. I've done 82 batches now and it makes it pretty easy when purchasing to see if I'd had it before and what I thought of it. Doing that with a notebook, particularly after hundreds of batches, would prove difficult. Even a simple text file would be better than something in writing.

That said, interestingly enough, I use a hand-written brew log for beer. LOL!

 

[HarborTownBrewing]

I made an Excel doc where I keep notes on each roast (and roaster cleaning), documenting weight, preheat, 1C, 1C End, 2C (if aplicable), etc. I then note the changes I made during the roast (Button P5, then button P3 @10:00 and 270 degrees, etc...). I also note chamber wall temps for 30 second intervals after about 6:00 of roasting, which helps me when I'm trying to replicate roasts (and my voltage can very from 115 - 120 at my place, so this is pretty important for me). Finally, I take notes from each of my brewing/tasting methods.

I have a tab where I keep my favorite profiles for various beans I've roasted. I also have a tab where I note how long of a rest tasted best for my favorite profiles.

Sounds complicated. And I guess it kind of is, but it's been a work in progress and has helped me improve.

 

[HarborTownBrewing]

That said, interestingly enough, I use a hand-written brew log for beer. LOL!

I know what you mean...I had a handwritten log for about 20 batches, because I thought it was nifty. Well guess what, it sucked. So I'm now in the process of transcribing everything to Google Sheets, which is taking a loooong time.

 

[jammin]

If you have instrumentation or a new Hottop, Artisan is an amazing tool for monitoring and logging roasts

https://github.com/MAKOMO/artisan/blob/master/README.md

 

[Chuginator]

If you have instrumentation or a new Hottop, Artisan is an amazing tool for monitoring and logging roasts

https://github.com/MAKOMO/artisan/blob/master/README.md

I remember you mentioning that before, and it looks like something I could have fun with, but the problem at this stage is that I'm just not aware of what an "acceptable" time to hit 1C for a 1lb. batch is. In other words, for me at this stage, any data is useless because it means nothing to me (I don't know what to compare it against). I remember you mentioning before that X amount of time was "baked" instead of roasted, so I'm wanting to make sure that isn't an issue with my Behmor and 1lb batches. I might have to do some research on coffeegeek or some such.

 

[TrickyDick]

Oh crap!
Not ANOTHER project! LOL!
In the midst of an Arduino UNO based dry cure chamber and its not going very well. Plus about 4 other projects in various stages of completion. This is on my list too...

TD

 

[TallDan]

If you have instrumentation or a new Hottop, Artisan is an amazing tool for monitoring and logging roasts

https://github.com/MAKOMO/artisan/blob/master/README.md

I actually downloaded that last night after posting and doing some google searches. I don't have any instrumentation though, and as a roast log it didn't look very useful. Maybe i was missing something?

I kind of figure that I'll just go with a spreadsheet like others have mentioned. Basically use the SM roast notebook fields and what i wrote down for previous batches as a starting point.

I need to roast some decaf for my wife today, so I think i'll start putting the spreadsheet together.

 

[jammin]

^not very useful for "note taking" at all.

My advice to novice roasters looking for useful notes: don't get too caught up in the minutiae. Log warm up times, roaster settings prior to charge. Time to 1C and time from there to finish. Then overall perceived roast level/cupping notes. I've done the paper/pen thing and it can get distracting quickly.

 

[jammin]

Hand ground some coffee from @harbortownbrewing on the Lido 2 this morning.

The aroma has tea and dark berries in the background. HUGE body. Thanks for sharing, HTB!

 

[TrickyDick]

Reading the book by Scott Rao "The Coffee Roaster's Companion" 2014.
Pretty good stuff! Offers a bit of scientific perspective, which I enjoy. It's a short book, but so far I'm enjoying!

Anybody have suggestions on sourcing some green Kona beans during a summer vacation to Hawaii?

TD

 

[jammin]

^kona is a fancy name for Brazilian if you ask me. If you can track down some "Maui Moka", it might be worth it

 

[TrickyDick]

^kona is a fancy name for Brazilian if you ask me. If you can track down some "Maui Moka", it might be worth it

I assume that this would be grown in Maui? I've no interest in buying roasted coffee beans. Need to investigate and research....

TD

 

[jammin]

I assume that this would be grown in Maui? I've no interest in buying roasted coffee beans. Need to investigate and research....

TD

yes. a "cultivar" nearly lost which has gained some fan fair over the last few years. very small beans that boast a reported lovely milk chocolate flavor. i understand they make a KILLER shot of espresso. never roasted them myself.

i'll never pay geisha/90+ prices for over-hyped, low grown Hawaiian coffee. Jamaican Blue Bottle is in the same boat.

These coffee were originally prized waaayyyy back in the day when people wanted "boring" coffee. Due to their non-existent acidity and lack of bold flavors, they got a lot of hype. Marketing had a lot to do with it as well.

 

[TrickyDick]

Thanks for the info on that coffee! I'll try to see what I can find out.

So read most of the book tonight. Some really interesting stuff!
I think this book really tries to apply some science, albeit the recommendations come at the subjective though respected opinion of the author, as to what is best, coupled with non-referenced data about the "best" roasts he's ever tasted.... Well that part was sort of hokey. However, since I'm a noob and he is a professional, I'm going to assume that I'll like the coffee that is made by following his recommendations or commandments as he calls them. There are only three. The downside, is that what seems to be one of the most important commandments, will likely require an electronic and possibly realtime graph of the ROR....
Looks like that artisan mod is coming sooner than I'd wanted. It would seem that making a graph in real time would not be possible otherwise, but I suppose you would be able to set a video camera to record the temp probe readout, and a timer, and then manually enter data points to construct a graph. That's too much work for me though... Seems that you can roughly predict the ROR graph from the bean temp graphs. Seem that mods are inevitable....

The book is not aimed at home roasters, though the concepts mostly translate. The biggest thing I struggle with is the fan speed for controlling airflow. I don't think the advice given translates to home half pound roasters.

TD

 

[jammin]

Artisan show RoR for bean and MET. It was too much for my eyes and mind at first. Now I can't live without it

 

[TrickyDick]

Artisan show RoR for bean and MET. It was too much for my eyes and mind at first. Now I can't live without it

I don't see what MET stands for (mean environmental temp?)

I think I am starting to see some logic in the methods to the madness of roasting: learning how a bean behaves to your input to try and control the ROR and achieve the roast color/weight loss you want. With the graphs, you can easily see how the bean reacts, but you would need to add annotations to it, order to see what you were changing on the roaster to achieve that graph.

So how difficult is it to run artisan on a hottop?
What additional temp probes need to be installed and how?

TD

 

[jammin]

MET = max enviro temp. It can be different things in different systems but it all measures the hottest air the beans can be subject to. My roaster has a probe in the shell where the elements are located. This helps me understand what is being vented to the beans. VERY helpful late in the roast. Can be the difference between a stalled roast and a delicate stretch

Doesn't your HT have a USB port?
https://www.hottopusa.com/news.html

You could probably upgrade if it doesn't.
If not, the rear wall is easily accessible and is a great location to add probes.

 

[TrickyDick]

That's not what my unit looks like. I don't know if it has a USB or not, I suspect not. At least not in the manual.

Edit - I emailed Randy at hottop about this, upgrading...

Edit 2- $460 upgrade kit....

So would that let you directly interface with artisan (running on a ?)
TD

edit 1-well, seems that Artisan can run on a PC/Mac/Linux or some Arduino devices with appropriate hardware. If I get the expensive kit I can natively interface with the HotTop with appropriate software installed. That is pretty cool.

edit 2-So is there a spreadsheet that lets me input time and temp data from a roast to display a ROR graph??

 

[TrickyDick]

So I was told that if I buy the upgrade, that I could sell my take off parts as an upgrade kit, valued at $230 new for at least half that price on certain forums. Anybody know which ones??

I did a manual ROR calculation using temp readings taken at 30 second intervals. Not the best resolution I know. There were two spots where the resolution is probably too low, and shows a rise in ROR, at about 320°, and immediately after 1C begins, which I think is probably bogus. Some flat areas too despite, 100% power, from 3-5.5 minutes. I had bumped fan here due to increasing smoke. Hit 1C just past 7 minute mark. According to book, I should've ejected before 10 minute mark, and would've been better to hit 1C at 8:15 with an 11:00 min dump at 393°. Seems I should've eased a bit off heat sooner. I dropped to 70% at 6 minutes (343°).
Worst was the bump in ROR after then ten minute mark when beans were only at 383.

At least it seems I have an idea what to do to fix....
Trying to do in reverse by analyzing my data is different than on the fly adjustments during roast. I assume that comes with either experience, or using artisan!!
TD

 

[jammin]

Coffeegeek has the largest BST forum for you TD. I'm a long standing member there and would be happy to vouch for you.

Home Barista has a BST forum as well with a more "high end customer base" with less site traffic.

Not sure if you still had a question about RoR, but this is displayed in real time with Artisan.

 

[TrickyDick]

Coffeegeek has the largest BST forum for you TD. I'm a long standing member there and would be happy to vouch for you.

Home Barista has a BST forum as well with a more "high end customer base" with less site traffic.

Not sure if you still had a question about RoR, but this is displayed in real time with Artisan.

Thanks.
I will check out those forums. I'm thinking about getting the hottop kit. It might be costly, but it'll be easier to install with less fear of ruining it. Plus it'll be plug and play with a laptop where I can easily save and display all the graphs rather than try to interface a DIY rig with a computer. Will have to sell the "kit" takeoff parts after.

Seems my pen and paper is showing me I'm making some errors, but too late to notice or adjust. I'd like to see about coming up with a calculator that'll let me put in when 1C begins to advise when to end the roast (book says 75-80% done when you hit 1C, but hints at an even more precise sweet spot within that range). I think even with real time ROR data, once you stall or rise, it's too late already. But at least it would be easier to learn how to correct rather than post roast analysis and review, then try again next time, so I think there is real value to the artisan in getting the most from the beans. It's sort of like learning to photograph on film vs digital in some ways.

TD